My Rant "Put Up and Shut Up"

D

Dave in Boston

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Why is pool so under rated and left out as a sport. I will give you my opinion why and I have thought this for years.

MONEY

Its really simple money drives everything and pool has none. Why doesn’t pool have any money, everyone blames the industry and the sponsors and the tourney directors or the promoters.
.
The people who think this way are wrong in my opinion.

The PLAYERS themselves should be held responsible and why because they wont put up, and shut up. I think it’s rather funny that the biggest tourney over the past decade is the US open with a top prize of what ten to twenty thousand dollars for first. Damn the local semis pro golf tourneys around the country crush that. Poker, Golf and Bowling beat pool all day long for the prize pools and why the ENTRY FEE!!!

The US Open one of the biggest and most prestigious pool tourney in the country has a 500 dollar entry fee that is terrible. Come on pool players are playing ten a head for thousands but when it comes to the BIG tourneys the wont put up and all they do is complain that there isn’t money in pool so the have to gamble to stay alive. Take some of that gambling money and put it into the tourneys.

Once you have bigger entries into these you will start attracting bigger sponsors and bigger crowds etc etc.

Pool players are only thinking about themselves also, they think everyone trying to steal and cheat them. Do you know how much money the World Series of Poker main event generated last year just from entry fees? 5,000+ participants times 500 bucks per person = 250,000 dollars. Damn I will run a tourney for a week to make that cash, but pool players would think they were getting cheated out of 250K so it would never happen.

So what should happen, pool players should take some lessons from the other three “Recreational” sports that are making it big.

I know poker has taken off because of its popularity and “ANY” body can win motto, but before this poker was still a big money game and still had backing. So just like poker Put Up or shut up raise the entry fees and see bigger payouts.

Once you have bigger prize pools and bigger stakes, then the bigger backers and sponsors come out and play. Look at Bowling they have million dollar tourneys with HUGE sponsors. Why because they have a system in place and organization a tour that they pay into and get something out of.

Golf is what everyone is striving towards but even the lower levels you have to pay into before you receive the bigger pay days when you and if you hit the top rung.

What did the top tourney pro make last year in winnings what was his top money finish. Now go look at the lowest of golfers and some of the weaker bowlers out there (and don’t even think about poker) and tell me there is something wrong.

AND THAT WRONG STARTS WITH THE PLAYERS

Put Up or Shut up.

Sorry about the rambling just had to get my opinion out there normally don’t do this type of stuff.

Dave
 
Dave in Boston said:
Do you know how much money the World Series of Poker main event generated last year just from entry fees? 5,000+ participants times 500 bucks per person = 250,000 dollars.Dave
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The main event has a $10,000 entry fee.
 
Personally, I think they need to stop trying to clean up the image of the sport and make it more gambling-centric, just like poker. I could care less when people are competing for prize money, even a lot of prize money. But it would be a whole lot more interesting if the players had to bet against one another. That way, there'd be the chance they could lose their money. It would be a gamble for them. That's why poker is so interesting to watch. If you lose, you're out money. They should get the players to haggle over handicaps and haggle over bets. That'd be a lot more interesting than just watching them play each other, with the winner getting a big cardboard check at the end, as they do now.
 
bobroberts said:
Yeah but there are satalities that you can enter for much less.
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Yeah, I do know that, I've played in those. Also, there's more than just the main event at the W.S.O.P., there's about 43 other tournaments leading up to the main event with entry fee's ranging from as little as $1k up to the main event of $10k. Don't quote me on the 43 though, but it is around that number.
 
pool has that now . . .

It is called "Ball Breakers" on GSN. I do find it somewhat entertaining mostly because they can be counted on to feature a young lady or two who is fearful of suffocating if she is wearing too much clothing and because of the damned fool betting. Pool has became purely a sidelight and betting is the show. Stupid side bets that only a moron should make often determine the winner. I don't know if that is because of show rules and policies or if people truly lose their minds when blasted with TV lighting.

The show has so little to do with pool that it seems like we could leave pool out of the equation. Scantily clad women, gambling, no need for pool. They can gamble on anything.

Hu


Njhustler1 said:
Personally, I think they need to stop trying to clean up the image of the sport and make it more gambling-centric, just like poker. I could care less when people are competing for prize money, even a lot of prize money. But it would be a whole lot more interesting if the players had to bet against one another. That way, there'd be the chance they could lose their money. It would be a gamble for them. That's why poker is so interesting to watch. If you lose, you're out money. They should get the players to haggle over handicaps and haggle over bets. That'd be a lot more interesting than just watching them play each other, with the winner getting a big cardboard check at the end, as they do now.
Click to expand...
 
Dave in Boston said:
Why is pool so under rated and left out as a sport. I will give you my opinion why and I have thought this for years.

MONEY

Its really simple money drives everything and pool has none. Why doesn’t pool have any money, everyone blames the industry and the sponsors and the tourney directors or the promoters.
.
The people who think this way are wrong in my opinion.

The PLAYERS themselves should be held responsible and why because they wont put up, and shut up. I think it’s rather funny that the biggest tourney over the past decade is the US open with a top prize of what ten to twenty thousand dollars for first. Damn the local semis pro golf tourneys around the country crush that. Poker, Golf and Bowling beat pool all day long for the prize pools and why the ENTRY FEE!!!

The US Open one of the biggest and most prestigious pool tourney in the country has a 500 dollar entry fee that is terrible. Come on pool players are playing ten a head for thousands but when it comes to the BIG tourneys the wont put up and all they do is complain that there isn’t money in pool so the have to gamble to stay alive. Take some of that gambling money and put it into the tourneys.

Once you have bigger entries into these you will start attracting bigger sponsors and bigger crowds etc etc.

Pool players are only thinking about themselves also, they think everyone trying to steal and cheat them. Do you know how much money the World Series of Poker main event generated last year just from entry fees? 5,000+ participants times 500 bucks per person = 250,000 dollars. Damn I will run a tourney for a week to make that cash, but pool players would think they were getting cheated out of 250K so it would never happen.

So what should happen, pool players should take some lessons from the other three “Recreational” sports that are making it big.

I know poker has taken off because of its popularity and “ANY” body can win motto, but before this poker was still a big money game and still had backing. So just like poker Put Up or shut up raise the entry fees and see bigger payouts.

Once you have bigger prize pools and bigger stakes, then the bigger backers and sponsors come out and play. Look at Bowling they have million dollar tourneys with HUGE sponsors. Why because they have a system in place and organization a tour that they pay into and get something out of.

Golf is what everyone is striving towards but even the lower levels you have to pay into before you receive the bigger pay days when you and if you hit the top rung.

What did the top tourney pro make last year in winnings what was his top money finish. Now go look at the lowest of golfers and some of the weaker bowlers out there (and don’t even think about poker) and tell me there is something wrong.

AND THAT WRONG STARTS WITH THE PLAYERS

Put Up or Shut up.

Sorry about the rambling just had to get my opinion out there normally don’t do this type of stuff.

Dave
Click to expand...


There are quite a few holes in your post. Money doesn't come out of thin air. Want to make money in any business? All you have to do is make it worth while for others to be in business with you, you make money when you make money for other people as well. Pool has nothing to offer a sponsor other then the chance to lose money. It would be a tough pitch to a potential sponsor, they would pass every time.
 
Njhustler1 said:
Personally, I think they need to stop trying to clean up the image of the sport and make it more gambling-centric, just like poker. I could care less when people are competing for prize money, even a lot of prize money. But it would be a whole lot more interesting if the players had to bet against one another. That way, there'd be the chance they could lose their money. It would be a gamble for them. That's why poker is so interesting to watch. If you lose, you're out money. They should get the players to haggle over handicaps and haggle over bets. That'd be a lot more interesting than just watching them play each other, with the winner getting a big cardboard check at the end, as they do now.
Click to expand...

Hmmm... where have I heard this before?? :D

I totally agree with you by the way.
 
Hey guys, I can tell you how to MAKE A SMALL FORTUNE IN POOL!!!!!!,.........................start with a large fortune.

Signed,
Bill Giles (obscure reference)
 
Dave in Boston said:
The US Open one of the biggest and most prestigious pool tourney in the country has a 500 dollar entry fee that is terrible.
Click to expand...

Just out of curiousity, what is the entry fee for golf's US Open? Not the cost of qualifiers and such if you aren't already in. I'm asking, what does Tiger or Vijay pay when they show up?
 
Njhustler1 said:
Personally, I think they need to stop trying to clean up the image of the sport and make it more gambling-centric, just like poker. I could care less when people are competing for prize money, even a lot of prize money. But it would be a whole lot more interesting if the players had to bet against one another. That way, there'd be the chance they could lose their money. It would be a gamble for them. That's why poker is so interesting to watch. If you lose, you're out money. They should get the players to haggle over handicaps and haggle over bets. That'd be a lot more interesting than just watching them play each other, with the winner getting a big cardboard check at the end, as they do now.
Click to expand...

THAT IS ONE SWEET AVATAR!!!! IT ROCKS. CAN I MAKE A T-SHIRT WITH THAT LOGO ON IT?????

SWEET!

John
 
Exempt players pay nothing...when you enter regional qualifying I think I paid about $300 with all the fees last time I tried to qualify.
 
Jimmy M. said:
Just out of curiousity, what is the entry fee for golf's US Open? Not the cost of qualifiers and such if you aren't already in. I'm asking, what does Tiger or Vijay pay when they show up?
Click to expand...
Well, back in the day when I was winning every other tournament on tour, 62-63, I didn't pay a dime. But nowadays, they just pay me to NOT show up. So, as far as entry fee's go, I couldn't tell ya but if you read this far into my post I could probably get away with saying any amount, soooooooooo, let's go with...........1 million dollar entry fee's. :D (Sorry, meds haven't kicked in yet.)
 
Raodwarior said:
Exempt players pay nothing...when you enter regional qualifying I think I paid about $300 with all the fees last time I tried to qualify.
Click to expand...

I believe US Open qualifiers have a $125 entry fee. Also, while the actual US Open does not have entry fees, The Open (British Open to some) has an entry fee of 100 pounds (about $162 US) that Tiger and Vijay would have to pay along with all other entrants.

Dave
 
Raodwarior said:
Exempt players pay nothing...when you enter regional qualifying I think I paid about $300 with all the fees last time I tried to qualify.
Click to expand...

I actually had an idea but I didn't want to spout off without knowing the facts. Thanks. :)

These posts where someone is trying to place all of the blame on the industry or all of the blame on the players really are ridiculous. As the old saying goes, you can't squeeze blood out of a turnip. The players are playing $10,000 sets on SOMEONE ELSE'S MONEY in 95% (not a scientific estimate) of these big matches that we hear about. Not to mention, when we hear about these big matches, they always involve the same small group of players. It isn't like every player out there has dough and is betting it up. If the players out there all had tens of thousands of dollars of their own to throw around, then why would they care about the current, financial state of pool? Many pool players that I know who only play pool for a living, whether they'll admit to it or not, walk around with their life savings in their front pocket. How much more money does anyone think they can afford to put into the tournaments?
 
Jimmy M. said:
I actually had an idea but I didn't want to spout off without knowing the facts. Thanks. :)
Click to expand...

It doesn't usually stop some people on here! ;-)

Jimmy M. said:
These posts where someone is trying to place all of the blame on the industry or all of the blame on the players really are ridiculous.
Click to expand...

Well said

Jimmy M. said:
The players are playing $10,000 sets on SOMEONE ELSE'S MONEY in 95% (not a scientific estimate) of these big matches that we hear about.
Click to expand...

Don't worry, 98.983% of all statistics are made up on the spot! :D
 
Dave in Boston said:
Do you know how much money the World Series of Poker main event generated last year just from entry fees? 5,000+ participants times 500 bucks per person = 250,000 dollars.
Click to expand...
5,000 X $500 = $2.5 Million ;)

Tracy
 
Dave - You forgot one BIG component!

I agree with a lot of what you have said about the players & such - BUT - You’re forgetting the main reason why pool isn't watched by the masses.

IT IS NOT A VERY WATCHABLE GAME UNLESS YOU ARE AT LEAST SOME KIND OF A PLAYER OR ENTHUSIEST.

I would venture to say that "Joe Six-Pack" would watch "BallBreakers" BEFORE ever watching The US Open.
He has NO idea what is going on or what it takes to do the shots he is seeing.
The average TV viewer has no understanding or comprehension of pool & could care less.

IMO - For pool to become viewer friendly it will have to bring something new & novel to the game to succeed. Like Poker showing the hole card, there needs to be something to get the audience involved and interested.
First you get the viewers.
Then you get the sponsors.
Now you got the money.

Whatever it is going to be, I don't think it is going to involve the top players (and thank God) because you would have a better chance of herding 10,000 Cats in the Grand Canyon.

There will have to be some kind of viewer participation or maybe voting (better yet, Gambling) to grab their interest.

Remember - "Joe Six-Pack" thinks no more about Pool than he does about Badminton.

TY & GL
 
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