One Pocket Rule Question

[onepocketron]

I've played a ton of one hole over the years, but this is the first time this kind of thing every happened.

You are playing a match and your opponent miscues. It's obvious the cue ball is headed for an area which will give you several easy shots. At this point the opponent takes the shaft of his cue and sends the cue ball back down to the far end of the table on the end rail. Doing this, he also contacts several object balls and they scatter.

What is the ruling here? He fouled and you shoot from where the ball lies, ball in hand behind the head string, loss of game? Honestly, if it had been done when I was younger, I would have jumped on this guy, but I'm old and mellow now.

 

[pt109]

He loses the game in a tournament.
In a money match, he may also lose his teeth.

 

[Ponytail]

Loss of game.

 

[hang-the-9]

Yep, loss of game, that is more than a foul, it's unsportsmanlike conduct which is usually a game penalty. Stealing a candy bar is a crime, but if you also shove all the store shelves over and spray paint the building while you do it, you will be in jail longer.

 

[John Brumback]

Seems like it would have to be loss of game,and I would think,(but not bet) that this would be wrote down in maybe a book or somthin,ya know a rules book. John B.

 

[LSU1018]

So I'm just curious what makes it a loss of game? The fact that he intentionally hit the cue ball a second time with his stick or the fact the more than a certain number of balls were moved during the foul or both?

 

[Pushout]

He has no reason to move the cue ball to the head of the table, there is no ball in hand on a foul. It's loss of game, I believe, because of hitting the cue ball a second time and moved other balls at the same time. Unsportsmanlike, I don't know, that's a really gray area. Normally, he would have just owed a ball.

 

[ugotactionTX]

definitely loss of game and if the secondary foul was intentional they should probably have to buy a round for the bar just for being a dick.

 

[pt109]

Yep, loss of game, that is more than a foul, it's unsportsmanlike conduct which is usually a game penalty. Stealing a candy bar is a crime, but if you also shove all the store shelves over and spray paint the building while you do it, you will be in jail longer.

Not sure why, but ^ this one made me cackle.
:killingme:

 

[John Brumback]

So I'm just curious what makes it a loss of game? The fact that he intentionally hit the cue ball a second time with his stick or the fact the more than a certain number of balls were moved during the foul or both?

Great question.I didn't think you could foul the cball anymore with the side of your cue.I thought you had to use the tip so maybe it's not a foul after all,hmmm John B.

 

[hang-the-9]

Great question.I didn't think you could foul the cball anymore with the side of your cue.I thought you had to use the tip so maybe it's not a foul after all,hmmm John B.

It's not only a foul, but an intentional foul like that to disturb balls and prevent the other player from gaining an advantage is a major foul, which includes a loss of game as one of the possible penalties.

I have seen lots of low-lifes pull this when they miss a hit and see that the cueball is about to break out a cluster for the other player, they grab the ball while it's moving to prevent it thinking "eh, I fouled already, what's a second foul since I gave up ball in hand anyway". That is a big no-no in any real match and should cost the game. In APA play and often other games I have seen, you get nothing for this aside from a dirty look. I have never seen the loss of game called on a dliberate foul like this in a league game even if it's brought to the attention of whoever is the person in charge. They just tell the other guy not to do it again.

 

[pt109]

It's not only a foul, but an intentional foul like that to disturb balls and prevent the other player from gaining an advantage is a major foul, which includes a loss of game as one of the possible penalties.

I have seen lots of low-lifes pull this when they miss a hit and see that the cueball is about to break out a cluster for the other player, they grab the ball while it's moving to prevent it thinking "eh, I fouled already, what's a second foul since I gave up ball in hand anyway". That is a big no-no in any real match and should cost the game. In APA play and often other games I have seen, you get nothing for this aside from a dirty look. I have never seen the loss of game called on a dliberate foul like this in a league game even if it's brought to the attention of whoever is the person in charge. They just tell the other guy not to do it again.

This was once done in a major tournament by a former world champion..
...no extra penalty was called....very lame.

 

[Cory in DC]

It's not only a foul, but an intentional foul like that to disturb balls and prevent the other player from gaining an advantage is a major foul, which includes a loss of game as one of the possible penalties.

I have seen lots of low-lifes pull this when they miss a hit and see that the cueball is about to break out a cluster for the other player, they grab the ball while it's moving to prevent it thinking "eh, I fouled already, what's a second foul since I gave up ball in hand anyway". That is a big no-no in any real match and should cost the game. In APA play and often other games I have seen, you get nothing for this aside from a dirty look. I have never seen the loss of game called on a dliberate foul like this in a league game even if it's brought to the attention of whoever is the person in charge. They just tell the other guy not to do it again.

Our league plays that touching a moving cue ball is loss of game, for this very reason. It gets a little silly at the end of a game when a team is looking to call loss of game if the cue ball is far from a pocket but hasn't 100% stopped when a player grabs it. But it's still better to have a clear cut rule: don't touch a moving cue ball!

 

[John Brumback]

This was once done in a major tournament by a former world champion..
...no extra penalty was called....very lame.

I had a "current" world champ pull it on me. I went running to the TD and he just shrugged his shoulders cause he didnt see it.It was NOT Ken Shuman.Yes very very lame to say the least.

It should be loss of game to touch any moving ball.....ever!!! If I ever run a tourney it will be,bet on that.I always make sure not to grab the cball untill it has come to a complete stop.And I also go to players meetings,That alone has won me a couple extra matches,too:thumbup: John B.

 

[Fatboy]

we were talking about this at the pool room the other day, we all decided it was a loss of game.

 

[John Brumback]

we were talking about this at the pool room the other day, we all decided it was a loss of game.

I hope you didn't have to rack your brains too hard:grin: It's going to be one of my first rules in my new rule book that I'm coming out with. Got some help on it already:thumbup: John B.

 

[Fatboy]

I hope you didn't have to rack your brains too hard:grin: It's going to be one of my first rules in my new rule book that I'm coming out with. Got some help on it already:thumbup: John B.

my brain got racked up before i was 10 years old, then my back got racked up by the time is was 38 years old........I dont want to say what happened next-its racked up too now that i'm 46

 

[Tramp Steamer]

It's loss of game, of course, and in some instances loss of teeth, as pt said, but more often than not is loss of face. It's an embarrassing moment and the player usually knows it.

 

[dabarbr]

Great question.I didn't think you could foul the cball anymore with the side of your cue.I thought you had to use the tip so maybe it's not a foul after all,hmmm John B.

Anytime someone rakes the balls with the side of their stick I've always considered that to mean they concede that game. Of course, if it's an easy game then we just continue playing and it's my shot from when they lay with a ball penalty to him.

 

[Ponytail]

What makes it a loss of game is this: The person who moved the cue ball, and several other balls, only because he was upset about a miscue, has made it so that the game could not continue to its normal outcome, no matter what that might have been. Therefore, he ended the game right then and there, and did it outside the rules of normal play.

You can't make rules for all contingencies. You just can't. At some point, you just have to do what makes sense.