One Pocket Rule Question

Wags

Wags

2 pocket-one pocket table
Silver Member
The shooter and the opponent each need one ball and there are two balls on the table. The shooter plays a ball to his pocket and sinks it but also then makes the other ball in his opponents pocket in the same stroke of the cue.

Both players have 8 balls. The opponents ball actually went into his pocket first.

Who wins? What happens?

:confused:
 
Wags said:
The shooter and the opponent each need one ball and there are two balls on the table. The shooter plays a ball to his pocket and sinks it but also then makes the other ball in his opponents pocket in the same stroke of the cue.

Both players have 8 balls. The opponents ball actually went into his pocket first.

Who wins? What happens?

:confused:
Click to expand...

Well, technically, this could only happen if the two winning scores add up to 15, such as 8-7, 10-5, etc.. It can't happen that both players have 8 balls.

That aside, this is a very interesting question. I'd almost have to say that what counts is who's turn it is. If it is player A's turn, and he sinks his ball on his turn, he wins. Other than that, considering this situation can only come up during a match where one player recieves a spot.. It would have to depend on what the players agreed to before hand.

This will come up once every 10 years or so, so the most likely situation is that player A realizes he might make player B's ball also, stops, and ask what the rule is before he shoots the shot. Player B, of course, almost certainly having a monetary interest in the shot, will say that either: Player B wins, or the game is a draw.

I would say that the rule SHOULD be, if player A is shooting:

A. Player A wins..
or
B. Game is a draw and replayed.

IMHO, player B should NEVER be awarded a win on an inning where his opponent sunk his own winning ball.

Russ
 
You're absolutely right, Russ, it only comes up in a handicapped game. According to the "Official rules" posted on OnePocket.org, which are way more complete than the BCA rules, exactly that situation is covered:
3.2 In the event that a player pockets both their own game winning ball, and their opponent’s game winning ball, both on the same legal stroke, then the shooting player wins. There are no ‘ties’, and it does not matter which ball drops first, as long as they both drop as a result of the same stroke.
Click to expand...

Take a look here at the complete "Official Rules"
 
of course this could only happen in a handicapped game (8-7), and the game would just be replayed, there is no other way.
 
oops, just read that official rules above! ill have to keep that in mind, BUT, as is many times the case, that is actually a VERY bad rule.

what if i have a ball hanging in my hole and the other ball is very near my hole on the end rail. the guy knocks my hanger in, makes a billiard on the other ball and wins the game..... i mean that may be the rule but it is not right. the only fair thing to do is play the game over, but as i said i will keep that in mind as "ammunition" in case it happens to me, haha.
 
enzo said:
oops, just read that official rules above! ill have to keep that in mind, BUT, as is many times the case, that is actually a VERY bad rule.

what if i have a ball hanging in my hole and the other ball is very near my hole on the end rail. the guy knocks my hanger in, makes a billiard on the other ball and wins the game..... i mean that may be the rule but it is not right. the only fair thing to do is play the game over, but as i said i will keep that in mind as "ammunition" in case it happens to me, haha.
Click to expand...

Why is it not right? The only thing that matters is you left your opponent to the table with an "out" shot.

By this reasoning, you would be allowed to "pass" the foul if a person pocketed your final ball while following behind. And thereby win the game.

It is part of the strategy of the game. In my opinion, a player should never be punished for pocketing his last ball on a legal shot. Making him replay, and possibly lose, the game, IS punishment.

It all comes down to the fact that the other guy sold out, and should be punished for selling out..

Russ
 
When we came up with those expanded One Pocket rules a couple of years ago, we thoroughly vetted them, and this particular one didn't really come under much controversy. The three that did that I recall had to do with:

1/ the use of jump cues
2/ snooze you lose
3/ object ball off the table is a foul (or not)

Those three all were hotly contested as to which way the 'official' rules should go...

Oh yeah, and what happens when you shoot to the wrong pocket.
 
When in a short count handicapped game, I ALWAYS make sure my opponent knows the rule posted above. That situation comes up more often than you might think.
 
1pocket said:
When we came up with those expanded One Pocket rules a couple of years ago, we thoroughly vetted them, and this particular one didn't really come under much controversy. The three that did that I recall had to do with:

1/ the use of jump cues
2/ snooze you lose
3/ object ball off the table is a foul (or not)

Those three all were hotly contested as to which way the 'official' rules should go...

Oh yeah, and what happens when you shoot to the wrong pocket.
Click to expand...

Down south, I've always played if you pocket a ball in opponents pocket it stays down.

Have rarely played snooze, but when I did it was stated before starting the game.

Who was it that I heard let his opponent make several balls in the wrong pocket before telling him? Ha RA?
 
I would guess it would be about when your opponent owes a ball, and he "doesn't remember" to spot it..... either you tell him or you "snooze and lose"(I could be wrong this just a guess)
 
Russ Chewning said:
Why is it not right? The only thing that matters is you left your opponent to the table with an "out" shot.

By this reasoning, you would be allowed to "pass" the foul if a person pocketed your final ball while following behind. And thereby win the game.

It is part of the strategy of the game. In my opinion, a player should never be punished for pocketing his last ball on a legal shot. Making him replay, and possibly lose, the game, IS punishment.

It all comes down to the fact that the other guy sold out, and should be punished for selling out..

Russ
Click to expand...
look, i highly disagree with this.

if me and my opponent need one, and ive totally outmoved him and have a ball hanging in my hole and the other ball (only 2 balls on the table, handicapped game) is VERY near my hanger.... then the guy knocks my hanger in, billiards the ball near my hole into his hole and wins the game???? that is not right. at the very least it should be a replay of the game. the score is even.... why would it not be a replay. i believe this is a very bad rule, prove me otherwise.
 
Last edited:
1pocket said:
When we came up with those expanded One Pocket rules a couple of years ago, we thoroughly vetted them, and this particular one didn't really come under much controversy. The three that did that I recall had to do with:

1/ the use of jump cues
2/ snooze you lose
3/ object ball off the table is a foul (or not)

Those three all were hotly contested as to which way the 'official' rules should go...

Oh yeah, and what happens when you shoot to the wrong pocket.
Click to expand...

this is a convincing post but just becasue you didnt discuss it doesnt mean you werent wrong. the fact that it will harldy ever come up is probably the reason you didnt discuss it.

just imaging playing another very good player, totally outmoving him, having him make the billiard i described above, then losing. it wouldnt be right, but there is no perfect game.
 
what about if you need 2 or more balls and you make a ball in your pocket and make your opponents case ball
 
The player who shoots wins - absolutely.

As far as t he 'object ball jumped off table foul (or not)'... It should be a foul - it's a foul in any other game of pool. So I'm glad that it was voted a foul.
 
bigskyjake said:
what about if you need 2 or more balls and you make a ball in your pocket and make your opponents case ball
Click to expand...

Then your opponent wins.
 
IMO, the shooter is the winner. There should never be a tie in pool. Makes me wanna retch just thinking about it. :eek:
 
enzo said:
this is a convincing post but just becasue you didnt discuss it doesnt mean you werent wrong. the fact that it will harldy ever come up is probably the reason you didnt discuss it.

just imaging playing another very good player, totally outmoving him, having him make the billiard i described above, then losing. it wouldnt be right, but there is no perfect game.
Click to expand...
You have NOT outmoved him. He shot the winning shot, so he outmoved you.

If there wasn't a rule already, I would have thought that the game should be played over, but I will happily comply with the rules as stated above.

About "you snooze, you lose"... I really, really don't like this concept. I don't like a rule that punishes a player for being honest (remembering to spot an owed ball), or encourages a player to be dishonest (by "forgetting" to spot an owed ball).
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top