Looking for a mentor/teacher

Neil said:
One can be taught how to put the cb on a precise line. One can be taught how to read pattern play, one can be taught some speed control. For the student to be able to put it all together, takes much, much practice. But, as RJ stated, it takes much less practice when taught than to just figure it all out on your own, if one ever does.

For example, ever seen the wagon wheel drill? Extremely tough drill, if one only goes by feel. However, once one is taught how to aim to get the cb to go where one wants to, it becomes much easier to do correctly. The student still has to learn by experience to do what he is taught to do, but it sure does shorten the learning curve by a mile.
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It's tough for me to relate to things like this because I learned by feel, but am also incredibly intelligent and use reason/logic/common sense to do drills properly. Obviously, there's more to it than that but I think my personality and natural abilities name learning this game much easier.

I think that my learning curve is out of the norm for sure. That sounds conceded but what I mean to say is that I have a natural inclination to learn this game, and a natural set of tools to learn it fast.

I really can't speak about the learning curve of others.
 
Anyway OP,

My experience will not reflect what yours will probably be. I will tell you that having strong, and knowledgeable players around me helped my game a lot and gave me a goal to shoot for. The immense motivation is what allowed me and continues to allow me to learn quickly and improve rapidly.

Find a reason to continue to shoot better, and find players or mentors to shoot with. You will jump fast.
 
Zphix said:
I respectfully disagree Neil.

I looked all over for these answers and the general consensus was "you learn by doing it." I agree that you can teach people basic principles of CB control and position play but you can't do these things until you do them for yourself.

My opinion is that you can give people the puzzle pieces but you can't show them how to put them together.
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Doing if for yourself is the whole point of taking lessons. YOU shoot the shot over and over again while the instructor improves your fundamentals and explains what is supposed to happen (and why it didn't happen when you tried it...so do it again, and again until you can't miss it....Okay, now let's move the CB 5-degrees).

That's a lot more "hands-on" than sitting in the chair and watching your opponent shoot. Matching up with opponents is the best way to learn about playing under pressure and playing to win. But it's a ridiculously inefficient way to master the basics.

Besides, what if he mentors under someone like Ismael Paez? Great player in anyone's book, but Lord help the player who tries to imitate his stroke. https://youtu.be/XKSZ6fCvSak?t=331
 
philly said:
Agreed Z. When it comes to speed, which is the toughest thing to master, it's all hitting a million balls and feel. You can't learn speed in a book or from a teacher.
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Sorry Philly

This is one of the easiest tings to Master. Our students grasp the concept the first day of the class.

Speed control is fun to learn and easy to use!

randyg
 
This is the most ridiculous statement I have read here yet. :rolleyes: You have no idea what you're talking about philly...and Zphix neither. All of the things you both talked about not only can be taught, but can be teught to anyone, including players who are already high level players. We've been doing it successully for thousands of poolplayers for more than 30 years!

To the OP...Randyg is the top instructor in America, and is available right there in your back yard. Contact him immediately for the help you are searching for!

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

philly said:
Agreed Z. When it comes to speed, which is the toughest thing to master, it's all hitting a million balls and feel. You can't learn speed in a book or from a teacher.
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Scott Lee said:
This is the most ridiculous statement I have read here yet. :rolleyes: You have no idea what you're talking about philly...and Zphix neither. All of the things you both talked about not only can be taught, but can be teught to anyone, including players who are already high level players. We've been doing it successully for thousands of poolplayers for more than 30 years!

To the OP...Randyg is the top instructor in America, and is available right there in your back yard. Contact him immediately for the help you are searching for!

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
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Maybe I'll run into you again at the next SBE and I'll set up a lesson with you if our times sync up. I'm not too old to learn if you have monumental patience Scott.
 
philly...I do have "monumental patience", and I'd love the chance to show you what you don't know! LOL Actually I'll be coming right through Philly the middle of next week. If you'd like to try out a lesson with me, give me a phone number for you, so we can talk details. Tell you what...if you don't believe that what I can show you is the total nuts, the lesson will be no charge! :thumbup:

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

philly said:
Maybe I'll run into you again at the next SBE and I'll set up a lesson with you if our times sync up. I'm not too old to learn if you have monumental patience Scott.
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I've taken lessons from both RandyG and Bert Kinister and recommend them. Both are located in the Plano/Richardson area. You can get a feel for Bert's style at bertkinister.com
 
Appreciate everyone's input and I agree that hours and hours of practice is what will eventually elevate me to next level. I just believe hours and hours of doing it wrong can't benefit me more than knowing the correct way to do and practice that for hours. I will be in contact with a couple of the names giving here and thanks for all the replies.
 
PayasoRF...Fix it fast, and right now. You only need to call one person. Call Randyg. He can meet with you immediately and change your pool game FOREVER! :thumbup:

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

PayasoRF said:
Appreciate everyone's input and I agree that hours and hours of practice is what will eventually elevate me to next level. I just believe hours and hours of doing it wrong can't benefit me more than knowing the correct way to do and practice that for hours. I will be in contact with a couple of the names giving here and thanks for all the replies.
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If precise CB control and speed control, as well as top notch pattern play could be taught then why aren't you producing thousands of pro players.

Anyhow, one way or another it does not matter to me. Maybe I am an idiot who is saying ridiculous things, but my opinion is just that. I will probably never pay for instruction and I don't see the need to.

OP,

Best of luck to you.
 
Zphix said:
If precise CB control and speed control, as well as top notch pattern play could be taught then why aren't you producing thousands of pro players.

Anyhow, one way or another it does not matter to me. Maybe I am an idiot who is saying ridiculous things, but my opinion is just that. I will probably never pay for instruction and I don't see the need to.

OP,

Best of luck to you.
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Thanks Zphix I appreciate your feedback and honesty I like self learning and have seen a great improvement in myself from just shooting to actually working on my stance and hit with good follow thru something I used to never do. I felt like a took a step back then a huge leap forward in my game but I want to keep stepping it up to next level.The pool hall where I shoot the guys there have really complimented the way my game has improved. That in itself feels good but I want to feel confident when I join league next year
 
PayasoRF said:
Thanks Zphix I appreciate your feedback and honesty I like self learning and have seen a great improvement in myself from just shooting to actually working on my stance and hit with good follow thru something I used to never do. I felt like a took a step back then a huge leap forward in my game but I want to keep stepping it up to next level.The pool hall where I shoot the guys there have really complimented the way my game has improved. That in itself feels good but I want to feel confident when I join league next year
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You'll find that when it comes to your fundamentals you will go through this a few times. I did have a mentor/teacher when it came to my fundamentals and the guy who showed me is an instructor.

Just recently I made the final change to my fundamentals and now my shooting is automatic and I've been able to focus exclusively on position play and picking good patterns because I now know that I can make the shots without hesitation. Ball-pocketing itself was where I excelled when I started shooting, and now I'm even more confident in it.

I've looked for people to teach me CB control and pattern play and I was always told I had to learn it on my own by continuing to play and play and I've learned it pretty quickly. Still have a ways to go but being able to pocket balls while focusing on position is what makes this possible.

I'm confident that you will improve with or without instruction. You seem to have a lot of motivation to improve and that's what will make you better, faster.
 
Zphix said:
You'll find that when it comes to your fundamentals you will go through this a few times. I did have a mentor/teacher when it came to my fundamentals and the guy who showed me is an instructor.

Just recently I made the final change to my fundamentals and now my shooting is automatic and I've been able to focus exclusively on position play and picking good patterns because I now know that I can make the shots without hesitation. Ball-pocketing itself was where I excelled when I started shooting, and now I'm even more confident in it.

I've looked for people to teach me CB control and pattern play and I was always told I had to learn it on my own by continuing to play and play and I've learned it pretty quickly. Still have a ways to go but being able to pocket balls while focusing on position is what makes this possible.

I'm confident that you will improve with or without instruction. You seem to have a lot of motivation to improve and that's what will make you better, faster.
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Thanks for the kind words Zphinx I really do have the motivation and drive. I always had a natural talent for picking up things quickly atleast my fishing buddies think so lol. Left that on the back burner to pick up pool, I have always played throughout the years but I have never really looked into it as much or improved myself back then. I have watch a lot of fundamental videos that have really changed the way I view things I just want to make sure I have a solid core of fundamentals to improve on.
 
philly said:
Maybe I'll run into you again at the next SBE and I'll set up a lesson with you if our times sync up. I'm not too old to learn if you have monumental patience Scott.
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we've had Scott Lee. it is an intense, fine tuned 8hr lesson. he takes notes of you to zero-in & videotapes everything for future reference. your head will spin for weeks, while you strive to re-learn much. and it's worth it.

he's also pretty cool to hang with :cool:
 
The reason is because MOST poolplayers have zero desire to become professional players. They just want to be the best they can be, and sought us out to achieve that goal. To that end we have produced many thousands of much better players than they were. Whoever told you that you can't teach speed control simply didn't know how...instructor or not.

I understand that you'll "never" pay for instruction, even when your older brother tried to convince you to do it, because your mind is closed. You've already admitted that you are extremely young and have very little experience. You can't fix what you don't know about, and you can't fix what you can't measure...those are things that a qualified instructor can teach you., You're correct...you're welcome to your own opinion, but you'd at least think from the positive experiences that many others have had with some of the great instructors out there, you'd at least consider it. Oh well...you don't know what you don't know! :D

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

Zphix said:
If precise CB control and speed control, as well as top notch pattern play could be taught then why aren't you producing thousands of pro players.

Anyhow, one way or another it does not matter to me. Maybe I am an idiot who is saying ridiculous things, but my opinion is just that. I will probably never pay for instruction and I don't see the need to.

OP,

Best of luck to you.
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PayasoRF said:
Newbie here have been reading tons of post but never posted anything. I am in the Dallas, Texas area and I am having a hard time finding a mentor/teacher to help me take my pool game to a new level above pool halls. I am not a top notch player but I do know some fundamentals but that is my personal opinion on myself. I really need someone who can really teach me and show me cue ball control and position play. I am not looking for someone to show me for free I will pay for weekly lessons I know time is money and I am willing to invest money in myself to learn the game of pool (8 ball,9 ball, or 10 ball). Thanks for reading and if this is not the right area for this post could the moderators please move.
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CJ Wiley is in the Dallas / Fort Worth area. He was one of, if not the best, gambling money players, at least in his time & he played fairly well at the pro level against the top pros.

I'm on the side that anything can be taught, but that does not mean that it can be learned as it is taught.

Everyone learns differently. Some can do & actually want a mechanical approach while others are better suited to actually feeling things with no prescribed method.

If you are a by the book type then perhaps you should go with RandyG. If not & you're more of a feel oriented type then perhaps you should go in the direction of CJ Wiley.

Good Luck with what ever direction you go.
 
Scott Lee said:
The reason is because MOST poolplayers have zero desire to become professional players. They just want to be the best they can be, and sought us out to achieve that goal. To that end we have produced many thousands of much better players than they were. Whoever told you that you can't teach speed control simply didn't know how...instructor or not.

I understand that you'll "never" pay for instruction, even when your older brother tried to convince you to do it, because your mind is closed. You've already admitted that you are extremely young and have very little experience. You can't fix what you don't know about, and you can't fix what you can't measure...those are things that a qualified instructor can teach you., You're correct...you're welcome to your own opinion, but you'd at least think from the positive experiences that many others have had with some of the great instructors out there, you'd at least consider it. Oh well...you don't know what you don't know! :D

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
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Of course I don't know what I don't know. First to admit it. But I prefer finding things out on my own because that is how I learn the best. I fully understand that the PBIA instructor ratings reflect your ability to convey information and teach.

I've talked with enough players who have taken lessons with you and they were absolutely enthralled with their results and improvement. But, those same players have told me that I wouldn't benefit much from a lesson because I already know a lot, and when they talk to me about what you guys do in lessons/pool schools I'm able to talk with them freely about it because much of it is stuff I've already picked up.

If I was a beginner with no experience then I would probably take a lesson, but the general consensus of other players is that it isn't cost effective for me to take a lesson. I've become an A level player without instruction, and I don't see myself needing instruction to move even higher because becoming a "master" level player is still a stepping stone to me.

Let me explain that I am not, nor do I, try to convince other players that they shouldn't take instruction because many players have told me about the benefits of learning from an instructor but I don't think it's up my alley. Times change, and opinions do as well, so years from now I may be stuck at the A level and need instruction but until that time comes (if it comes) then I will see what happens.

-Richard
 
Richard, you may be surprised what you find out from just 1 hour of instruction, especially if you get video taped. You mention finding out how to improve on your own which is definitely not a bad mindset...but why not see if you can shorten the learning curve by having your fundamentals checked out?

Go with an open cup/humble attitude, even if you think you understand what your friends worked on when taking a lesson. Randy and Scott also work on more advanced stuff as a heads up, not just beginner type of things.

I am just your standard solid APA 7 banger. I won a lot of matches, but had pretty poor fundamentals. Seeing myself on video helped be an eye opener and helped me get an idea of not only what I need to work on, but the tools to tell when I am messing up on my fundamentals as well.

Matt
 
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