Why not just fill the hollows behind the end of the point grooves with epoxy and call it a day? Why would anyone care?
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Leaving a nipple on a breaktip
- Thread starter alphadog
- Start date
would it make the butt ld?:grin:
in the past i've done more like what joeys saying, but instead of making the t and drilling i do more like what kim does. I'll install the tip, flat face it, then drill out with the end mill. I then plug the phenolic or g10 with the same, ive even turned the inner "core rod" so that the "layers" are horizontal....and some swear its better that way than the layers of the fabric vertical....
i go in to the existing ferrule 3/16....customer always knows...never done this on any LD shaft with holes nad funky ferrules.
i did make a shaft once as a joke with one of the HHS 1/4" rounds. I was making a short shaft for a masse cue of mine....so i left it long and drilled out the end and inserted that little rod and its about 3" long i believe....got tons of em for D drills. I put a nice tip on it....let it ferruleless...
my buddies love my ferruleless shafts....he he he.....
it barely even vibrated and the ball with an off center hit was like it was made of speed and teflon lol......WTF....id getup and run soe balls just playing speed and angle...give it back..."theres nothing wrong with it"....they go back to using english and its all crazy again....
"hey....what the hell you do?"
"ah just wanted to teach yall a lesson on deflection.....of the high kind"
i explained some stuff and chopped it off next day made a keychain and finished the shortie.
sorry for the sidebar kinda......
this thread actually had me thinking....about how much tip contacts the ball. those tips i do like that people really like, its flat topped 5mm wide....then shouldered....i'll probably see one of the fellas tonight ill get a pic of one...
but i did take a piece of phenolic, and impreganted the piss out of a triangle and pressed the bejesus out of it...turned it down to 1/4....plugged it and pressed it in an undersize hole.....
let it set and put a normal dome one it....triedit out sounds weird, but it hits pretty dam good, i can play and draw with the thing, just a fun littl experiment i been screwing around with....kinda neat i think.
i would also like to add that i think often times its not only the glue or ferrule type issues with the glue and trying to glue on such a non porus surface......i see alot of those tips, especially the WD are kind of thin.....if its especially a wider tip with a thinner shoulder, and its also has less radius, off center hits flex the piss out of that material, and imop thats the cause of alot of "pop offs" its springboarding off the shaft, where as a nice radius on a thinner shoulder will have a more glancing effect.
there's def reasons why a flatter tip for a breaker is a bonus, but its of my opinion that thiner flatter tips are part of the hard azz hell break tips popping off issues as much as glueing technique or not facing of each side. It has to be....look what starts happening to ferrules and playing tips that get real thin.....thats when the damage starts tooccurr
regards,
Greyghost
i go in to the existing ferrule 3/16....customer always knows...never done this on any LD shaft with holes nad funky ferrules.
i did make a shaft once as a joke with one of the HHS 1/4" rounds. I was making a short shaft for a masse cue of mine....so i left it long and drilled out the end and inserted that little rod and its about 3" long i believe....got tons of em for D drills. I put a nice tip on it....let it ferruleless...
my buddies love my ferruleless shafts....he he he.....
it barely even vibrated and the ball with an off center hit was like it was made of speed and teflon lol......WTF....id getup and run soe balls just playing speed and angle...give it back..."theres nothing wrong with it"....they go back to using english and its all crazy again....
"hey....what the hell you do?"
"ah just wanted to teach yall a lesson on deflection.....of the high kind"
i explained some stuff and chopped it off next day made a keychain and finished the shortie.
sorry for the sidebar kinda......
this thread actually had me thinking....about how much tip contacts the ball. those tips i do like that people really like, its flat topped 5mm wide....then shouldered....i'll probably see one of the fellas tonight ill get a pic of one...
but i did take a piece of phenolic, and impreganted the piss out of a triangle and pressed the bejesus out of it...turned it down to 1/4....plugged it and pressed it in an undersize hole.....
let it set and put a normal dome one it....triedit out sounds weird, but it hits pretty dam good, i can play and draw with the thing, just a fun littl experiment i been screwing around with....kinda neat i think.
i would also like to add that i think often times its not only the glue or ferrule type issues with the glue and trying to glue on such a non porus surface......i see alot of those tips, especially the WD are kind of thin.....if its especially a wider tip with a thinner shoulder, and its also has less radius, off center hits flex the piss out of that material, and imop thats the cause of alot of "pop offs" its springboarding off the shaft, where as a nice radius on a thinner shoulder will have a more glancing effect.
there's def reasons why a flatter tip for a breaker is a bonus, but its of my opinion that thiner flatter tips are part of the hard azz hell break tips popping off issues as much as glueing technique or not facing of each side. It has to be....look what starts happening to ferrules and playing tips that get real thin.....thats when the damage starts tooccurr
regards,
Greyghost
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my above post also had me thinking about how i've heard and read some really like contact cement....i hate the chit.....but i wonder if it wouldnt be the best glue for say a white diamond tip....
any one use that for their breakers? i know its probably got the best shock absorption capabilities of the glues that i know of....makes sense in my head
any one use that for their breakers? i know its probably got the best shock absorption capabilities of the glues that i know of....makes sense in my head
This will be my last post in this thread. If offering an opinion drives this forum down, then you are just as guilty yourself sir, just as most people here would be as Opinions are what forums are based on. If this forum is going down, then maybe it's due to less than helpful, less accurate, not as thought out, advice being given out by people
Now let me explain why I have the opinion I do:
The picture I attached in the earlier post, that repair came about due to a local guy reading about this method in a post you made here on AZ showing it, so maybe that is why I may take it to heart a little more than some others would as I have seen firsthand the effect of that post has had. That post cost the customer for a new ferrule, new tenon, and a new tip, plus my labor, all above the initial cost of the original tip install which caused it all . This just to repair what was originally a perfect break shaft. Now one can brush it off with saying ' it's just a breaker', but to the customer, that was their cue and they have to pay for the repairs. I am one that don't like to see people go thru this kinda thing.
Now a lot of the blame is on the repair guy, but it shows how much what we post here has an impact out in the world. I won't take the time to describe how a BK shaft/ferrule is constructed, but trust me, the method you described, if done to one of those ferrules, it will lead to failure of an expensive level. I don't know how many predator or other expensive break shafts you have worked on, but some are not candidates for this method at all. I also would not recommend this to be done to any shaft without customer approval as IMHO, that is unethical and just not necessary.
Sorry Kim if you disagree, but that is my opinion and why I have it.
Dave
thats why i've always thought this section shouldn't be open to randoms.....any asshole with some cash can buy equipment....buy a book....and be fully set up and not know shit about shit....hell its no myth that i and others have seen many a fellow spend 10-20k and build some real pretty DONKEYS. As a player and builder of too many functional things I'd rahter have an operator bend tubing over his knee and it look like ass than some dink over hearing what anyone does....and only know a piece of the puzzle and go off as if they know shit.
I deal with this prior in the past in many things...from offshore instrumentation which can get you f'n killed to some dog showing some technique WRONG that he/she over heard me talking about in passing....because they want to boost their ego and be a overnight hero.
i dont mean any disrespect to kim by saying this either....but its something we should all be aware of here. I've been doing this since 04...apprenticed for 6 years and been just doing it as a hobby for going on 7.....i came from a family of master craftsmen so i kinda had it in my head from a young age.
Like dealing with an "antique" home....some yuppie carpenter that went to school or has only worked on new home builds has no got dam business going in on a major renovation on a really old home. Paneling, studs, boards, cinematch....all that back when was thicker....you also have differing kinds of old school framing...like balloon framing etc. Not to mention that back in the gap lots of things were done by ED.....and Ed had his own way....which worked great for ED....but Ed knew what ED was doing...because ED wasn't playing x box and lurking on cuemaking forums trying to be a flyby nighter with a shoe box lathe he/she doesn't even know how to use.
i could just see two dumb wads....one with a real nice collectable custom....and some mule of a hero friend.....and disaster ensuing....and it would be a shame for them.
Even the most experienced guys really really F up from time to time. I remember just about 5 years ago....we had a thread on our blow your brains out mess ups. I forget who it was....something tells me in my memory warehouse it was darren hill....but the maker was doing i swear was a full ivory cue....or at least it was recut ivory points....but i'm pretty got dam sure it was a ivory forearm......and he was making one or two of his last recuts.....and forgot to lock the index plate....and the router just did a upside down nike swoosh on it as long as the point cut......10-15k dollar cue.....only thing he could done is called up thomas wayne crying his nuts off....TEE you think you could 4th axis cut me a upside down nike check looking point for this? Worst dam cue making bad day i've ever heard of.....except for that one guy whos whole operation burned down....but that wasn't his fault.
this isn't a game....its a craft. you dont learn it on the net. you dont learn it in a book....you must do...and you must know when you shouldn't be doing things, or especially when you should be stopping and asking customer permission or seeking better professional advice from your/our peers.
This without doubt is not a weakness. Asking advice. Some of the best cue makers the world has ever seen have asked questions....and gotten answeres from lesser mortals right in this very place.
I take this serious like a good auto mechanic....if i cant fix it or build it....i wont even try on your dime/life....using customers as guinea pigs for your development is not a good thing.
regards,
-Greyghost