One Pocket decision

[senor]

If I remember correctly, the coupla times I was in this situation I went for the two-railer and the win - just couldn't resist it.

So I'm curious which shot you experienced one pocket players on the forum would choose in this spot ?

Being in the same situation more than once I know I have shot at both shots. Sound and true logic dictates that you cinch the ball that puts you needing one, but I didn't always follow that logic. I've played a lot of good players, and the best way to beat them is to keep applying the pressure. That is why I would favor the 2 railer playing a good player and favor cinching the 1 ball against a sucker.

Not sure if anyone has answered the question this way, but if the tables were turned, I would prefer my opponent not shoot the 2 railer.

 

[wincardona]

cue ball controll

I'm going with what AZE posted in post #5. I don't know why you think it's showing-off. I have a free shot to get on the hill, and a medium bank (easier than the two railer on the 5) to win.

I'm no great one pocket player, but I don't see why you would play it any other way. You keep hoping you can get an open shot at your hole, and you want to pass it up? For what? You think your next shot will be better? I doubt it. He can bank or cut in the one from where it is. Why give him the chance to win?

The closeness of the cue ball in relation to the five ball offers you the ability to controll the cue ball comfortably. There is very little chance of leaving a shot on the one ball for your opponent to win with ,even if you're a C player. From the position he will be left in he would be foolish to shoot the one ball,and if he did then you have done your job putting him on tilt.

 

[Onepocket73]

read my post again,it clearly explains why pocket size is crucial to the decision in choice of shots.

Ok,Lets pretend that the pockets are triple shimmed and you shoot the one.How do you shoot it?What is your plan from there as far as position play,etc...?

 

[Onepocket73]

The closeness of the cue ball in relation to the five ball offers you the ability to controll the cue ball comfortably. There is very little chance of leaving a shot on the one ball for your opponent to win with ,even if you're a C player. From the position he will be left in he would be foolish to shoot the one ball,and if he did then you have done your job putting him on tilt.

But lets say that you shoot the 2 railer and it hangs in the pocket.He is blocked by the 5.What is his move from there?I think that would probably force him to slice the one....Thoughts?

 

[wincardona]

are you kidding

Ok,Lets pretend that the pockets are triple shimmed and you shoot the one.How do you shoot it?What is your plan from there as far as position play,etc...?

If your shooting a ball into a triple shimmed pocket from the distance refrenced you shoot to cinch the ball then play a solid safe.

 

[wincardona]

great

But lets say that you shoot the 2 railer and it hangs in the pocket.He is blocked by the 5.What is his move from there?I think that would probably force him to slice the one....Thoughts?

If he does you'll prbably win 3 out of 4 times.Not a bad win % from the original position,or for that matter from just about any position.

 

[Onepocket73]

If he does you'll prbably win 3 out of 4 times.Not a bad win % from the original position,or for that matter from just about any position.

I guess I am trying to get your point of view from both sides.If you were my opponent and I hung the 5 after banking it 2 rails and you were blocked behind the one,what would you do?(sorry if it sounds like a grilling session)

 

[wincardona]

?????????????????????????

I guess I am trying to get your point of view from both sides.If you were my opponent and I hung the 5 after banking it 2 rails and you were blocked behind the one,what would you do?(sorry if it sounds like a grilling session)

I probably would pray. And I think you need some one pocket lessons. I feel you like one pocket but you seem to me you need some lessons. Good luck,i'm gone for the day.

 

[Onepocket73]

I probably would pray. And I think you need some one pocket lessons. I feel you like one pocket but you seem to me you need some lessons. Good luck,i'm gone for the day.

LOL......I think I just got one from you

 

[Deadon]

I guess I am trying to get your point of view from both sides.If you were my opponent and I hung the 5 after banking it 2 rails and you were blocked behind the one,what would you do?(sorry if it sounds like a grilling session)

Make the 5, either with a little spin or lag. Leaving you at the opposite end of the table from the 1, and hopefully in the pocket or on the rail. Yeah, leave a bank, but on a tight table its tough and there isn't much of an option unless you use the 1 to pocket the 5 and are comfortable that you can control it and the CB. Which depends on how the 5 hangs in the pocket.

 

[Russ Chewning]

and if you want to show off (two page)....

CueTable Help

I think the speed is off. It looks like you are going two more rails to get the OB even close to the pocket. And if you leave him a little off the side rail instead of on the end rail, and don't make your bank, your opponent is shooting for his hole. I actually like the three railer better, making sure to leave the CB on the same side of the table as your pocket. It's an automatic safe, plus I used to practice this shot. But I might be wrong. I am just a C player.

Russ

 

[fan-tum]

don't forget-you need 2 and what a perfect opportunity to get 2 in play with a good chance to win if you play the 2 railer.

 

[Thecoats]

CueTable Help

IBA7467,

You can shoot that three railer for the cash with me any time

 

[AZE]

I just want everyone to know that the shot I diagrammed as 'if you want to show off' is not the shot I would shoot... when you bank it the cue-ball is going to fly a bit, and it'd look fancy... but I don't like the shot.

From the start I've said that two-railing the 5 first is the best option, tho there are some (few) instances I would choose not to shoot that shot.

The two railer is the right shot... listen to me...


ohh yeah, and billy backed it up so you can listen to him a little bit too if you want, I heard he plays 1p fairly decent.

 

[Russ Chewning]

IBA7467,

You can shoot that three railer for the cash with me any time

Just curious as to why you don't like the shot? Is there some sellout I am missing? If so, please diagram. I think the absolute worst that can happen is that you hit the three railer too thick (almost stopping the CB dead in it's tracks, BTW) and it goes four rails long, and ends up on the same side of the table as the CB, and close to the rail.

And as for shooting the two railer first, I don't like it. Here's why. Your opponent is on 7. You damn well better get on the hill with him while you have a chance. If you hit the two railer just a foot too hard, you just might force your opponent to shoot for his hole.. And he just plays the shot at speed to just reach the end rail. Oh yeah, and you have to cut the ball slightly to get the two rail "make" angle, which probably means he will not be frozen to the bottom rail.

And for the record again... This shot is in either Winning One Pocket, and Shots, Moves and Strategies. Your opponent will leave this to you a lot.

Mayhaps you ought to try it out on a table before you bet against it. You learn to hit it well, you often take away the option for your opponent to leave you downtable with a ball on the bottom rail.

If you do not make the two railer, the opponent has a chance to win. If you shoot straight in and play ANY safe shot, your opponent does not have a chance to win until he plays a good move.

Of course, the person who posted the three railer mangled the angle drawing, but do not fault him for that.

Russ

 

[1 Pocket Ghost]

I like the two-railer a bit more as well but both are good shots. I might prefer to get on the hill if I feel I outmove my opponent by a good deal - Normally though, I'd shoot the two-railer.

Well, the majority of votes seem to be favoring shooting the 2-railer, and in most cases I also would choose the 2-railer........Unlike Billy's decision criteria, for me the pocket size would not play into it - Of the posts made so far, I most agree with Franky: the only thing that might sway me into pocketing the 1 ball instead of shooting the 2-railer, is if I have a big-time moving advantage over my opponent, which would make me a pretty big favorite playing him 7 to 7.

 

[Neil]

...................

 

[Russ Chewning]

Well, the majority of votes seem to be favoring shooting the 2-railer, and in most cases I also would choose the 2-railer........Unlike Billy's decision criteria, for me the pocket size would not play into it - Of the posts made so far, I most agree with Franky: the only thing that might sway me into pocketing the 1 ball instead of shooting the 2-railer, is if I have a big-time moving advantage over my opponent, which would make me a pretty big favorite playing him 7 to 7.

I'd like to clarify something..If the two railer on the 5 is at such an angle that I can stop the CB within an inch or two of the bottom rail, dead straight in on the 1, and still be shooting pocket speed on the 5 then I also shoot the two railer.. All day long and twice on Sunday.

Maybe I am seeing the angle wrong, but at pocket speed on the two railer, it looks like the CB pops off the bottom rail towards the side rail just a bit. And if you let your opponent off the rail just a little bit, he's playing the 1 off the side of the 5 (which is now by your pocket..), moving the 5 away and driving the CB down table. If he's lucky and the CB spreads a few inches off the rail, he might cut the 1 right in, driving the CB to the top rail, if the 5 ends up on the side rail.

Yes, the two railer gets you out if you MAKE it. But if you DON'T, you give your opponent many more options than if you just played the 1, and a good move on the 5.

If you can shoot the 5 and leave absolutely nothing on the 1, then that is the shot.

Russ

 

[1 Pocket Ghost]

I'd like to clarify something..If the two railer on the 5 is at such an angle that I can stop the CB within an inch or two of the bottom rail, dead straight in on the 1, and still be shooting pocket speed on the 5 then I also shoot the two railer.. All day long and twice on Sunday.


Russ

Yes, the angle for the 2-railer is supposed to be just about straight ahead.....Jude copied my table layout for me, but instead of using this, go to my original #1 post and copy and paste that html over at the wei table link that I gave.....I think you'll see there, that the angle I presented of the 2-railer is pretty close to dead on.

 

[wincardona]

whatis the value of a ball??

Well, the majority of votes seem to be favoring shooting the 2-railer, and in most cases I also would choose the 2-railer........Unlike Billy's decision criteria, for me the pocket size would not play into it - Of the posts made so far, I most agree with Franky: the only thing that might sway me into pocketing the 1 ball instead of shooting the 2-railer, is if I have a big-time moving advantage over my opponent, which would make me a pretty big favorite playing him 7 to 7.

Bruce, if you think the value of a ball is the same on loose pockets that it is on tight pockets you are mistaken. One of the reasons I like the two railer on loose pockets is that I can overcome the one ball deficit much more often on loose pockets,and also that I will make the two railer more often as well. I will play any player my speed the following prop. I will shoot the one on triple shimmed pockets one time,the next time I will shoot the five on loose pockets.In the next set my opponent will shoot the one on loose pockets,and then on the next turn he will shoot the five on triple shimmed pockets. I feel confident that I will come out ahead in the long run. The next time we meet I will play you that prop if you like the opposite side as me.Plus if I win i'll refund to you 25% of everything you lose. Deal?