Next Question?

[Brickman]

I have a small wobble in my cuesmith lathe and cant figure out how to stop or fix it. What should I do for this. To me it just doesnt seem like I can get the precision I need with every shaft wobbling slightly.


SO WHAT DO I DO? I dont have the EXP to really know what is going on so this may be normal so I thought I would ask some of you seasoned fellows.

 

[JBCustomCues]

what do you mean a wobble in your lathe?

 

[Craig Fales]

Do you mean wobbling as in warped shafts or something in the lathe itself?
________

 

[Michael Webb]

I have a small wobble in my cuesmith lathe and cant figure out how to stop or fix it. What should I do for this. To me it just doesnt seem like I can get the precision I need with every shaft wobbling slightly.


SO WHAT DO I DO? I dont have the EXP to really know what is going on so this may be normal so I thought I would ask some of you seasoned fellows.

Honestly, call Chris. I'm sure he has experienced every possible senarial for his machine, Very good to deal with and very knowledgeable.

 

[Ridge Runner]

Are you talking about dead center wobbling when you chuck up on it? If so, it sometimes takes several attempts to get it running true due to the small O.D. of the dead center. I made a larger O.D. dead center for mine (.800" )and that made it much easier. Chris told me the jaws are cut at 1.375" radius if I recall correctly.
John

 

[Brickman]

thanks guys!!!!!!

What I mean is ....not one shaft will turn without a small wobble. It may very well be the chuck thing but I really am at a loss here.


I may Call Chris.....I just hate calling and aggrivating him over this little stuff, when I know I will need him later on for BIGGER things LOL

 

[ShootingArts]

alignment

I have alignment issues with my Cuesmith Deluxe so that could be your problem or you could be putting too much end pressure on shafts.

Hu

thanks guys!!!!!!

What I mean is ....not one shaft will turn without a small wobble. It may very well be the chuck thing but I really am at a loss here.


I may Call Chris.....I just hate calling and aggrivating him over this little stuff, when I know I will need him later on for BIGGER things LOL

 

[Michael Webb]

End pressure is a huge factor, the other is spindle drive versus feep speed.

 

[William]

Have you tried indicating the chuck ?, to see what it runs at ? Even the most expensive items have some "runout". I mean how much wobble are you talking about?

 

[Cue Crazy]

You need to rechuck it until you get it right. Also word of advice, if you don't already own a indicator, then you definatly need one.
If You have crashed the lathe by some chance, or Your chuck is sticking when you close or open it, then you may have burs in the scroll which requires you to tear the jaws down and file the burs off. They will throw the centering off also. Don't turn anything down unless you have that piece perfectly centered or It will come back to haunt you, as with any lathe.
If You need help contact Chris, or even me, because I had simular problems early on that he was of great help with, but they are usually something that can be controlled By the operator. After a while you get used to shimming for some operations that require that( not due to the lathe just the work pieces you put in it), but on average you should'nt have to do anything , but possibly rechuck until you get it centerd. If you have to rechuck more then 5-7 times, and you know the work piece should run true, then you may want to look deeper into the problem. Keep in mind though, as someone mentioned I believe, sometimes the work piece just has alot of runout. It's rare that a used shaft does'nt have atleast some amount of runout.

Not sure which lathe you have, but I have the deluxe, if I can be of any help PM me and I will help however I can.

Wood does not always chuck up perfectly either. so honestly Give it atleast 5-7 times to be sure. you can always stick a center in the jaws, and one in the tailstock to see how they line up, but that will only tell you so much, and not a sure thing, since your tailstock may just be off.

Lastly, and I do not recomend this, but if worse came to worse You may have the option to bore the jaws true to the lathe. this would be a last resort though when all else has failed, and you should'nt have to go that route.

After a while you won't even need the indicator for basic repair, because you will learn to see the runout within it's limits, and know if the piece is chucked up correctly, but when doing a build, you want it as perfect as possibly, and sticking with the indicator is not such a bad thing.

Good Luck, Greg

 

[iusedtoberich]

I just recently completely gave up on 3 jaw chucks. I now use independent 4 jaw chucks, even for tip jobs, and I couldn't be happier. It takes me about a minute to center a shaft, but I always get it within one or two thousandths and it is WELL worth the effort to me. Before I made this switch, I would sometimes spend 5 minutes trying to find the "magic spot" using a 3 jaw chuck with certain shafts. Some shafts would line up perfectly the first try, but many required to many repositioning efforts. I have bored my chuck jaws several times but I've never been satisfied with the chucks accuracy.

I also think it is very important to have a true running shaft, even for a tip job. When the shaft doesn't run true, the radius on the tip is not even, and the line where the curve intersects the side of the tip will be crooked. This is no problem with a 4 jaw chuck, even for a shaft that is way out of whack.

In the machinist world, a 4 jaw chuck is one of the most accurate workholding methods, even more accurate than a collet. Because it allows you the ability to obtain any level of accuracy you desire. Its drawback is it is slower than other workholding methods. In contrast, a 3 jaw chuck is usually considered the most inaccurate workholding method.

 

[Arnot Wadsworth]

3 Jaw - 4 Jaw ???

I just recently completely gave up on 3 jaw chucks. I now use independent 4 jaw chucks, even for tip jobs, and I couldn't be happier. It takes me about a minute to center a shaft, but I always get it within one or two thousandths and it is WELL worth the effort to me. Before I made this switch, I would sometimes spend 5 minutes trying to find the "magic spot" using a 3 jaw chuck with certain shafts. Some shafts would line up perfectly the first try, but many required to many repositioning efforts. I have bored my chuck jaws several times but I've never been satisfied with the chucks accuracy.

I also think it is very important to have a true running shaft, even for a tip job. When the shaft doesn't run true, the radius on the tip is not even, and the line where the curve intersects the side of the tip will be crooked. This is no problem with a 4 jaw chuck, even for a shaft that is way out of whack.

In the machinist world, a 4 jaw chuck is one of the most accurate workholding methods, even more accurate than a collet. Because it allows you the ability to obtain any level of accuracy you desire. Its drawback is it is slower than other workholding methods. In contrast, a 3 jaw chuck is usually considered the most inaccurate workholding method.

I don't think anyone should pay attention to something said by someone who does not sign his name or qualifications.

Rules that apply to machinist' do not always apply to working with wood. Cuemaking is a combination of woodworking and metal working combined with a whole bunch of trial and error and learned the hard way. I don't see any reason to use a 4 jaw chuck with wood.

I can tell you this - my 3 jaw chuck will repeat within .001 indicated runout and if I need it closer than that I can add a piece of cigarette paper to the high side jaw. Trying to center a piece of wood with a 4 jaw chuck (especially a shaft) runs the risk of large dents in the wood. If you have a bad chuck either repair it or get a new one.

With wood it can vary over .001 from side to side but a precision made Delrin collet to slip over the wood really helps to get it centered and eliminates dents.

Good cuemaking,

 

[Murray Tucker]

I have either Buck adjust-tru or Bison set-tru chucks on my lathes. These are three jaw chucks with four adjustment screws for fine tuning. I indicate everything before I turn it. Regular chucks are great if what you are turning is round but in the case of repairs round can go out the window quick.

I just recently completely gave up on 3 jaw chucks. I now use independent 4 jaw chucks, even for tip jobs, and I couldn't be happier. It takes me about a minute to center a shaft, but I always get it within one or two thousandths and it is WELL worth the effort to me. Before I made this switch, I would sometimes spend 5 minutes trying to find the "magic spot" using a 3 jaw chuck with certain shafts. Some shafts would line up perfectly the first try, but many required to many repositioning efforts. I have bored my chuck jaws several times but I've never been satisfied with the chucks accuracy.

I also think it is very important to have a true running shaft, even for a tip job. When the shaft doesn't run true, the radius on the tip is not even, and the line where the curve intersects the side of the tip will be crooked. This is no problem with a 4 jaw chuck, even for a shaft that is way out of whack.

In the machinist world, a 4 jaw chuck is one of the most accurate workholding methods, even more accurate than a collet. Because it allows you the ability to obtain any level of accuracy you desire. Its drawback is it is slower than other workholding methods. In contrast, a 3 jaw chuck is usually considered the most inaccurate workholding method.

 

[iusedtoberich]

What difference would it make if I gave my name? Very few people on here know what my name is, and even fewer would recognize it if I were to give it out.

I will say I have had a hammer in my hands as of 6 years old, and I have been a woodworker ever since. I also have worked as a machinists for 3 years under 4 tool and die makers. I am no expert, but I know a fair amount about machining. I am currently a mechanical engineer. And for the last 10 years I have been doing basic cue repair. So do you think I am somewhat qualified even though I didn't sign my name?

Finally, my advice was very sound. Many of you have great luck with 3 jaws, but I have never been satisfied with them. I offered another method that is surefire to work. Yes, it is slower, but it works every time, and it works with great precision. Murray, who we all know is a machinist in his full time job, gave the same solution I did. The chuck he is using, an adjust-tru, works just like a 4 jaw chuck, in the way it allows centering of work on an INDIVIDUAL workpiece situation.

I stopped posting here a while ago, because some people just wouldn't accept advice that was different from their methods. One of the most important things I learned when working as a machinist is "there are a million ways to skin a cat". Rather than criticize me for not signing my name, why don't you look at what I wrote and judge its content.

I don't think anyone should pay attention to something said by someone who does not sign his name or qualifications.

Rules that apply to machinist' do not always apply to working with wood. Cuemaking is a combination of woodworking and metal working combined with a whole bunch of trial and error and learned the hard way. I don't see any reason to use a 4 jaw chuck with wood.

I can tell you this - my 3 jaw chuck will repeat within .001 indicated runout and if I need it closer than that I can add a piece of cigarette paper to the high side jaw. Trying to center a piece of wood with a 4 jaw chuck (especially a shaft) runs the risk of large dents in the wood. If you have a bad chuck either repair it or get a new one.

With wood it can vary over .001 from side to side but a precision made Delrin collet to slip over the wood really helps to get it centered and eliminates dents.

Good cuemaking,

 

[iusedtoberich]

I would also like to add that nowhere in my post did I say I don't use a protective collet between the chuck jaws and the shaft. Why wouldn't one use them with a different type of chuck? We all know they are essential to protect the shaft, no matter how you hold it.

 

[Arnot Wadsworth]

Murray, who we all know is a machinist in his full time job, gave the same solution I did. The chuck he is using, an adjust-tru, works just like a 4 jaw chuck, in the way it allows centering of work on an INDIVIDUAL workpiece situation.

I stopped posting here a while ago, because some people just wouldn't accept advice that was different from their methods. One of the most important things I learned when working as a machinist is "there are a million ways to skin a cat". Rather than criticize me for not signing my name, why don't you look at what I wrote and judge its content.

The Murray I know who has visited my shop and home did not agree with you. He uses a 3 jaw chuck - just as every other cuemaker I know does.

I did read what you posted and I do not agree with you. I have build a couple of thousand cues since I started and I have never needed to use a 4 jaw chuck to get anything centered. Maybe that is because I make cues full time and am very familiar with my equipment. In the beginning I had a lot of trouble.

If I were working in metal I might have to use a 4 jaw chuck from time to time but most of the time a good 3 jaw chuck will be fine.

You don't need a 4 jaw chuck to do precision work.

Good cuemaking,

 

[Murray Tucker]

The Murray I know who has visited my shop and home did not agree with you. He uses a 3 jaw chuck - just as every other cuemaker I know does.

I did read what you posted and I do not agree with you. I have build a couple of thousand cues since I started and I have never needed to use a 4 jaw chuck to get anything centered. Maybe that is because I make cues full time and am very familiar with my equipment. In the beginning I had a lot of trouble.

If I were working in metal I might have to use a 4 jaw chuck from time to time but most of the time a good 3 jaw chuck will be fine.

You don't need a 4 jaw chuck to do precision work.

Good cuemaking,

Just to make sure that nobody misunderstands me I do use three jaw (and one 6 jaw) chucks. But these chucks have adjustment screws so that they can be adjusted like a 4 jaw. The difference is that the whole chuck body moves, not just the jaws as is the case with a 4 jaw unit. I indicate everthing that goes in my lathe. Hell I even indicate a new roll of toilet paper when I put it on the holder

 

[cueman]

I am not sure if you are meaning the ferrule end of the shaft is not turing true when doing ferrule work or that a shaft wobble between centers. If it is a ferrule issue most likely you need to true up the jaws with a boring bar. Do not do this without calling me for instructions first. If it is the shaft between centers it can be any combination of the following. First the chuck ahs run out. Second the lathe pin has run out. Third the face of the shaft is not true. This one is especially true with piloted joint shafts like schon and joss and such. Forth the tailstock could be out of line thus bending shaft to hit center. My guesss is you have some combination of the above possiblilities. If you want me to help you trouble shoot it call me.
Chris
www.cuesmith.com
www.internationalcuemakers.com

 

[Brickman]

I am not sure if you are meaning the ferrule end of the shaft is not turing true when doing ferrule work or that a shaft wobble between centers. If it is a ferrule issue most likely you need to true up the jaws with a boring bar. Do not do this without calling me for instructions first. If it is the shaft between centers it can be any combination of the following. First the chuck ahs run out. Second the lathe pin has run out. Third the face of the shaft is not true. This one is especially true with piloted joint shafts like schon and joss and such. Forth the tailstock could be out of line thus bending shaft to hit center. My guesss is you have some combination of the above possiblilities. If you want me to help you trouble shoot it call me.
Chris
www.cuesmith.com
www.internationalcuemakers.com

THANKS CHRIS

I am noticing it more when I do a tip or face off a ferrule than anything. As the lathe stops turning I can really see the wobble. Like I said maybe it is me, and I just dont have the exp. yet to really know the difference.

I know I can call you , and I prolly will if I cant get this worked out.....and as far as boring the chuck, I wouldnt worry about me doing that before I called you

LIKE I SAID it really is prolly just something I am missing, and maybe with a little practice and trial and error I will see and learn to adjust the problem.....if not You will MOST likely hear from me again LOL

 

[rhncue]

THANKS CHRIS

I am noticing it more when I do a tip or face off a ferrule than anything. As the lathe stops turning I can really see the wobble. Like I said maybe it is me, and I just dont have the exp. yet to really know the difference.

I know I can call you , and I prolly will if I cant get this worked out.....and as far as boring the chuck, I wouldnt worry about me doing that before I called you

LIKE I SAID it really is prolly just something I am missing, and maybe with a little practice and trial and error I will see and learn to adjust the problem.....if not You will MOST likely hear from me again LOL

Are you using any soft colletts when doing tip work? If so, they may be to long. The jaws in a lathe are perfectly straight, at least they are supposed to be. The jaws can be anywhere from 1.25 to 3" in length. Since most shafts are tapered, when you tighten the jaws around the shaft often just the back edge of the jaws are contacting the shaft instead of the entire ferrule and this can make the end of the ferrule oscilate (spelling). I have a number of Delrin colletts made up to fit my tip lathe that are between 1/4 and1/2" long. In this way the taper of the shaft doesn't affect the alignment between shaft and chuck.

Dick