Low deflection isn't always a good thing

Low squirt shafts don't apply any more sidespin than other shafts.

they do, but useualy not that noticeable, over a long distance the differance is very apparent.....
 
SPINDOKTOR said:
DO! :D
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LOL.

The mezz wd700 was the first, now with the X shaft, im certain...these do...without a doubt...:)
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I've tested lots of shafts, high and low squirt, for how much spin they produce, and never found a difference.
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I use a very simple test that you can try on any shaft. Interested?

pj
chgo
 
YES!!!!!!.........



Patrick Johnson said:
LOL.



[Broken record mode]
I've tested lots of shafts, high and low squirt, for how much spin they produce, and never found a difference.
[/Broken record mode]

I use a very simple test that you can try on any shaft. Interested?

pj
chgo
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Patrick Johnson said:
Don't.

pj
chgo
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I've played with the Z2-shaft today. Great shaft. But I also don't think low deflection shafts would give more spin to the balls. I can apply more spin using my regular cue. I don't think it's the shaft, but your technique. I've tried to shoot the CB from the headspot to the short rail, with maximum side english. With my regular cue I can hit the second diamond from the short rail. With the Z-shaft, I just can't hit lower than the third diamond from the short rail.
 
softshot said:
better to who? we have reached a moot point. given equal skill I'm better with my shaft.. your better with the shaft your used to.

learning your low deflection shaft or learning my normal shaft. it still comes down to learning YOUR shaft.

you bought the hype and bought the shaft,,,I took a normal shaft

given equal skill and equal time to learn the shaft... its a wash

so why spend the extra money on low deflection?

just learn the shaft you have.
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Here's where your logic breaks down. The amount of deflection varies significantly depending on how the CB is struck.

In order to be able to strike the exact CB impact point...and then to predict the amount of squirt that will result requires a superior amount of inate SKILL.

You cannot become a champion just by practicing as much as they do...or twice as much for that matter.

So, the reduction of variables, in and of it self (all other things being equal) will permit the vast majority of players to avoid errors.

Just start from the theoretical premise that there is a cue that would induce zero squirt so that there were no variables to adjust for.

Take two players with equal INATE skills and give one the High D cue and the other the No D cue. Which one plays better faster?

Just because players of EXCEPTIONAL inate skills can adjust for physical cue stick variables does not mean that a cue that reduces those variables is not a good idea.

And of course there are a LOT of top players that use Low D cues and none that use cheap bar cues for the obvious reason that the technology associated with superior cues makes them....well...superior.

Therefore, arguing that ONE example of superior technology (balance for example) is a good idea but another example (Low D) is not a good idea, does not stand the test of logic IMHO.

Regards,
Jim
 
Here is a test, Standard maple shaft V/S Tiger "X" Shaft I did tonight, the Red line is the "X" Shaft.. I repeated this same shot, and this proved to me, that even with the same butt, the "X" shaft is imparting more spin on the cue ball, BARE NONE. In this example I used Low Left, with a slightly evevated cue, EVERY time the tiger shaft applied more spin, so I PROVED it, Over a distance, The "X" Shaft applies more spin...


CueTable Help



SPINDOKTOR
 
SPINDOKTOR said:
Here is a test, Standard maple shaft V/S Tiger "X" Shaft I did tonight, the Red line is the "X" Shaft.. I repeated this same shot, and this proved to me, that even with the same butt, the "X" shaft is imparting more spin on the cue ball, BARE NONE. In this example I used Low Left, with a slightly evevated cue, EVERY time the tiger shaft applied more spin, so I PROVED it, Over a distance, The "X" Shaft applies more spin...


CueTable Help



SPINDOKTOR
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Spindoktor, I believe you can play rather well but do you think it's possible that these two shots were simply hit with different speeds of stroke or different amounts of elevation? It looks like the X Shaft path broke away from the intended path sooner than the maple shaft and that could have been caused by a slower speed of stroke or greater elevation.

I believe that the OB-1 shafts can provide more spin with the same effort. Whether the perceived extra spin is caused by the shaft, the tip, something in my head or an unconscious effort on my part, I don't know but I think Patrick usually has good tests for determining most things.

Did you try his test?


JoeyA
 
Are Tiger X shafts considered low deflection shafts?
They are not hollowed and the Saber T ferrules are not lightweight soft ferrules.
 
JoeyInCali said:
Are Tiger X shafts considered low deflection shafts?
They are not hollowed and the Saber T ferrules are not lightweight soft ferrules.
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Tiger X shafts are hallowed.
JoeyA
 
JoeyInCali said:
Are Tiger X shafts considered low deflection shafts?
They are not hollowed and the Saber T ferrules are not lightweight soft ferrules.
Click to expand...

The Platinum deflection shaft shows that the Tiger X shaft isn't a low deflection shaft. I would consider it as a shaft for consistent playing, but not a low deflection shaft.
 
consistency, is what we want

I say it like this you can stay closer to the center ball hit ( 1 cue tip away) where with regular shafts you have to use2 tips of english to get the same result. Look at all the testing by platinium billiards. Its all there. Where is your pivot point ? your pivot point is where you can use english and still hit the balls straight down the table! low deflection cues have a pivot point way dowm the shaft 20 inches. regular shafts 10-14 test your shaft. find the pivot point. use you bridge hand at the pivot point. Try a no (no) deflection tip. kamui- no proporsity.
 
I think you are mistaken

JoeyA said:
Tiger X shafts are hallowed.
JoeyA
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Joey,

I think you are mistaken this time. Pretty sure that they haven't even been beatified yet!

Hu
 
I'm Never Too Busy To Help Someone..... imo

JoeyA said:
Tiger X shafts are hallowed.
JoeyA
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Hmmmmmm,
Definition of hallowed:
Hallowed:Synonyms: anointed, beatified, blessed, consecrated, dedicated, divine, enshrined, holy, honored, inviolable, revered, sacred, sacrosanct, sanctified, unprofane

When I think of hollowed, I think of the song with the line, "I'd rather drink muddy water and sleep in a hollow log" ( I kinda remember Fred G. Sanford, that's SANFORD. singing that song). It 'might' be titled "Muddy Water".
Doug



Edited for spelling.
 
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I think Patrick usually has good tests for determining most things.
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The important thing is to control the variables (like the ones you mentioned), or you simply don't know what's causing what. All the rigamarole in my tests is for that purpose.

I'm sure SPINDOKTOR knows a lot about cues and pool, but just shooting some shots without making sure that things like aim, speed, spin and elevation don't change from shot to shot doesn't prove anything.

I'm betting that DOK hits shots differently with a low squirt shaft (you have to for normal shotmaking, right?) and doesn't realize it.

pj
chgo
 
Pat, let me further explain, I used my bank cue, whitch is a Lucasi with a shaft cut down to 12.8mm and a pressed Elk Master, the thing is English happy.. Using the same speed, and elevation (as close as possible) the Tiger shaft, is imparting more spin, and yes everytime, the cue ball did curve alot more than the Lucasi shaft did, I did this over and over, to prove one way or the other.. I did find However I can get as much with the lucasi shaft, but I had to jack up (as though I was shooting a long curve) No tiger Doesnt claim low deflection, and no the shaft isnt hollow, but it does get more "Stuff" it may be me, but I know without a doubt to me getting the spin I want is easier with the "X" Shaft, taper, tip, shaft construction, Im lost, when the cue ball reacts the way I want when I want it to I take notice, as these type cues (or shafts) to me is Highly reguarded and sought after..


No test is truely valid unless you have a fixture, like a robot for control. to many variables...


So I didnt prove anything, except to myself..


SPINDOKTOR






Patrick Johnson said:
The important thing is to control the variables (like the ones you mentioned), or you simply don't know what's causing what. All the rigamarole in my tests is for that purpose.

I'm sure SPINDOKTOR knows a lot about cues and pool, but just shooting some shots without making sure that things like aim, speed, spin and elevation don't change from shot to shot doesn't prove anything.

I'm betting that DOK hits shots differently with a low squirt shaft (you have to for normal shotmaking, right?) and doesn't realize it.

pj
chgo
Click to expand...
 
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