My L.A. trip and tight pockets

[jtompilot]

Flew into LAX Monday and went to Mr. Lucky's. Nice small room with friendly players. I remember Dave Hemmah from years ago, he works there and gives lessons. The three GC tables on the right have 4 1/8 corners. I play regularly on tight Diamond tables, but those Gold Crowns reject balls at an alarming rate. I froze 4 balls to the long rail and hit the first ball very hard, half the time the ball just wouldn't drop in. It looks like Ernesto extended the rails but didnt fix the pocket angles. WTF, I measured the angles at 144 degrees.

Tuesday, I visited Sportsman's Family Billiards. Lots of tables with friendly patrons. Three tables have 3 3/4 corners, ouch, that sure makes for some longer games but those Gold Crowns didn't reject well hit balls. I forgot to measure the pocket angles. Looks like I might be back there Monday for a few hours looking for more action.

 

[skip100]

These Ernesto tight tables are a scourge on the game here in California.

 

[mista335]

Are there people who think they are losing matches because the pockets are 4.5" ?

 

[Nick B]

I'm OK with tight. My issue is when the table surface is not level enough so that the tight pockets beat you. Tight pockets require a super premium setup in down-angle and table leveling. Anything else is like putting snow tires on a Ferrari.

 

[Dead Money]

I'm OK with tight. My issue is when the table surface is not level enough so that the tight pockets beat you. Tight pockets require a super premium setup in down-angle and table leveling. Anything else is like putting snow tires on a Ferrari.

Hahaha!

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[straightline]

Flew into LAX Monday and went to Mr. Lucky's. Nice small room with friendly players. I remember Dave Hemmah from years ago, he works there and gives lessons. The three GC tables on the right have 4 1/8 corners. I play regularly on tight Diamond tables, but those Gold Crowns reject balls at an alarming rate. I froze 4 balls to the long rail and hit the first ball very hard, half the time the ball just wouldn't drop in. It looks like Ernesto extended the rails but didnt fix the pocket angles. WTF, I measured the angles at 144 degrees.

Tuesday, I visited Sportsman's Family Billiards. Lots of tables with friendly patrons. Three tables have 3 3/4 corners, ouch, that sure makes for some longer games but those Gold Crowns didn't reject well hit balls. I forgot to measure the pocket angles. Looks like I might be back there Monday for a few hours looking for more action.

When Luckys was on Hawthorne they had valley style extra wides. 9 footers, but buckets doesn't begin to describe 'em. Vic and Lefty Al used to terrorize the area. Sounds like they've upgraded the crowd too.

 

[rexus31]

With 144° pocket angles, I don't think Ernesto did those pockets.

 

[hang-the-9]

Are there people who think they are losing matches because the pockets are 4.5" ?

I can tell you I lost some due to tighter pockets in a place that had various pocket sizes and they would play tournaments on a "streaming" table with pockets smaller than the rest of the room. All of a sudden there were balls that just barely missed. Tight pockets are great for practice and one pocket gambling but no so great for just playing and tournaments, especially if they don't stay consistent in a room. Speed is also an issue, a few big tournament rooms have tables that are noticeably quicker than others, and again cause issues when going from one to the other. And I've even played in events that were on 7 footers AND 9 footers in the same tournament LOL

 

[ChrisinNC]

With 144° pocket angles, I don't think Ernesto did those pockets.

That’s what I’m saying, unless they requested it be left at that.

 

[GoldCrown]

Yo Pilot… greetings from Boynton

 

[jtompilot]

With 144° pocket angles, I don't think Ernesto did those pockets.

Mr. Lucky’s web site says “tables maintained by Ernesto”. Maybe he didn’t do the rail extension but someone did a nice job except for the pocket angles.

I love tight pockets more than 99% of the people on AZ land, but those three tables are extra brutal. I’m at Buffalo’s now practicing on the 4 1/8” Diamond table now and it’s easy compared to those gaff tables.

 

[rexus31]

Mr. Lucky’s web site says “tables maintained by Ernesto”. Maybe he didn’t do the rail extension but someone did a nice job except for the pocket angles.

I love tight pockets more than 99% of the people on AZ land, but those three tables are extra brutal. I’m at Buffalo’s now practicing on the 4 1/8” Diamond table now and it’s easy compared to those gaff tables.

The website could have outdated info. The only way Ernesto did the tables that way was at the request of the room owner and even then I would wager Ernesto tried talking them out of it.

 

[jtompilot]

The website could have outdated info. The only way Ernesto did the tables that way was at the request of the room owner and even then I would wager Ernesto tried talking them out of it.

Sorry to burst your bubble but several sources have confirmed there are lots of Ernesto gaff tables around the state of California.

 

[rexus31]

Sorry to burst your bubble but several sources have confirmed there are lots of Ernesto gaff tables around the state of California.

No bubble to burst. Anything is possible. None of the Hard Time tables were like that and all my buddies who had Ernesto do rail work did not have pockets cut like that. Don't know what to tell you.

 

[rogwin]

Mr. Lucky’s web site says “tables maintained by Ernesto”. Maybe he didn’t do the rail extension but someone did a nice job except for the pocket angles.

I love tight pockets more than 99% of the people on AZ land, but those three tables are extra brutal. I’m at Buffalo’s now practicing on the 4 1/8” Diamond table now and it’s easy compared to those gaff tables.

Where’s Buffalo?


Sent from my iPhone using AzBilliards Forums

 

[ChrisinNC]

No bubble to burst. Anything is possible. None of the Hard Time tables were like that and all my buddies who had Ernesto do rail work did not have pockets cut like that. Don't know what to tell you.

25 years ago In 1998, Ernesto first came to our room and extended the subrails on some of our Connelly Ultimate tables. One of them we wanted extra tight and ended up at 3-3/4” mouths. The pocket facing angles were virtually parallel and the pocket throat was nearly eliminated.

Although they played extremely tight, balls did not rattle at all - they either made it in the jaws and fell, or completely missed the pocket.

Even back then Ernesto was well aware of the concept that if you tighten the pocket mouths considerably you must alter the pocket facing angles. In fact he insisted on it, in order for the table to be playable.

 

[rexus31]

Also worth noting that just because someone services the tables, it doesn’t mean they did the pockets. Those pockets could very well have been cut by someone else.

 

[jay helfert]

When Luckys was on Hawthorne they had valley style extra wides. 9 footers, but buckets doesn't begin to describe 'em. Vic and Lefty Al used to terrorize the area. Sounds like they've upgraded the crowd too.

Mr. Lucky is still in the same location on Hawthorne Blvd. Got new ownership nearly twenty years ago and many upgrades including Diamond small tables. Vic and Al didn’t terrorize us at my room at Hollywood Park. Only guy who ever did was a young TRex.

My last glory days. I was in my late 50’s and knew that front table like the back of my hand. Took down some nice scores playing One Pocket and Banks, and the brothers were calling me the King of the Ghetto.

I was so frickin proud and then big fat Tony had to ruin my party. In front of a packed house he spotted me 8-4 for 300 a game and wiped the floor with me. I didn’t win a game! And people were betting on me. I was so embarrassed that I didn’t come out of my office until after Tony left and went downstairs to the poker room. He had his bankroll now, thanks to me.

 

[Charlie Hustle]

Mr. Lucky is still in the same location on Hawthorne Blvd. Got new ownership nearly twenty years ago and many upgrades including Diamond small tables. Vic and Al didn’t terrorize us at my room at Hollywood Park. Only guy who ever did was a young TRex.

My last glory days. I was in my late 50’s and knew that front table like the back of my hand. Took down some nice scores playing One Pocket and Banks, and the brothers were calling me the King of the Ghetto.

I was so frickin proud and then big fat Tony had to ruin my party. In front of a packed house he spotted me 8-4 for 300 a game and wiped the floor with me. I didn’t win a game! And people were betting on me. I was so embarrassed that I didn’t come out of my office until after Tony left and went downstairs to the poker room. He had his bankroll now, thanks to me.

How many games stuck did you end up?

 

[straightline]

Mr. Lucky is still in the same location on Hawthorne Blvd. Got new ownership nearly twenty years ago and many upgrades including Diamond small tables. Vic and Al didn’t terrorize us at my room at Hollywood Park. Only guy who ever did was a young TRex.

My last glory days. I was in my late 50’s and knew that front table like the back of my hand. Took down some nice scores playing One Pocket and Banks, and the brothers were calling me the King of the Ghetto.

I was so frickin proud and then big fat Tony had to ruin my party. In front of a packed house he spotted me 8-4 for 300 a game and wiped the floor with me. I didn’t win a game! And people were betting on me. I was so embarrassed that I didn’t come out of my office until after Tony left and went downstairs to the poker room. He had his bankroll now, thanks to me.

Are they really still on that stretch before the bend that runs across Western? I somehow got the impression they had relocated to the north/south segment. I remember the original place was in some strip mall or something and the owner parked his Merc on the curb right outside.
As for Vic and Al, I was never in the loop, just enamored of players that could string racks. I never even made it to Hollywood Billiards - had no idea where it was. I did run into a guitarist that told me it was above a rehearsal studio on Sunset. Probably a good thing your place escaped my curiosity.

Chohan must've been a shock. Did he soft break you? Last one hole move I learned. Worse than golf. lol...