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Not sure what to think here...
- Thread starter Tommy-D
- Start date
just reading your side of the story . . .
Tommy,
Take a moment and read your own posts objectively as an outsider would see them or as the business owner should. Ignore the lack of courtesy for now and just look at the business side of things. I suspect that he bit his tongue until things really ate at him and then he went a little overboard. Of course from your own posts it seems that might have been a two way street.
Anyway, by your own posts he doesn't have anything going to generate any real cash flow. Businesses being what they are the basic nut isn't much different if you are doing a lot of business or a little. He is struggling, losing money if you have anywhere close to accurately represented his business in this thread. Being the player you are I suspect that when you don't win the tournament you still cash often enough that playing the tournaments make a profit for you. At the one tournament you have described you also did quite a bit of business to not toke the business owner pretty generously. Just what makes the world go 'round. When I made a profit at other people's businesses it was just a given they got a cut. When there wasn't any specific arrangement I sent some dollars their way at the end of the day regardless and these were nicely profitable businesses without the cash from me.
Regardless of what the owner says it is about, making what looks like easy money to him working out of his establishment while he is struggling is about like waving a red flag in front of a bull. I had to quit gunsmithing and subcontracting from another computer company because I was unavoidably stepping on other businessmen's toes when their customers started beating a path to my door. Although the room owner isn't in direct competition with you I'm sure he realizes that dollars his customers spend with you they don't have to spend with him.
I hate to say it but it looks like what should have been a win/win situation for both of you has turned into a lose/lose situation. If I owned the pool room you would be looking at a bare minimum of a six month ban, maybe permanent. He shouldn't have talked the way he did to you however you shouldn't have talked the way you did to him either and the man that owns or leases the property is the one that has the right of possession.
You both needed each other and you will both suffer if he does ban you from the room or you decide to stay away. He has the only thing resembling a pool room nearby and you have the only repair business. I can't see anyone gaining from this mess unless you two clear the air and learn to work together.
Hu
Tommy,
Take a moment and read your own posts objectively as an outsider would see them or as the business owner should. Ignore the lack of courtesy for now and just look at the business side of things. I suspect that he bit his tongue until things really ate at him and then he went a little overboard. Of course from your own posts it seems that might have been a two way street.
Anyway, by your own posts he doesn't have anything going to generate any real cash flow. Businesses being what they are the basic nut isn't much different if you are doing a lot of business or a little. He is struggling, losing money if you have anywhere close to accurately represented his business in this thread. Being the player you are I suspect that when you don't win the tournament you still cash often enough that playing the tournaments make a profit for you. At the one tournament you have described you also did quite a bit of business to not toke the business owner pretty generously. Just what makes the world go 'round. When I made a profit at other people's businesses it was just a given they got a cut. When there wasn't any specific arrangement I sent some dollars their way at the end of the day regardless and these were nicely profitable businesses without the cash from me.
Regardless of what the owner says it is about, making what looks like easy money to him working out of his establishment while he is struggling is about like waving a red flag in front of a bull. I had to quit gunsmithing and subcontracting from another computer company because I was unavoidably stepping on other businessmen's toes when their customers started beating a path to my door. Although the room owner isn't in direct competition with you I'm sure he realizes that dollars his customers spend with you they don't have to spend with him.
I hate to say it but it looks like what should have been a win/win situation for both of you has turned into a lose/lose situation. If I owned the pool room you would be looking at a bare minimum of a six month ban, maybe permanent. He shouldn't have talked the way he did to you however you shouldn't have talked the way you did to him either and the man that owns or leases the property is the one that has the right of possession.
You both needed each other and you will both suffer if he does ban you from the room or you decide to stay away. He has the only thing resembling a pool room nearby and you have the only repair business. I can't see anyone gaining from this mess unless you two clear the air and learn to work together.
Hu
Trying to read as objectively as I can without hearing from the owner's mouth here.
Tommy do you have an agreement to do tip work with the owner? Or are you fishing on the owners property for free?
Are you one of the best players that always wins or cashes in the tournament?
Do you only come in to get tip business and to cash in a tournament ?
You've painted a story my friend that I can't help but think you owe the owner the apology. What am I missing?
Freddie <~~~ fishing in Florida and Massachusetts requires a fee
Tell him
The only BAD customer is the one who does not come in.
The only BAD customer is the one who does not come in.
About an hour ago,I went to the pool room to deliver a shaft I worked on for a new customer. I showed it to him,made sure he was pleased,got paid and left in just a few min.
I'm walking back to my vehicle,and the owner follows me outside.
He tells me he'd appreciate it if I didn't come back for the weekly tournament because I don't spend any money,or at least not enough to suit him,claiming I haven't spent a nickel for a month. He's also half-ass agitated as he delivers the message :speechless:.
I've played there 5 times in the last month. 4 of those times I was there for a tournament,and bought what I needed,no more than 2 canned drinks in a couple hours. The one other time I played for 45 min while waiting for a cue work customer,and paid before I left.
This is why I don't spend a lot in this place.
I'm not the type to just randomly buy people a beer. Anyone that asks me for a beer typically gets denied on personal principle,unless we're tight. There were 3 people there that fell into this category. None of them drink beer,and none of them would ask because they pay for their own.
They don't serve food,and typically any workplace vending machine has a much better selection of candy,chips,etc. I don't eat stuff like that much at all,and when I do I'd like to have something other than product that has visible dust on it.
They don't have my preferred beverage,I don't like water,and I've been trying to reduce my soft drink intake because my sugar has been out of whack lately. I've never even tried to carry in a drink from outside,out of respect.
I've only won this tournament once recently,and 3 times since Jan. His complaint was never brought up when I was winning it more often than not.
I was so stunned by this I just silently stood there until he walked away muttering to himself,like he had something to say but not the stones to say it.
What do you think? Tommy D.
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I had planned on dealing with this in private if at all possible.
His decision to start getting loud and doggin' me eliminated that.
Sure,how I dealt with it probably wasn't the best way to do it,that's on me.
I mentioned him applying the same rule to everyone else that hangs there,and he started making it personal,and loudly.
After 2 min of his abuse,I reacted,and stood my ground. This was the 2nd time he's tried to run me over verbally and without even letting me respond. I reacted badly.
There's never been a single sentence between us about me picking up cue work there. If there had been before this,I would have worked something out as long as he approached me in a normal conversational tone.
I'd probably still work something out with him,but refuse to be talked down to.
I'm not saying I wasn't in the wrong with how I handled it,but it takes a rare breed to have taken that kind of verbal abuse and NOT react.
As far as me winning tournaments here,even with a bad stretch the last few months my lifetime winning percentage is still close to .700.
I was going there on occasion to play at times other than the tournament,if the mood to play just got overwhelming,and only if I knew I had someone to bang heads with.
I have other places to go play,buy food,and tip the waitresses,as well as another tournament,so I'm not as worried about it as I would have been years ago.
Thanks to everyone that posted. Tommy D.
His decision to start getting loud and doggin' me eliminated that.
Sure,how I dealt with it probably wasn't the best way to do it,that's on me.
I mentioned him applying the same rule to everyone else that hangs there,and he started making it personal,and loudly.
After 2 min of his abuse,I reacted,and stood my ground. This was the 2nd time he's tried to run me over verbally and without even letting me respond. I reacted badly.
There's never been a single sentence between us about me picking up cue work there. If there had been before this,I would have worked something out as long as he approached me in a normal conversational tone.
I'd probably still work something out with him,but refuse to be talked down to.
I'm not saying I wasn't in the wrong with how I handled it,but it takes a rare breed to have taken that kind of verbal abuse and NOT react.
As far as me winning tournaments here,even with a bad stretch the last few months my lifetime winning percentage is still close to .700.
I was going there on occasion to play at times other than the tournament,if the mood to play just got overwhelming,and only if I knew I had someone to bang heads with.
I have other places to go play,buy food,and tip the waitresses,as well as another tournament,so I'm not as worried about it as I would have been years ago.
Thanks to everyone that posted. Tommy D.
this is also the correct route. if i have requested cue work I will meet the cue maker etc in a neutral place.
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Opportunity
Heh heh,
Turn the situation into one where you approach him and say something like - I realized that I would be upset with me if I was in your shoes too. I want to make it up to you. I think if we had an arrangement where we both promote each others's business, we could both be better off.
The win for him is you bring in players that he would not normally get - deliver as often as possible to his place - don't deliver anywhere OTHER than his place unless you can't help it. In return for "exclusive delivery" he puts you at the top of his recommendation list, maybe puts signage up.
He wins by bringing people into his room, maybe some that don't know him.
You win in that you get "free" advertisement.
Overall, you may or may not want to 'make-up' with him, but you both have something to offer the other. The way you approach him with the "I'd be angry with me too" technique is called mirroring. It makes him feel like he wasn't wrong in the way he behaved and it puts you in a position where you've changed him from "angry" to "validate". A person in a validated state is more likely to negotiate and agree with you than the angry person.
EDIT - Uh, maybe too late after the exchange - missed that before my post.
...and love the quote from "Pre"
Heh heh,
Turn the situation into one where you approach him and say something like - I realized that I would be upset with me if I was in your shoes too. I want to make it up to you. I think if we had an arrangement where we both promote each others's business, we could both be better off.
The win for him is you bring in players that he would not normally get - deliver as often as possible to his place - don't deliver anywhere OTHER than his place unless you can't help it. In return for "exclusive delivery" he puts you at the top of his recommendation list, maybe puts signage up.
He wins by bringing people into his room, maybe some that don't know him.
You win in that you get "free" advertisement.
Overall, you may or may not want to 'make-up' with him, but you both have something to offer the other. The way you approach him with the "I'd be angry with me too" technique is called mirroring. It makes him feel like he wasn't wrong in the way he behaved and it puts you in a position where you've changed him from "angry" to "validate". A person in a validated state is more likely to negotiate and agree with you than the angry person.
EDIT - Uh, maybe too late after the exchange - missed that before my post.
...and love the quote from "Pre"
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If a business owner doesn't like you and don't want you to come around...you need to respect that. He has his reasons, even if you think it is a lame reason, it's not for you to question it.
Winning 70% of the tournaments is not a good thing to do. You need to be not so greedy. Stop taking advantage of lousy players. Win once in a while and just try and break even the other times.
The way you are going, soon the business owner will be calling the police. It could get worse and he'd tell the police you were selling drugs.
The way I read it...sounds like you think it's your right to do whatever you want. Just because this is America...the land of the free and taxes, LOL...it doesn't work that way.
I've seen people who go to weekly tournaments and just win every week. Well, no one showed up after a few weeks after that. A matter of fact it just happened at the monthly Finley's tournament. The same player won thee months in a row and now he is banned from playing because he is considered too good. He shouldn't of been so greedy and let one of the local favorites win at least once.
Some people just don't like winners or greedy pool players.
Winning 70% of the tournaments is not a good thing to do. You need to be not so greedy. Stop taking advantage of lousy players. Win once in a while and just try and break even the other times.
The way you are going, soon the business owner will be calling the police. It could get worse and he'd tell the police you were selling drugs.
The way I read it...sounds like you think it's your right to do whatever you want. Just because this is America...the land of the free and taxes, LOL...it doesn't work that way.
I've seen people who go to weekly tournaments and just win every week. Well, no one showed up after a few weeks after that. A matter of fact it just happened at the monthly Finley's tournament. The same player won thee months in a row and now he is banned from playing because he is considered too good. He shouldn't of been so greedy and let one of the local favorites win at least once.
Some people just don't like winners or greedy pool players.
I may be wrong, but I believe I know both parties here, and I'm guessing that his cue repair has nothing to do with this issue. The owner I am thinking of is a pretty nice guy, which is why I go there myself. Yes, he's hurting moneywise, but I think the issue is that Tommy is not what we'd call a good loser, and some of the other players aren't comfortable in that atmosphere. This is a pretty laid back place, everybody's friendly, win lose or draw. Tommy is one of the better players, but the tournament is a one loss crapshoot, and a lot of luck is involved. Just tone it down, smile and walk away when the breaks don't go your way.
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Let me clarify, so there is no misunderstanding. I'm not knocking either side. TommyD takes the game seriously, and when in this tourny, ANYBODY can win. I just think some of the players that are there just for the fun of it can't handle how Tommy handles a loss.
The bold part in particular, but yeah... I was thinking exactly what you wrote here.
Tommy, you had the high ground until this exchange...
The owner is taking responsibility on this because it's his business, but this sounds to me like someone has the ear of the owner and is doing some serious complaining...."...he snaps off the tournament, sore loser, doesn't spend money, upsets other customers..."
I think it's time for Tommy to move on and find a bigger pond.
I think it's time for Tommy to move on and find a bigger pond.