League pool
- Thread starter Colormegone2002
- Start date
I run a little BCA league and do so for free. We actually pay out more than we bring in. Send top shooter to BCA and have a tourney with a couple hundred added as well as pay back 100% of money taken in. It's 10 teams or so and it's pretty drama free. Mostly super good people and good players.
Conversely, a great friend of mine owns the APA in my area. I know what he paid and know ball park what he makes. It's a full time job (he runs tourneys pretty much all summer, ZERO free weekends during the summer). It's dealing with some real pains-in-the-asses. People who don't appreciate a damn thing. He doesn't owe anyone an explanation on what he makes, where the money goes, and how it's split up. He plunked down well into 6 figures to own this league. If you think you're entitled to know how he runs his business then you're part of the problem and one of the pains-in-the-asses that make his job so difficult and thankless. I would have the opportunity to purchase it from him when/if he decides to sell and I'd rather light my money on fire than go through the crap he has to put up with. There's plenty of good people and there's a whole lot of a-holes who think they have the right to know what you do with your business.
I'll say this, whatever many of these APA owners make, IT AIN'T NEARLY ENOUGH.
Conversely, a great friend of mine owns the APA in my area. I know what he paid and know ball park what he makes. It's a full time job (he runs tourneys pretty much all summer, ZERO free weekends during the summer). It's dealing with some real pains-in-the-asses. People who don't appreciate a damn thing. He doesn't owe anyone an explanation on what he makes, where the money goes, and how it's split up. He plunked down well into 6 figures to own this league. If you think you're entitled to know how he runs his business then you're part of the problem and one of the pains-in-the-asses that make his job so difficult and thankless. I would have the opportunity to purchase it from him when/if he decides to sell and I'd rather light my money on fire than go through the crap he has to put up with. There's plenty of good people and there's a whole lot of a-holes who think they have the right to know what you do with your business.
I'll say this, whatever many of these APA owners make, IT AIN'T NEARLY ENOUGH.
Why ? Why should any business give an itemized list of where the money goes. ?
If the business is a social club whose sole source of revenue is league fees and whose purpose is to provide payouts and prizes, etc to its members, then you are goddamn right the members have a RIGHT to know exactly where the money is going.
Do you ask where the money goes if you go bowling ?
If it is a bowling league, absolutely.
Do you ask where the money goes if you go golfing. ?
If it is a local golf league, ditto.
Do you ask where the money goes if you go to the movies.?
Of course not. Duh.
I guess the term ...cheap ass pool players ... Is really deserved .
The officers of our league do our jobs on a voluntary basis as well. To call the members of a league "cheap ass" because they want to know if the operators are sucking away too much money from the top is very disrespectful. I don't have a problem with league operators being paid for work done, but why shouldn't a league member have access to a high level breakdown of where the money goes within that league?
What if it's purpose is providing a structure for ENTERTAINMENT?
Perfect example right here. You can't acknowledge the entertainment factor in a pool league. Or you refuse to acknowledge it because it would render your attacks pointless.
In most APA franchises, that high level breakdown is known. If you play in my league, half of what your team pays me is my fee for running the league. The other half is the player's fund. I make no secret about that. If you think I'm "sucking away too much money" and that makes a difference in your perception of the value you get for the money you pay, then feel free not to play in my league. It's your choice, and the choice of everyone who plays in a league, or spends money for anything, for that matter. Is the value you get worth the price you pay?
Now, if what you REALLY think you deserve to know is my profit after royalties and other expenses, that amount can vary greatly. You have no more right to know that than I have to know how much you make at your full-time job.
Amen! sbpoolleague has always been an APA basher. APA is a privately owned, for profit pool league, and as such it's "nunyabizness". If the LO chooses to share information that's their prerogative...if not, that's their right! 
Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
It is APA that I'm referring he says. I never realized APA was a "for entertainment" league.
I enjoy pool as much as anyone but there should be a little more involved than just
entertainment and from what I HEAR not SEE, a bunch of sandbagging just to
make it to the nationals which it sounds like is happening.There's no wonder
you hear all the sandbag stories IMO because that's the only payout is to get
to Vegas.
Makes no difference to me, it's a 50 mile 1 way trip for league around here
anyway. I'm not that starved for entertainment, especially through the week lol.
To each their own and have fun
I enjoy pool as much as anyone but there should be a little more involved than just
entertainment and from what I HEAR not SEE, a bunch of sandbagging just to
make it to the nationals which it sounds like is happening.There's no wonder
you hear all the sandbag stories IMO because that's the only payout is to get
to Vegas.
Makes no difference to me, it's a 50 mile 1 way trip for league around here
anyway. I'm not that starved for entertainment, especially through the week lol.
To each their own and have fun
I wonder if this is why we dont have any APA leagues in our area.
We don't have bcapl....tap ...usapl. or any other league in our area.. So what was your point you were trying to make ?
Just exactly what is an amateur pool league supposed to be ? In your opinion ?
As for the sandbagging part. Well the way I look at is sandbagging is just a way of life for some pool players that stretches from amateur leagues all the way up to road players .
Quite a few posters on here are hypocrites whether they realize it or not
When they discuss the terms .....sandbaggers or handicap leagues. Below are just a few examples of why I say that.
First , what is a sandbagger...the most common description is some one who hides their true playing ability. Others have simply classified them as cheaters.
This forum is riddled with threads glorifying road players who disguised their identity or the playing ability. They definitely fall into the above category.
The term handicaps....its used to describe the difference between different pool players playing ability.
Handicaps. Many on here state ....just man up and play even. Very few serious amateur pool players play even with any other serious pool players when gambling....hence the terms spots or games on the wire. Heck ...even some pros spot other pros in matches.
It seems to me when people bash apa for sandbaggers....which I dont think is as rampant as some claim and players hiding behind their handicaps they are in effect saying apa players should be held to higher standards than the rest of the pool playing world.
When you stop and think about it...ts kinda ludicrous aint it.
Last edited:
Not good enough. Most APA leagues have multiple levels of playoffs and tournaments and that "players fund" you speak of isn't a fund for that 6 or 8 team division but most of it gets lopped into a regional fund. So a team can win its division, win a playoff among its division playoff teams, then go to a regional playoff and lose, and go home with nothing more than a trophy. Now there is nothing wrong with the system or the structure, but I feel that an operator should lay out exactly how the players fund is apportioned between the various tourney/playoff levels. We have a very large APA franchise nearby and several of our BCAPL players also play in that APA league. Every single one of them have complaints over this exact issue. It isn't me bashing the APA. I have never played APA. It is the APA players bashing the APA. I'm just echoing their collective voice.
Maybe the word entertainment is the wrong word to describe amateur pool but then again I used that word because that word is the reason I play .
Although apa has been described as a social league for non serious players and undoubtedly some members play for that reason.....apa is not a social pool playing organization. It is a for profit business and unless it is a publicly owned business in which you hold stock in it their profit margin is not any yours or any one elses business.
Banks
Banned
I've been playing for 11 or 12 years now. I pay money to be part of the league.. to play matches against random opponents, spend time with friends, meet new people and go to places i may not otherwise visit. Don't care where my money goes. If i want to play to get something back, ill play bca or gamble. In my experience, apa has been fun, got me into the game and continues to be worth the money.
+1
I enjoy league and APA is just fine. I may add a BCA night soon but regardless I don't feel ripped off and I actually know what my LO takes because we have had candid discussions about it and he was a friend before I ever played league.
I do know a lot of people who complain constantly in the league though and likely would no matter how much info they had etc.
Nit trying to be argumentative here although you and I have went to that level before. :grin-square:
You Sa you have members of your league that also play apa and they complain to you about their experience in apa ? Why do they put their selves through that. If I dont enjoy what I am doing I dang sure aint going to continue spending my hard earned money doing it and then complain about it.
If you want to pay most of the money back out that you take in I am not going to degrade you or your league....at the same time you should not degrade me or the league I play in just because you dont agree with the way apa runs their " business" and is not a charity league like yours
What it all seems to boil down to is 2 trains of thought by amateur pool players about how amateur leagues oughta be ran.
One group plays simply because they enjoy playing pool and willingly pay the organization they are members of the fees required and are aware of the payouts ....or lack of....they receive back.
The other group thinks they should be able to play and receive most if not all their money back every year.
Well actually you have a third group like some of your league members. They knowingly and willingly play and pay dues in a league that they know what the payouts or lack of are and then ***** about the lack of payouts.
Think about this.
Pool player a plays league and knows he is paying xxx amount of dollars and does not expect money back for services rendered. He has a flood in his basement and he goes to Dixie rents and rents a pump to drain his basement. He pays for the use of the pump knowing it was for services rendered with out getting money back.
Player b plays pool with the intention of getting most ...if not all the money back at the end of the year for services rendered. His basement floods and be needs a pump fo drain it. What's he gona do ? He is going to go to home depot and buy a pump. He goes home and pumps his basement out...cleans up the pump and takes it back to home depot and gets his money back. Dont laugh...seen crap like this pulled many times.
Which type of player are you ?
We are just a one-night-a week 8-ball league. The only other league action within 45 minutes is APA.
Could be that it's 2am but I've read this 4 times and I still don't get the analogy
Think about this.
Pool player a plays league and knows he is paying xxx amount of dollars and does not expect money back for services rendered. He has a flood in his basement and he goes to Dixie rents and rents a pump to drain his basement. He pays for the use of the pump knowing it was for services rendered with out getting money back.
Player b plays pool with the intention of getting most ...if not all the money back at the end of the year for services rendered. His basement floods and be needs a pump fo drain it. What's he gona do ? He is going to go to home depot and buy a pump. He goes home and pumps his basement out...cleans up the pump and takes it back to home depot and gets his money back. Dont laugh...seen crap like this pulled many times.
Which type of player are you ?[/QUOTE]
Wow I'm lost on this analogy as well. Might just be me though,sorry
Pool player a plays league and knows he is paying xxx amount of dollars and does not expect money back for services rendered. He has a flood in his basement and he goes to Dixie rents and rents a pump to drain his basement. He pays for the use of the pump knowing it was for services rendered with out getting money back.
Player b plays pool with the intention of getting most ...if not all the money back at the end of the year for services rendered. His basement floods and be needs a pump fo drain it. What's he gona do ? He is going to go to home depot and buy a pump. He goes home and pumps his basement out...cleans up the pump and takes it back to home depot and gets his money back. Dont laugh...seen crap like this pulled many times.
Which type of player are you ?[/QUOTE]
Wow I'm lost on this analogy as well. Might just be me though,sorry
Exactly lol Pool players are the one group that seem to think every dime goes back to them. Do you ever play golf or bowling leagues? No one complains about the bowling alley or the golf course making money because people who play those games are smart enough to realize it's not a charity.. they're is a price for entertainment. Someone has to collect all the stats and be in charge. There is a price for that.
You go to a theater to watch a movie. Where does the money go?
You attend a sporting event. Where does the money go?
You play in a casino. Where does the money go?
It is all the price or cost of entertainment.
If you want something for free take a walk but even that has a cost hidden somewhere.
But if you dine in a restaurant or drink in a bar it is guaranteed that money eventually goes down the drain.
I think there is a lot of truth to this. Some people just get a charge out of complaining, no matter what it is about.
Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com