Omen - Propellor cue I just sold

rheester said:
just a question,

i know that many makers email pics to the buyer to let them know how things are going.

does anyone know if pete does?

on the flip-side, not saying that he has too, but the buyer, did he ask for progress pics, because as for me, i sure as hell ask for pics, merely to satisfy my itch.

pics in this situation may have helped avoid this.

rather than being disgusted at either party, i just feel bad for both, because i know how it feels to get something not up to your satisfaction and i'm sure that pete didn't maliciously do this and i'm sure (other than misunderstanding) that he 100% stands behind the cue.

sorry to hear bout this.
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I am glad you bought this up... he did e-mail my friend with pics and he did question him about everything mentioned...

His reply on the inlays... Oh I wanted to do my twist... (still doesn't make it right) and the Bushka ring and Omen being in the Hoppe ring... Oh sorry I missed that... and the 300 extra for LESS of a cue than ordered... Oh that's just the way it is...

In fact he told me he told Pete to use a cue he saw (Voodoo Daddy's) and that is where the cue started from. Bushka ring and Hoppe ring with Omen.

JV
 
Let's disect the issues a little more....

First he would have kept the cue if it was what was ordered, in fact he would have kept the cue if the inlays were what he asked for.

Second I think the "non-normal" propellors throws this cue off, alot. The three blade ones look like wind turbine blades. It's also the reason I think it took a while to move, and lost money for the buyer.

Missing the ring, lets say 150.00 and the 300 he stuck him with... that's a 450 dollar swing...

The amount of work is irrelevant, the cue should have been what was ordered. I think this is the big item in the equation. If he went off plan, he should have said something, and the buyer should have just flat out said send me my deposit back, this is NOT what I ordered. I think Pete's cues being what they are, he could have sold this himself to someone that wanted a finished cue with no wait.

This is a lesson for everyone. Communication, precision of description, customer service, etc... The big picture is what is important. Recently we saw Tony Zinzola cut a cue up because he didn't like it, a finished cue. He get's the big picture.

You should have an enjoyable cue buying experience when designing, purchasing a custom cue. It should not be troublesome, for you OR the cuemaker, and you should not be afraid to say something if the finished product isn't what you ordered. Everyone screws the pooch once in a while, it happens.

JV
 
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I KNOW I WOULD HAVE BEEN GETTING MY 500 DEPOSIT BACK, AND THE CUEMAKER WOULD AHVE BEEN SELLING THE CUE TO SOMEONE ELSE.

I KNOW THE BUYER WELL, AND CAN SAY WITHOUT A DOUBT, THAT HE WOULD NOT HAVE ORDER A CUE THAT LOOKED LIKE THE ONE THAT WAS BUILT. I CAN HOWEVER SAY THAT HE WOULD ORDER ONE WITH THE RING ABOVE THE WRAP, CLASSIC BOTI STYLE PROPS, AND THE OMEN ENGRAVED IN THE RING TO GIVE IT AN OLD SCHOOL LOOK. I CAN ALSO SAY, WITHOUT QUESTION, THAT THE BUYER IS TOO NICE OF A GUY TO TELL THE CUEMAKER THAT HE WANTED A REFUND OF HIS DEPOSIT.

AS FAR AS THE CUE GOING UP 300 AFTER A DEPOSIT WAS GIVEN..... THAT CERTAINLY WOULDN'T FLY WITH ME EITHER. IF NO DEPOSIT IS GIVEN, THAN PRICE MAY CHANGE, BUT THE BUYER GIVING 500 UP FRONT HAS TO GAURANTEE HIM SOMETHING, DOESN'T IT????? IT SHOULD GAURANTEE AGREED UPON PRICE AND DESIGN, AND THAT'S JUST FOR STARTERS. IT SHOULD ALSO LOCK IN A TIME FRAME FOR DELIVERY (WITHIN REASON, I UNDERSTAND "THINGS" HAPPEN)

I'VE HAD SEVERAL OMENS, AND THEY WERE NICE CUES, BUT BULDING A NICE CUE DOESN'T MAKE WHAT HAPPENED IN THIS SITUATION, THE RIGHT THING TO DO. IT ALSO DOESN'T MATTER IF PEOPLE THINK IT'S "A LOT OF CUE FOR THE MONEY" THERE ARE GUYS THAT WOULD WANT 3 TIMES WHAT THIS CUE COST TO BUILD AND OTHERS THAT I COULD GET TO BUILD IT FOR ABOUT 1/3 OF WHAT THIS CUE COST.

CUEMAKING IS SUCH A SMALL INDUSTRY, THAT IT AMAZES ME WHEN I SEE THINGS LIKE THIS GO ON. IT ALSO BOTHERS ME THAT CUEMAKERS (NOT ALL) FEEL THAT THEY CAN DO WHATEVER THEY WANT, AND TAKE ADVANTAGE OF PEOPLE, AND ALSO FEEL THAT THERE WON'T BE REPERCUSSIONS FOR THOSE ACTIONS.

Marcus
 
FAST_N_LOOSE said:
....CUEMAKING IS SUCH A SMALL INDUSTRY, THAT IT AMAZES ME WHEN I SEE THINGS LIKE THIS GO ON. IT ALSO BOTHERS ME THAT CUEMAKERS (NOT ALL) FEEL THAT THEY CAN DO WHATEVER THEY WANT, AND TAKE ADVANTAGE OF PEOPLE, AND ALSO FEEL THAT THERE WON'T BE REPERCUSSIONS FOR THOSE ACTIONS.

Marcus
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Marcus,

Agreed...this is not the way to treat your customer.

Maybe we should all have an great big intervention up at SBE....lol. :) From several stories I've heard (a few with me personally involved) about buyer's deposits held hostage for many years; cue orders built and then sold to someone else; price for an order increasing 75% over the CM's original quote when the cue is ready for delivery; stuff taken in on trade for cues and then no cues built; CM telling a customer to just send the cue back be cause "he doesn't deserve to own his cue" when an obvious finish flaw could not be rectified; etc.

Fact is, there really are no repercussions for cuemakers who do not seem to respect their customers. These practices seem to be "business as usual" for some....and the real irony is that it seems to be accepted as "OK" by many. :confused:

I hate to hear of stories such as this. Bad thing is, this couldn't have happened to a nicer guy !!

Sean
 
Regardless of how this all came about, this is a great post to anyone thinking of getting a custom cue (such as myself). Communication up the whazoo, a full understanding of what you are expecting, a solid BINDING quote, and status pictures as the cue is being made are all incredibly important.

Thanks for showing me what to watch out for. :wink:
 
PaulieB said:
Regardless of how this all came about, this is a great post to anyone thinking of getting a custom cue (such as myself). Communication up the whazoo, a full understanding of what you are expecting, a solid BINDING quote, and status pictures as the cue is being made are all incredibly important.

Thanks for showing me what to watch out for. :wink:
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And you are the reason that threads like this belong here.
There are very few makers I would trust my money with and those that I do, I already have cues from and would do it again.
 
Koop said:
And you are the reason that threads like this belong here.
There are very few makers I would trust my money with and those that I do, I already have cues from and would do it again.
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I agree with this statement. To PaulieB, I say consider all the facts before forming an opinion.

Koop has a short list of trusted builders based on direct personal experience. I do too and Pete Ohman heads that list. He has been detail oriented and given my design requests priority over his own ideas. He is the one guy I go to when I want it done right.

I don't dispute the facts of this thread, I know some of the people involved are well versed in what they are talking about, but it is an isolated incident. Not a pattern of behavior. For this 1 cue, I can see several examples if perfect attention to detail in my own cue case alone. Pete Ohman is a superb cuemaker who listens...I know this.

In over 10 cues ordered, Pete has only changed a single detail...he added an ivory butt cap where I requested plastic. When I asked about it, Pete told me he liked the design of the cue (my request not his original) and he thought it should have ivory throughout. He didn't add any fee for the extra material.

This customer didn't get what he wanted, but the reason for variation in the design request is not known. Pete might have been trying to give more than the buyer asked for, something I experienced from him. PaulieB, this thread does belong here, but if it becomes about a cuemaker's credibility, I hope you see both sides of the argument.
 
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Drawman623 said:
This customer didn't get what he wanted, but the reason for variation in the design request is not known. Pete might have been trying to give more than the buyer asked for, something I experienced from him. PaulieB, this thread does belong here, but if it becomes about a cuemaker's credibility, I hope you see both sides of the argument.
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Pete might have been trying to give more than the buyer asked for,

Am I reading this right???? Because if I am I am going to ask how the hell you see this as the case....

JV
 
I've got a cue ordered with pete. So far so good. We'll have wait and see the final product.
 
i am waiting for my second custom made by Pete and so far communication is excellent. As i requested my design, he was very pleased of it but made some suggestions what should be changed or added, and i do like his ideas.
So i am looking very forward getting it. And by btw, Omens are one of the best playing cues i ever tried and that said, my 2 current players are a Bluegrass and a Sugartree.
Just my 2 cents, no intention to step on anybodys feet.
David
 
Drawman,

I am not forming any rash decisions about Pete at all. What I really appreciate about this post is what I had mentioned .. the need for communication and status photos, etc. It's just good to know some of the things you should have in place when having a cue made from ANY maker. If photos were emailed during the process, it would of been easier to get exactly what was expected. One of the first status emails would of had the reply of "where's the ring above the wrap?" I'm glad this forum is here, I think I learn at least one new thing every day.

BTW, the cue looks great!
 
omen cues

To all forum members..... I have known Pete for many years.. I have bought dozens of his cues from him, I have been to his house and have worked the hopkins shows with him... He is a TRUE Gentleman... Period!!!! I have bought hundreds of cues from many makers over the last 30 yrs... Pete is old school guy, where a hand shank is as good as signing a peice of paper..... I hope this misunderstanding is just that.....

Hoppycopy
 
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hoppecopy said:
To all forum members..... I have known Pete for many years.. I have bought dozens of his cues from him, I have been to his house and have worked the hopkins shows with him... He is a TRUE Gentleman... Period!!!! I have bought hundreds of cues from many makers over the last 30 yrs... Pete is old school guy, where a hand shank is as good as signing a peice of paper..... I hope this misunderstanding is just that.....

Hoppycopy
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Well Hoppe there is no mistake on the upped price and I stated his reply to the buyer.

The new owner is very happy with the cue. The original buyer, well that's another story.

JV
 
"Props" to all!

I spoke to Pete today about this cue and sale. I understand there was a lack of communication with the original buyer having limited computer skills. The standard (and detailed) Omen cue order sheet was not utiilized. Custom joint protectors and a leather wrap upgrade added after the original quote resulted in the the price increase. Is there anyone that doesn't understand the relationship between additional work or added options and an increase in price? (Go order a pizza and find out:grin-square:) I wanted to further clear the air here. In a perfect world, information on the other side of the story would have been helpful at the start of this thread.

Martin

classiccues said:
Well Hoppe there is no mistake on the upped price and I stated his reply to the buyer.

The new owner is very happy with the cue. The original buyer, well that's another story.

JV
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well it makes sense that additional work would increase the price but was there a reduction in price due to the missing bushka ring? cuz it doesnt sound like there is.
 
Yes, Cedric, there was a price reduction on the completed cue per Pete. Cue was said to have been ordered in about June 08 and completed/ delivered in Jan 09. Lack of good clear communication greatly contributed to this outcome, IMO. This has never happened to me:grin-square:

Martin


Danktrees said:
well it makes sense that additional work would increase the price but was there a reduction in price due to the missing bushka ring? cuz it doesnt sound like there is.
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Judge/Jury

From what I was told, the customer was informed about the ring before it was even sent... add ons like leather wraps, custom joint protectors are not a part of the org. quote... I think before we judge someone, we should get all the facts... This cue was delivered @ a year ago.... Why are we trying to hang Pete out to dry now.... Old news...move on
 
jazznpool said:
I spoke to Pete today about this cue and sale. I understand there was a lack of communication with the original buyer having limited computer skills. The standard (and detailed) Omen cue order sheet was not utiilized. Custom joint protectors and a leather wrap upgrade added after the original quote resulted in the the price increase. Is there anyone that doesn't understand the relationship between additional work or added options and an increase in price? (Go order a pizza and find out:grin-square:) I wanted to further clear the air here. In a perfect world, information on the other side of the story would have been helpful at the start of this thread.

Martin
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I am on the phone right now with the buyer and this is a load of CRAP (his words much harsher).... All communication was via the phone, all specs were conveyed on the phone and there was NO changes after. So, let me ask this, where was the deduction in the lack of a Bushka ring? Pete even told him he missed the Bushka ring and putting his name in the Hoppe ring and still increased the price. In fact Pete's excuse was he "miscalculated" his quoted price to the buyer when confronted. Maybe Pete should have used his sheets and he wouldn't have missed important aspects of the design.

Original buyer limited computer skills.. lol he never missed an e-mail from me in 10 years...

JV
 
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hoppecopy said:
From what I was told, the customer was informed about the ring before it was even sent... add ons like leather wraps, custom joint protectors are not a part of the org. quote... I think before we judge someone, we should get all the facts... This cue was delivered @ a year ago.... Why are we trying to hang Pete out to dry now.... Old news...move on
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Move on?!?!?... this guy is so full of it it's ridiculous....

Before the cue was being delivered, the customer was told to look at the cue on his website. At that time he called him and said Hey where is the Bushka ring... and Pete said.. Oh.. I don't know how I missed that. He also confirmed he didn't put his name in the Hoppe ring.

Informed about the ring? Yeah ok. ESP.

But lets go back to the original order.. it was during that phone conversation Pete said, Hey I have some nice elephant leather.. so Tom said sure go ahead and use it...the caps were part of the order... all this was spoken and spec'ed out BEFORE he got the initial price. Now could Pete have misquoted, that I believe, absolutely.

If you think this happened any other way.. e-mail Tom G. at champ1@ptd.net and see how bad his computer skills are....

JV
 
I am not trying to pick a fight with anyone.... The cue is sold to someone else. move on its over... What happened between Pete and the customer is there business... Not ours... My point was Pete is a great guy and I have bought dozens of cues from him and never had a problem.. But remember Pete and the customer are Human and we all make mistakes.. Thats all... Not here to fight... Sorry for the misunderstanding...Oops I'm human too....
 
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