Just back from APA NTC - 33rd Place

[UWPoolGod1]

Well my team came in tied for 33rd out of the 676 teams out there in 8ball. We lost our first match and then won 5 straight before finally losing in the early morning on Friday. I played very well, won all my 7 matches vs 5,6,5,6,6,6,3. Only two of the teams had 7s on them and it never worked out that I played them. One match versus a strong 6 I started with 3 BNRs in a row after the lag. Our team played well though, only had to go sudden death once due to long all three starting matches went hill-hill. We kind of got exhausted though having played on consecutive days 8AM, 6PM, 11PM (got to bed at 4AM), 8AM, 6PM, 11PM (ran out of gas with our two 4s losing to their two threes). Missed 8balls is frustrating.

Anyways it was fun. $275 each and I won $400 a the $2/$4 limit holdem tables when I had a chance to play. So free vacation.

Sorry I didn't make it to the Peppermill on Tuesday night. We didn't play Tuesday so I was busy drinkin and playin holdem at the Sahara.

 

[rackmsuckr]

Congratulations, great job!

 

[frankncali]

Great job. I hop you and your teammates had a blast.
My team made it last year and finished 129th. I really want to make it again and avenge a loss I had. I went 4-1 but the one loss hurt really bad.

 

[Cory in DC]

Well my team came in tied for 33rd out of the 676 teams out there in 8ball. We lost our first match and then won 5 straight before finally losing in the early morning on Friday. I played very well, won all my 7 matches vs 5,6,5,6,6,6,3. Only two of the teams had 7s on them and it never worked out that I played them. One match versus a strong 6 I started with 3 BNRs in a row after the lag. Our team played well though, only had to go sudden death once due to long all three starting matches went hill-hill. We kind of got exhausted though having played on consecutive days 8AM, 6PM, 11PM (got to bed at 4AM), 8AM, 6PM, 11PM (ran out of gas with our two 4s losing to their two threes). Missed 8balls is frustrating.

Anyways it was fun. $275 each and I won $400 a the $2/$4 limit holdem tables when I had a chance to play. So free vacation.

Sorry I didn't make it to the Peppermill on Tuesday night. We didn't play Tuesday so I was busy drinkin and playin holdem at the Sahara.

Congrats! That's exactly where my team ran out of gas last year -- it's a real test of endurance.

Only Dogginda9 and I showed up at the Peppermill, and it turned out I already knew him. Small world. But we shot the breeze for a bit and had a good time.

How did everyone else do? The team I went out to watch (Egg, from Chicago) got 129th or 257th.

Cory

 

[Eric.]

Well my team came in tied for 33rd out of the 676 teams out there in 8ball. We lost our first match and then won 5 straight before finally losing in the early morning on Friday. I played very well, won all my 7 matches vs 5,6,5,6,6,6,3. Only two of the teams had 7s on them and it never worked out that I played them. One match versus a strong 6 I started with 3 BNRs in a row after the lag. Our team played well though, only had to go sudden death once due to long all three starting matches went hill-hill. We kind of got exhausted though having played on consecutive days 8AM, 6PM, 11PM (got to bed at 4AM), 8AM, 6PM, 11PM (ran out of gas with our two 4s losing to their two threes). Missed 8balls is frustrating.

Anyways it was fun. $275 each and I won $400 a the $2/$4 limit holdem tables when I had a chance to play. So free vacation.

Sorry I didn't make it to the Peppermill on Tuesday night. We didn't play Tuesday so I was busy drinkin and playin holdem at the Sahara.

Congrats! Sounds like you guys enjoyed yourselves.

Last year was the first time I went to Vegas for the APA team thing. It really is a grueling schedule if you keep winning. Last year, we finished 11th. We got eliminated on Friday, at 9.00AM, after playing all day Thurs til 2.20 AM. The team that knocked us out only had 4 players to boot


Eric

 

[DoomCue]

Congrats! That's exactly where my team ran out of gas last year -- it's a real test of endurance.

Only Dogginda9 and I showed up at the Peppermill, and it turned out I already knew him. Small world. But we shot the breeze for a bit and had a good time.

How did everyone else do? The team I went out to watch (Egg, from Chicago) got 129th or 257th.

Cory

I posted this in the Vegas Next Week thread:

Sorry I didn't get a chance to meet up with everyone Tuesday night. Guess I'll have to wait until next year. I was tied up watching my team get 5th place in the Masters and then watching the other team out of Raleigh (Robert Ray, Johnny Griffin, and Jimmy Faircloth) win the whole thing, beating Jason Kirkwood's team in the finals. The finals didn't end until about 2:30 am, so it was a long day - our first match started at 8:00 am. All in all, though, it was a good day - we got 5th, and our friends won it. My LO was ecstatic - he also had a Ladies' 8-ball team finish 3rd, and he got married at the Monte Carlo on Wednesday!

-djb

 

[UWPoolGod1]

Yeah the schedule was pretty brutal since we made it that far. Everyone was tired. But at least this year they realized that we were in Vegas for a POOL tournament. So everyone got sleep when they could and waited until we lost to get plowed or gamble. Last year we made it also and were out in two matches. People were showing up hung over...or still drunk...from the night before. And they wondered why they played bad.

Its amazing how vital a good 3 or 4 is though. Our 3 plays like a 3. One 4 plays like a 4 but the other plays like a 3. So its kind of tough matching him up with a 3 cause he has to spot someone thats equal talent a game.

On top of that I was hoping to not even play down there but coach or if the points worked out right to occasionally play since we had a 7,6,5,5,4,4,3. But our 6 broke his foot the night before we left for vegas and he had to have surgery and didn't make the trip. So instead of playing 6,5,5,4,3 we were forced into 7,5,4,4,3. Not as strong.

 

[Gregg]

...So instead of playing 6,5,5,4,3 we were forced into 7,5,4,4,3. Not as strong.

Not as strong? Don't you know that the APA utilizes the Equalizer system, making it a fair match for players of all skill levels?

Honestly, how many legit teams seamed to be out there? I know at another competitive eight ball league, from what I heard, their national tournament was a collection of the best sand baggers the league had to offer. You would see the equivalent of APA SL5s breaking and running back to back.

How would you rate the APAs?

 

[UWPoolGod1]

I think for the most part all of the teams were pretty consistent with their ratings to ours.

Our first match their 4 had a 'W' next to his name to be watched during his match. He was a decent shot maker but did miss but the thing that set him off from our 4s was his safety play. He played a few lockup safes to win games that our players would never have done and he won the match because of it. Carom off balls with perfect speed to touch the blocker ball. The referee watching thought so too and he was moved up to a 5 later in the tourney. We lost the match

There was a 6 from Boston that I played the 2nd match who should have been a 7 easily. I wont he lag, broke and ran the first 3 racks then scratched in the 4th. He then ran the 4th and the broke and ran the 5th game. I won game 6 and did not make a ball in game 7 break. he ran out and then luckily he hooked himself on his last ball in the hill-hill game and did not have a shot. i ran out for the win. Match was 4 innings.

Other than that there were a few teams who had 3s or 4s that played better than their rankings, or played way above their head. Frustrating that they play that much better than my 3's/4's and have not went up, so stay low due to managerial process.

 

[UWPoolGod1]

Not sure if anyone posted this about the 9ball championships. Here is how I heard it:

Two teams make a run through the tournament and are to end up playing in the finals versus each other. They annihilated everyone along the way. The APA directors say that they need to meet with both teams in a conference room to go over some pre-finals details before the finals begins. They enter the room, doors are closed, and the APA directors and high level people enter. They put both teams scores for each match on the overhead and show how they have been beating everyone so badly, including 3s and 4s running multiple racks. to beat 8s and 9s match after match etc. Both teams were disqualified for sandbagging and the two teams they beat in the semifinals matched up for the finals. The two teams' players are banned from the APA for two years. All the teams they beat along the way were offered a trip back to Nationals next year with their way paid for the trouble.

On a side note one of the teams had also qualified in 8ball and 5 players were slated to play in it. The other 2 players on the 8ball team did not play 9ball which included one of their girlfriends. Because they were disqualified and banned for 2 years they were also banned from the 8ball tourney. The team had to play with 2 players which meant that they lost obviously. Supposedly the girlfriend cried when they told her and she says she knew nothing about it.

Take that...

 

[Williebetmore]

Other than that there were a few teams who had 3s or 4s that played better than their rankings, or played way above their head. Frustrating that they play that much better than my 3's/4's and have not went up, so stay low due to managerial process.

UW,
Did these players really play well, or were they recipients of favorable layouts? On bar tables, it is REALLY tough to tell who can play, and who can't. A favorable layout is runnable by ANYONE.

Do you have anyone on your team that you would consider a "sandbagger"? (or do you guys have strategies that anyway involve your handicaps?)

Sounds like you had a great trip, thanks for the report.

 

[Cory in DC]

Not sure if anyone posted this about the 9ball championships. Here is how I heard it:

Two teams make a run through the tournament and are to end up playing in the finals versus each other. They annihilated everyone along the way. The APA directors say that they need to meet with both teams in a conference room to go over some pre-finals details before the finals begins. They enter the room, doors are closed, and the APA directors and high level people enter. They put both teams scores for each match on the overhead and show how they have been beating everyone so badly, including 3s and 4s running multiple racks. to beat 8s and 9s match after match etc. Both teams were disqualified for sandbagging and the two teams they beat in the semifinals matched up for the finals. The two teams' players are banned from the APA for two years. All the teams they beat along the way were offered a trip back to Nationals next year with their way paid for the trouble.

On a side note one of the teams had also qualified in 8ball and 5 players were slated to play in it. The other 2 players on the 8ball team did not play 9ball which included one of their girlfriends. Because they were disqualified and banned for 2 years they were also banned from the 8ball tourney. The team had to play with 2 players which meant that they lost obviously. Supposedly the girlfriend cried when they told her and she says she knew nothing about it.

Take that...

Were the teams from Oklahoma? A while back, someone here posted a long thread on the amazing and long-running success of 9-ball teams from one OK league operator (Tulsa? Oklahoma City?).

Cory

 

[UWPoolGod1]

UW,
Did these players really play well, or were they recipients of favorable layouts? On bar tables, it is REALLY tough to tell who can play, and who can't. A favorable layout is runnable by ANYONE.

Do you have anyone on your team that you would consider a "sandbagger"? (or do you guys have strategies that anyway involve your handicaps?)

Sounds like you had a great trip, thanks for the report.

Willie-
A little bit of both. Obviously there were a few games where our players balls were worse and were almost predestined to lose (since they don't play safes without coaching), but there were also times where our player would get to one ball left and the other guy would run out 4 or 5 balls and then play safe and then run out. Without being coached. Just a bit more knowledge which is would end up classifying them a higher ranked player.

No we have noone on our team that sandbags. IMHO they are ranked right wehre they should be based on their skill. They have never played anything but straight 8 bar pool before getting into this ballinhand league and really have no comprehension of sandbagging. They all want to win just like if the next game was $0.25...yes our bar still has $0.25 pool tables being from a poor area. We try to win every match that we have with the best matchups because we have a very competitive league. Dumping any matches along the way would mean more then likely not making the playoffs or tricups. After last years Nationals we had to split our team into two teams because our single teams ratings were too high with people moving up and people started complaining about playing time.

I am aware of different strategies for keeping playerrs low (i.e. playing a player you know should be a 5 constantly vs 7s so their winning% stays low and they remain 3 or 4), or just telling people to miss or run up innings. We don't do that either cause again 1. they want to win so they don't try to miss, and 2. I end up playing the 6s and 7s so we can always have a favorable matchup where our 4s and 3s may have advantage over 3s and 2s. Noone on my team likes to lose or wants to waste $7/night to lose on purpose.

 

[UWPoolGod1]

Were the teams from Oklahoma? A while back, someone here posted a long thread on the amazing and long-running success of 9-ball teams from one OK league operator (Tulsa? Oklahoma City?).

Cory

I don't know for sure. I do not see the teams listed who tied for 3/4. There is a team Pic'Nics from Cleveland, OH showing DQ. and Screaming Idiots from Malden, MA showing DQ, Just Us from South El Monte, CA showing DQ. So looka like possibly two of those three.

 

[Gregg]

Not sure if anyone posted this about the 9ball championships. Here is how I heard it:

Two teams make a run through the tournament and are to end up playing in the finals versus each other. They annihilated everyone along the way. The APA directors say that they need to meet with both teams in a conference room to go over some pre-finals details before the finals begins. They enter the room, doors are closed, and the APA directors and high level people enter. They put both teams scores for each match on the overhead and show how they have been beating everyone so badly, including 3s and 4s running multiple racks. to beat 8s and 9s match after match etc. Both teams were disqualified for sandbagging and the two teams they beat in the semifinals matched up for the finals. The two teams' players are banned from the APA for two years. All the teams they beat along the way were offered a trip back to Nationals next year with their way paid for the trouble.

On a side note one of the teams had also qualified in 8ball and 5 players were slated to play in it. The other 2 players on the 8ball team did not play 9ball which included one of their girlfriends. Because they were disqualified and banned for 2 years they were also banned from the 8ball tourney. The team had to play with 2 players which meant that they lost obviously. Supposedly the girlfriend cried when they told her and she says she knew nothing about it.

Take that...

Good info UWPoolGod1

SL3s and SL4 running multiple racks, and they made it to the semis without being called out? Come on. They should be embarrassed they let it get that far.

Some weaker SL3s in our league can hardly make a ball, but they have them running multiple racks?

 

[UWPoolGod1]

SL3s and SL4 running multiple racks, and they made it to the semis without being called out? Come on. They should be embarrassed they let it get that far.

More than likely were embarrassed. Which is probably why they offered to resend all the teams that those teams beat to get to the finals. That or the score sheets just did not reflect it, who knows.

 

[dogginda9]

APA Thoughts

First: Thanks to Cory for showing at the Peppermill. I was beginning to think my deodorant wasn't working. Small world for sure. As soon as I saw him I remembered him from Chicago years ago.
Second: My team did just about what I thought we would given our particular team situation. All in all we had a very nice trip and had some fun away from the pool tables as well.
Third: I've been to Vegas many times in the APA and as usual, I felt like the handicaps were pretty accurate on all accounts. Some were a little off but that is gonna happen anywhere.
Fourth: After watching the 3 man Masters and Doubles events, I forgot how much fun they can be and will definitely play in one of them next year. I recommend them both highly.
Last: Some friends of mine were on a team that was beaten by one of the DQ'd 9 ball teams and they did feel like the handicaps were somewhat off. (This was at the end of the tourney after some people had been raised, so it was probably worse at the beginning) On another DQ note, a team from our state (different league operator though) was sent packing due to handicap issues. But the kicker was how they were found out. Once I get a more accurate version of the story I will post it. If someone else doesn't beat me to it. It's a laugher.........

 

[ScottW]

Our first match their 4 had a 'W' next to his name to be watched during his match.

As I've never been to nationals, I knew that sometimes they'd keep an eye on a particular player and move him/her up if they thought it necessary - but I had no idea they actually PRINTED something on the scoresheets to indicate someone was under scrutiny.

So did BOTH sheets show the "W" for this player? More specifically, did the score sheet for the team the watched player was on incidate to their team he was under scrutiny? Wouldn't that kinda defeat the purpose, giving him prior warning?

Sandbaggers suck.

 

[UWPoolGod1]

As I've never been to nationals, I knew that sometimes they'd keep an eye on a particular player and move him/her up if they thought it necessary - but I had no idea they actually PRINTED something on the scoresheets to indicate someone was under scrutiny.

So did BOTH sheets show the "W" for this player? More specifically, did the score sheet for the team the watched player was on incidate to their team he was under scrutiny? Wouldn't that kinda defeat the purpose, giving him prior warning?

Sandbaggers suck.

Yeah left of the SL column on both score sheets was a 'W' and at the top of the score sheet in the Note area there was a remark saying something to the affect of "If a player listed has a W next to there name a referee must be called in to oversee the match". The referees had red vests on and these 'W-Watcher' referees had on Green vests. So both sides knew that the individual was going to be watched and his rating was in question. The guy eventually went up to a 5 because I talked to the team later in the tourney and they said he had went up.

 

[Wally in Cincy]

There was a 6 from Boston that I played the 2nd match who should have been a 7 easily. I wont he lag, broke and ran the first 3 racks .

Well that's pretty sweet

What was the rule for players going up? There was a local ladies team (8-ball) that went out there and had two 3's go to 4's and a 5 go to a 6 (i am sure it was justified, they be sandbaggers).

I thought going up 3 s/l's was a DQ