No Olhausen Pocket Rattle For Champions!

Logandgriff

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
The purpose of this post is to note to Olhausen lovers and haters alike that I just watched (on YouTube) Corey Deuel beat Ralf Souquet in a 2004 "Sudden Death Seven Ball" match played on an Olhausen Champion Pro table AND ....... NOT ONE SHOT RATTLED!. So if you are a champion, you need not worry a bit about Olhausen pocket rattle.

Stay safe and have fun.
 
And that doesn't change the fact that their corner pockets have the wrong opening angle .
 
Two things: I play three days a week in a semi private room that has just two nine foot Olhausen tables- BC that is all I have available here- they both have corner pocket rattle issues- even when you try to play around the issue, you can hear the ball bouncing between pocket facings before it drops in. Long rail shots into the corners; where you need SOME speed to get the cue ball to your next position point are the biggest problem- the problem exists- no one can deny it.

Second- do we know for sure the tables used for whatever you viewed were not altered for the match?

I have been playing for 55 years and play at a fairly high level- for me running an open rack of 9, 10, or 14.1 is not much of a problem - so i think I know a little about table play- the Olhausen tables have an issue- but so do many other tables- you have to learn the issues and play accordingly, not giving the manufacturer a pass though, should have been fixed early on in their manufacturing process- not sure why they did not do that- anybody know why not?
 
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The purpose of this post is to note to Olhausen lovers and haters alike that I just watched (on YouTube) Corey Deuel beat Ralf Souquet in a 2004 "Sudden Death Seven Ball" match played on an Olhausen Champion Pro table AND ....... NOT ONE SHOT RATTLED!. So if you are a champion, you need not worry a bit about Olhausen pocket rattle.

Stay safe and have fun.

In other news, this guy has an Olhausen for sale, right??
 
Two things: I play three days a week in a semi private room that has just two nine foot Olhausen tables- BC that is all I have available here- they both have corner pocket rattle issues- even when you try to play around the issue, you can hear the ball bouncing between pocket facings before it drops in. Long rail shots into the corners; where you need SOME speed to get the cue ball to your next position point are the biggest problem- the problem exists- no one can deny it.

Second- do we know for sure the tables used for whatever you viewed were not altered for the match?

I have been playing for 55 years and play at a fairly high level- for me running an open rack of 9, 10, or 14.1 is not much of a problem - so i think I know a little about table play- the Olhausen tables have an issue- but so do many other tables- you have to learn the issues and play accordingly, not giving the manufacturer a pass though, should have been fixed early on in their manufacturing process- not sure why they did not do that- anybody know why not?

Excellent post! It should have been fixed years ago.
 
The purpose of this post is to note to Olhausen lovers and haters alike that I just watched (on YouTube) Corey Deuel beat Ralf Souquet in a 2004 "Sudden Death Seven Ball" match played on an Olhausen Champion Pro table AND ....... NOT ONE SHOT RATTLED!. So if you are a champion, you need not worry a bit about Olhausen pocket rattle.

Stay safe and have fun.
Whatever. I think they suck. Big time. Only played on one of them and it was a joke. I thought it was bad table, one that shouldn't have left the factory but i was told that's how they play. No thanks. Olhausen used to pay decent sponsor money and that's the ONLY reason those old tv events used them.
 
the only reason i can think of is that the owner didnt know much about making tables or playing. and thought by opening up the front of the pocket he would make it easier for the general public who by his tables. then got stubborn when it was criticized.

he had a chance to become the recognized table for tournaments which would propel his company but he refused and the pros wouldnt play on them anymore so he lost out.
 
I also owned an Olhausen at one time- the pockets had been redone properly- but I could never get the proper rail rebound speed on that table- no matter what- they do not play like a GC or newer Diamond- big difference I finally gave up and bought a GC years ago. I miss my GC! Olhausen's are not good practice tables if you are planning to compete on GCs or Diamonds.
 
Concerning why the pockets are at 145 degrees not 141 and have never been changed: I'm not sure. But as I indicated in an earlier post on the subject of Olhausen pocket rattle, my best guess after combing this and other forums and blogs including the Ask the Mechanic forum is that it has something to do with the characteristics of the Accu-Fast cushions, like maybe they are a bit springier and therefore the wider angle compensates for this. A number of people disagreed with this idea. I do think that the Olhausen folks are not clueless about table design and if they haven't ever changed the angle over these many years despite the public criticism there must be a reason.

I would like to see a definitive answer on this. If you have it, please chime in.

Thanks.
 
Lots of companies never change anything for who knows why.

Take Diamond for example. People were complaining about the cushion rebound and the black marks on the balls for 20 years. It took Cobra to bring the cushion fix to them, and it took Barton to bring the leather pocket dye fix to them. This after thousands of complaints for 20 years by players all over the world, including top pros.

I really believe some companies either don’t care (because sales are still good), or don’t know how to fix the problem.
 
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I'll give you a personal example. I worked for a big corp for 15 years, and one of our products was swings that rock infants to sleep. We came out with a new transmission design that worked better than the prior design as far as the motion goes. However, it was louder. We released it to the world market. A few months later, all of the European distributors stopped sales and returned the product to us. They had too many returns from consumers that complained the noise was too loud.

Our VP of engineering got 20 of us in a room. Most of us were engineers. The 5 engineers who worked on the swing and new transmission (me included), and the other engineers were from other teams there to help come up with a plan to fix the noise.

So the VP starts the meeting off by asking the question: "What is the problem?" In turn, the engineers start offering technical answers: "The gear teeth shape is wrong, the gear spacing is wrong, the motor torque is too high, the transmission alignment is wrong, the electronics that drive the motor is too abrupt, etc., etc." The VP says no to everyone. Finally a manager in the room says: "Sales are down". That was exactly the right answer. Europe had halted all sales on this swing. That was a major problem. A major problem that affected the entire company. That is the problem that needed to be solved.

If you apply this logic to Olhausen and Diamond, if their sales were always growing, there is no problem. Only if their sales drop substantially, and they discover the reason sales dropped is due to pocket rattle, or cushion rebound, or black marks on balls, will they do anything about it.
 
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... If you apply this logic to Olhausen and Diamond, if their sales were always growing, there is no problem. Only if their sales drop substantially, and they discover the reason sales dropped is due to pocket rattle, or cushion rebound, or black marks on balls, will they do anything about it.
If that logic is applied, I agree with you. There are still some companies that are concerned with preventing falling sales instead of reacting to them. I think that the fix in the case you cite is for the company to understand the customer, and not just add acoustic damping around the gear box.
 
If that logic is applied, I agree with you. There are still some companies that are concerned with preventing falling sales instead of reacting to them. I think that the fix in the case you cite is for the company to understand the customer, and not just add acoustic damping around the gear box.

I learned a lot about consumers with this experience:

1) Americans care the least about quality.
2) Europeans care middle amount.
3) Japanese care exponentially more than anyone else.

Our swing that was loud, we released it knowing it was loud, and had fixes in the works before the first unit was sold. But it takes months to get those fixes in place, and you can't hold shipment of a product in corporate America for months. We did NOT release it to Japan, because we knew they would not go for it.

I worked with one Chinese engineer who was about 75 when I was 23 and new. He had seen it all. Lived in China, then Russia for years, then Taiwan for years, then Japan for years, then the USA for years. He told me in Japan there are no returns. If a consumer is not happy with a product, they will simply never as long as they live buy from that company ever again. So a company only has one chance with a Japanese consumer, and they better get it right.

<==== Will only buy Japanese cars.

<====But is also American and buys cheap garbage on Amazon because the price is too good, and frequently regrets it. ha ha.
 
The purpose of this post is to note to Olhausen lovers and haters alike that I just watched (on YouTube) Corey Deuel beat Ralf Souquet in a 2004 "Sudden Death Seven Ball" match played on an Olhausen Champion Pro table AND ....... NOT ONE SHOT RATTLED!. So if you are a champion, you need not worry a bit about Olhausen pocket rattle.

Stay safe and have fun.

Hahahaha Shots fired...........................
 
I'll give you a personal example. I worked for a big corp for 15 years, and one of our products was swings that rock infants to sleep. We came out with a new transmission design that worked better than the prior design as far as the motion goes. However, it was louder. We released it to the world market. A few months later, all of the European distributors stopped sales and returned the product to us. They had too many returns from consumers that complained the noise was too loud.

Our VP of engineering got 20 of us in a room. Most of us were engineers. The 5 engineers who worked on the swing and new transmission (me included), and the other engineers were from other teams there to help come up with a plan to fix the noise.

So the VP starts the meeting off by asking the question: "What is the problem?" In turn, the engineers start offering technical answers: "The gear teeth shape is wrong, the gear spacing is wrong, the motor torque is too high, the transmission alignment is wrong, the electronics that drive the motor is too abrupt, etc., etc." The VP says no to everyone. Finally a manager in the room says: "Sales are down". That was exactly the right answer. Europe had halted all sales on this swing. That was a major problem. A major problem that affected the entire company. That is the problem that needed to be solved.

If you apply this logic to Olhausen and Diamond, if their sales were always growing, there is no problem. Only if their sales drop substantially, and they discover the reason sales dropped is due to pocket rattle, or cushion rebound, or black marks on balls, will they do anything about it.

So how did you guys fix it?
 
So how did you guys fix it?

We had a specialized team to fix the noise, I was the lead mechanical engineer on it. We had a short term fix that reduced the noise slightly but could go into production quickly. Basically changing the gear ratio so the pinion gear spins slower (where the majority of the noise comes from). That was enough to resume sales, but not enough to sell to Japan. For the longer term fix, we measured the noise both in-house with microphones, decibel meters, and computer software, out-sourced noise measurement at a huge anechoic chamber at the local university. (That was fun walking inside that chamber). We also did perception studies with our employees where we recorded and played back noises to find out what types of noises were more pleasant than others (psychoacoustics). We also worked closely with our European team since their sales were lost. It took about 6 months to ship, but we got the noise way, way down, and used what we learned on future swings.

I had a spreadsheet where I tried about 100 different changes, and recorded the peak noises and average noise for each change. From different gear greases, to different motor windings, to different electronics algorithms for the motor that "push" the motor back and forth, to different mounting designs of the whole transmission to absorb vibrations, to insulating ideas, etc. It was a lot of work, but fun as well.
 
The purpose of this post is to note to Olhausen lovers and haters alike that I just watched (on YouTube) Corey Deuel beat Ralf Souquet in a 2004 "Sudden Death Seven Ball" match played on an Olhausen Champion Pro table AND ....... NOT ONE SHOT RATTLED!. So if you are a champion, you need not worry a bit about Olhausen pocket rattle.

Stay safe and have fun.


Regardless of who the manufacturer is, tables will vary from one to another.

I have played on Diamonds on which, I guarantee you, champions will rattle perfectly hit balls. I'm talking about balls hit perfectly deep into the pocket. It is what it is and when I played on those tables I would often chuckled to myself knowing that the shot about to be attempted by my opponent was doomed from the start.

Lou Figueroa
 
Regardless of who the manufacturer is, tables will vary from one to another.

I have played on Diamonds on which, I guarantee you, champions will rattle perfectly hit balls. I'm talking about balls hit perfectly deep into the pocket. It is what it is and when I played on those tables I would often chuckled to myself knowing that the shot about to be attempted by my opponent was doomed from the start.

Lou Figueroa

“Not hit perfectly deep”. That means they caught the point.

I seriously doubt a ball hitting the facing on a Blue label Diamond will rattle. Maybe an older version.
 
We had a specialized team to fix the noise, I was the lead mechanical engineer on it. We had a short term fix that reduced the noise slightly but could go into production quickly. Basically changing the gear ratio so the pinion gear spins slower (where the majority of the noise comes from). That was enough to resume sales, but not enough to sell to Japan. For the longer term fix, we measured the noise both in-house with microphones, decibel meters, and computer software, out-sourced noise measurement at a huge anechoic chamber at the local university. (That was fun walking inside that chamber). We also did perception studies with our employees where we recorded and played back noises to find out what types of noises were more pleasant than others (psychoacoustics). We also worked closely with our European team since their sales were lost. It took about 6 months to ship, but we got the noise way, way down, and used what we learned on future swings.

I had a spreadsheet where I tried about 100 different changes, and recorded the peak noises and average noise for each change. From different gear greases, to different motor windings, to different electronics algorithms for the motor that "push" the motor back and forth, to different mounting designs of the whole transmission to absorb vibrations, to insulating ideas, etc. It was a lot of work, but fun as well.

Very interesting. There is a lot more that goes into the average product on the shelf than I realized.

On topic I rattle balls on any table I play on:(
 
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