No holy grail?

tucson9ball

tucson9ball

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I remember a few years ago writing one of my first posts about pool having "NO" Holy Grail. I simply meant that there was no quick fix, or gadget that would make the average Joe a road player or Pro.

I have seen and heard of soooo many aiming systems or some non-aiming systems that would improve your game it makes me want to puke. :rolleyes:

Now don't get me wrong, I have no problem with people wanting to make a buck, with whatever their selling. Buyer beware.....all these gimmicks should have a disclaimer: hard work/practice is it's own reward.

If anybody beleives they can buy a jump cue and never miss a jump shot, their simply dreaming. If you buy a high dollar piece of chalk thinking you will never miscue? Cmon! Folks...wake up and smell the coffee! If you don't want to invest the time/effort to practice, then you will never be good. For some players, even practice won't improve their game much, brutal but honest. No magic elixir will make you play like Johnny Archer or Efren.

Some people were just born with hand/eye coordination that is unequalled. Combine that with hard work and years of drills, WHOALA! You have a world champ!

I have seem Earl Strickland or Corey Dueul put a stroke on a ball that 99.9% of pool players could never imagine or imitate. That is what it takes to be an elite player. The rest of us just watch ot participate on pool forums. Sure, we may be a good amateur player, but honestly, do you think you could compete at the Pro level? Not happening.

I play pool for a hobby, sure I compete in tournies(not Pro events), but I'm honest about my game. I work 40 hours a week at a paying job. I have no aspirations of being a Pro player. Does that mean I don't want to improve a bit? No........Does it mean I want to go to extremes andpractice 4 to 5 hours every day? Nope

I'm just the average Joe who plays pool, nothing more. Do I beleive there is some gadget that will make me play 2 balls better? NOPE, definitely not. So. to all you guys buying up DVD's and charts to get better......do yourselves a favor, work on your strok/follow through. Hit the spot you are aiming at and get the "feel" of the proper ball speed.

Here's a perfect example: have somebody stand across the table from you and toss them the cue ball. Did you throw it over their head? Did you throw sooo soft that it falls on the table between you? Or did you toss it right where they could catch it? THAT FOLKS is "FEEL" Translated to pool lingo, it would be "how hard to hit the cue ball to get shape"? How much draw makes the cue ball come bacward 2 ft.? I could go on and on...but all this is learned from practice. No gimmick or aiming/non-aiming is going to teach this.

KK, I'm done ranting. :eek: Keep hitting em. :thumbup:
 
So in summary:

To get better you should practice and most people will never play as well as the best in the world no matter what equipment they use.

That seems to be the case in every game/hobby/skill/job I have ever been involved in.

Edit to add: I see no problem with trying to improve through whatever means someone chooses. Part of that whole practice thing is practicing the right stuff. If you dont know the right stuff you have to learn it somewhere. You also have to learn what really is the right stuff. Someone practicing a shitty stroke for ten years is still going to end up with a shitty stroke.
 
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I agree. We have to have things in the proper order.

PROCESS
DELIVERY
ALIGNMENT
SPEED
AIMING

Any one without the others makes life tough.

randyg
 
tucson9ball said:
I remember a few years ago writing one of my first posts about pool having "NO" Holy Grail. I simply meant that there was no quick fix, or gadget that would make the average Joe a road player or Pro.

I have seen and heard of soooo many aiming systems or some non-aiming systems that would improve your game it makes me want to puke. :rolleyes:

Now don't get me wrong, I have no problem with people wanting to make a buck, with whatever their selling. Buyer beware.....all these gimmicks should have a disclaimer: hard work/practice is it's own reward.

If anybody beleives they can buy a jump cue and never miss a jump shot, their simply dreaming. If you buy a high dollar piece of chalk thinking you will never miscue? Cmon! Folks...wake up and smell the coffee! If you don't want to invest the time/effort to practice, then you will never be good. For some players, even practice won't improve their game much, brutal but honest. No magic elixir will make you play like Johnny Archer or Efren.

Some people were just born with hand/eye coordination that is unequalled. Combine that with hard work and years of drills, WHOALA! You have a world champ!

I have seem Earl Strickland or Corey Dueul put a stroke on a ball that 99.9% of pool players could never imagine or imitate. That is what it takes to be an elite player. The rest of us just watch ot participate on pool forums. Sure, we may be a good amateur player, but honestly, do you think you could compete at the Pro level? Not happening.

I play pool for a hobby, sure I compete in tournies(not Pro events), but I'm honest about my game. I work 40 hours a week at a paying job. I have no aspirations of being a Pro player. Does that mean I don't want to improve a bit? No........Does it mean I want to go to extremes andpractice 4 to 5 hours every day? Nope

I'm just the average Joe who plays pool, nothing more. Do I beleive there is some gadget that will make me play 2 balls better? NOPE, definitely not. So. to all you guys buying up DVD's and charts to get better......do yourselves a favor, work on your strok/follow through. Hit the spot you are aiming at and get the "feel" of the proper ball speed.

Here's a perfect example: have somebody stand across the table from you and toss them the cue ball. Did you throw it over their head? Did you throw sooo soft that it falls on the table between you? Or did you toss it right where they could catch it? THAT FOLKS is "FEEL" Translated to pool lingo, it would be "how hard to hit the cue ball to get shape"? How much draw makes the cue ball come bacward 2 ft.? I could go on and on...but all this is learned from practice. No gimmick or aiming/non-aiming is going to teach this.

KK, I'm done ranting. :eek: Keep hitting em. :thumbup:
Click to expand...

At one point in your life you would have hit them in the face with the cue ball. Because you practiced throwing stuff you developed your feel for throwing stuff. If asked you to roll ball into the corner i bet you cant do it 50% of the time at first. But practice it for a while and you might have the nuts betting you won't miss one out of ten.

No one who is serious sells or promotes any method that they claim will make you a champion without putting the work in alongside the method.

Sent from my DROID Pro using Tapatalk 2
 
JCIN said:
So in summary:

To get better you should practice and most people will never play as well as the best in the world no matter what equipment they use.

That seems to be the case in every game/hobby/skill/job I have ever been involved in.

Edit to add: I see no problem with trying to improve through whatever means someone chooses. Part of that whole practice thing is practicing the right stuff. If you dont know the right stuff you have to learn it somewhere. You also have to learn what really is the right stuff. Someone practicing a shitty stroke for ten years is still going to end up with a shitty stroke.
Click to expand...


Ah Justin, man of few words.

I could have made it the readers digest version, but what fun would that be? LOL I was flying on my keyboard at 2 words per minute. Just trying to drive the point home.
See you in Vegas.......Keep promoting pool, your doing a great job. :smile:
 
Guess what? To get better is going to take hard work practicing and doing the reps. You will not find salvation on a DVD, only some potentially interesting techniques that may or may not be occasionally useful along the way.

But you're still going to have to do the roadwork if you want to perform consistently at a higher level.

Lou Figueroa
 
tucson9ball said:
I remember a few years ago writing one of my first posts about pool having "NO" Holy Grail. I simply meant that there was no quick fix, or gadget that would make the average Joe a road player or Pro.

I have seen and heard of soooo many aiming systems or some non-aiming systems that would improve your game it makes me want to puke. :rolleyes:

Now don't get me wrong, I have no problem with people wanting to make a buck, with whatever their selling. Buyer beware.....all these gimmicks should have a disclaimer: hard work/practice is it's own reward.

If anybody beleives they can buy a jump cue and never miss a jump shot, their simply dreaming. If you buy a high dollar piece of chalk thinking you will never miscue? Cmon! Folks...wake up and smell the coffee! If you don't want to invest the time/effort to practice, then you will never be good. For some players, even practice won't improve their game much, brutal but honest. No magic elixir will make you play like Johnny Archer or Efren.

Some people were just born with hand/eye coordination that is unequalled. Combine that with hard work and years of drills, WHOALA! You have a world champ!

I have seem Earl Strickland or Corey Dueul put a stroke on a ball that 99.9% of pool players could never imagine or imitate. That is what it takes to be an elite player. The rest of us just watch ot participate on pool forums. Sure, we may be a good amateur player, but honestly, do you think you could compete at the Pro level? Not happening.

I play pool for a hobby, sure I compete in tournies(not Pro events), but I'm honest about my game. I work 40 hours a week at a paying job. I have no aspirations of being a Pro player. Does that mean I don't want to improve a bit? No........Does it mean I want to go to extremes andpractice 4 to 5 hours every day? Nope

I'm just the average Joe who plays pool, nothing more. Do I beleive there is some gadget that will make me play 2 balls better? NOPE, definitely not. So. to all you guys buying up DVD's and charts to get better......do yourselves a favor, work on your strok/follow through. Hit the spot you are aiming at and get the "feel" of the proper ball speed.

Here's a perfect example: have somebody stand across the table from you and toss them the cue ball. Did you throw it over their head? Did you throw sooo soft that it falls on the table between you? Or did you toss it right where they could catch it? THAT FOLKS is "FEEL" Translated to pool lingo, it would be "how hard to hit the cue ball to get shape"? How much draw makes the cue ball come bacward 2 ft.? I could go on and on...but all this is learned from practice. No gimmick or aiming/non-aiming is going to teach this.

KK, I'm done ranting. :eek: Keep hitting em. :thumbup:
Click to expand...

If you haven't tried them, then that makes it an opinion
and without trying them it makes it an uneducated opinion
Ridiculous
 
This whole line of argument is a giant red herring. Again NO ONE has said that x-method WILL make you a pro.

To imply that anyone has said it is just wrong. And even if anyone said something close by now it's plainly clear through all the discussion that there is no magic fix.

HOWEVER

What IS there are techniques that are CLEARLY better than nothing, clearly better than simple trial and error.

So if you want to spend your table time on guess and guess again then go ahead. Some people prefer a more structured way to approach the game and have seen those way pay great dividends.

Even players who are ALREADY champions have found that some of the new methods have benefits for them.
 
I agree, nothing like seasoning and table time. It is good to get tips on certain things and incorporate it into your game but all the knowledge in the world is useless if you cannot execute it.
 
JB Cases said:
This whole line of argument is a giant red herring. Again NO ONE has said that x-method WILL make you a pro.

To imply that anyone has said it is just wrong. And even if anyone said something close by now it's plainly clear through all the discussion that there is no magic fix.

HOWEVER

What IS there are techniques that are CLEARLY better than nothing, clearly better than simple trial and error.

So if you want to spend your table time on guess and guess again then go ahead. Some people prefer a more structured way to approach the game and have seen those way pay great dividends.

Even players who are ALREADY champions have found that some of the new methods have benefits for them.
Click to expand...

I'm not promoting the "guess" tecnique. I would say, to begin with, get lessons from a good teacher. They can go over your mechanics and make suggestions as to where you could improve. Maybe move your backhand or adjust your bridge hand for example. Also, make sure that you are stroking all the way through the cue ball. After that, you really need to practice, practice practice.
I wouldn't say "go hit a million balls and youwill be good." Of course a beginner needs some guidance, then it's up to the individual, how good they will become.
 
I think most instructors from what I have read on here teach systems? Scott lee, randy g, stan shuffett, joe t, cj, etc. There must be something to it since they are considered world class instructors.
 
Str8 Shooter said:
I think most instructors from what I have read on here teach systems? Scott lee, randy g, stan shuffett, joe t, cj, etc. There must be something to it since they are considered world class instructors.
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I believe these guys can teach you fundamentals and knowledge they have acquired over the years but you still need to have a ton of practice and hard work to become a good player. I feel I am knowledgeable but do not put enough table time in and hard work as I try to have a good balance in life. Lock anyone in a poolroom for 8-10 hours a day and make them play and practice hard they will either get better or go crazy, maybe both.
 
As I agree with the op, I must add just playing one game only will not help you.
Playing 9 ball taught me shape.
8 ball helped shape but also safeties.
14.1 shape, safeties and running out.
One pocket, safeties and set ups, soft shots and English

I take all those from each game and apply them to the next.

That with the tid bits I read, things I see in others play and my basics help me evolve my game.

Do I buy everything for pool playing? No. Do I read and watch as much as I can? Yes.
 
Fast Lenny said:
I believe these guys can teach you fundamentals and knowledge they have acquired over the years but you still need to have a ton of practice and hard work to become a good player. I feel I am knowledgeable but do not put enough table time in and hard work as I try to have a good balance in life. Lock anyone in a poolroom for 8-10 hours a day and make them play and practice hard they will either get better or go crazy, maybe both.
Click to expand...

I agree that hard work and practice is needed to become a good player, I think we all know that? Systems can cut the table time down among other stuff.
 
The Holy Grail is so powerful that it stays hidden, and only gives glimpsess to those who seek it out! Like a tease, it tempts you to with a piece here and a new piece there..
Like a Jigsaw puzzle with many pieces. Each player has a different puzzle, however every puzzle has some common pieces (edges/centers).
It is up to each person to put their own puzzle together.
 
pool101 said:
The Holy Grail is so powerful that it stays hidden, and only gives glimpsess to those who seek it out! Like a tease, it tempts you to with a piece here and a new piece there..
Like a Jigsaw puzzle with many pieces. Each player has a different puzzle, however every puzzle has some common pieces (edges/centers).
It is up to each person to put their own puzzle together.
Click to expand...

That was well said. :smile:

John
 
Str8 Shooter said:
I agree that hard work and practice is needed to become a good player, I think we all know that? Systems can cut the table time down among other stuff.
Click to expand...

Systems are knowledge, you still need to practice it. I learned an aiming system and it brought up my shot making a good deal and consistency too. I still miss and its due to not enough table time in my opinion, no substitute for hitting balls and tough competition.
 
Fast Lenny said:
Systems are knowledge, you still need to practice it. I learned an aiming system and it brought up my shot making a good deal and consistency too. I still miss and its due to not enough table time in my opinion, no substitute for hitting balls and tough competition.
Click to expand...

I agree and and the more table time you have helps keep those unforced errors to a low percentage...
 
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