Open Apology to NYC Dude

A

av84fun

Banned
This is HARD but necessary.

In a sub-thread, I ran to the defense of Allison Fisher by speculating that her skill level was not being properly acknowledged by many posters.

I don't want to and will not start that ball rolling again except to say that I stick to my convictions that she can beat a LOT more male pros than is generally thought.

However, in that thread, I made the comment that Sigel "ducked" AF in the original televised challenge match between MS and LJJ.

I THOUGHT that because I had some insights that I will not go into regarding the negotiations between AF and the IPT. It APPEARED to me that since A) AF was not in the match and that B) LJJ was in the match in spite of her being near the bottom of the WPBA rankings...that MS ducked Allison.

What I THOUGHT was logical enough but WRONG and in a a series of exchanges between me and NYC Dude, the disparaging remarks started to fly.

At the time of those posts, I did not know who NYC Dude is...a man who has made HUGE contributions to the sport and especially straight pool. But that shouldn't make any difference. I should not have been as "uppity" as I was regardless of his identity.

All that is left for me to do is apologize. Sadly, since Mr. Goldwater has me on ignore, he will probably not read this or the personal IM's I sent him...which were also probably blocked.

If anyone cares to forward this message to him, I would appreciate that.

In the meantime, to the extent that his legal initiatives require any "group funding" he can certainly count me in the group.

Regards,
Jim
 
av84fun said:
This is HARD but necessary.

In a sub-thread, I ran to the defense of Allison Fisher by speculating that her skill level was not being properly acknowledged by many posters.

I don't want to and will not start that ball rolling again except to say that I stick to my convictions that she can beat a LOT more male pros than is generally thought.

However, in that thread, I made the comment that Sigel "ducked" AF in the original televised challenge match between MS and LJJ.

I THOUGHT that because I had some insights that I will not go into regarding the negotiations between AF and the IPT. It APPEARED to me that since A) AF was not in the match and that B) LJJ was in the match in spite of her being near the bottom of the WPBA rankings...that MS ducked Allison.

What I THOUGHT was logical enough but WRONG and in a a series of exchanges between me and NYC Dude, the disparaging remarks started to fly.

At the time of those posts, I did not know who NYC Dude is...a man who has made HUGE contributions to the sport and especially straight pool. But that shouldn't make any difference. I should not have been as "uppity" as I was regardless of his identity.

All that is left for me to do is apologize. Sadly, since Mr. Goldwater has me on ignore, he will probably not read this or the personal IM's I sent him...which were also probably blocked.

If anyone cares to forward this message to him, I would appreciate that.

In the meantime, to the extent that his legal initiatives require any "group funding" he can certainly count me in the group.

Regards,
Jim
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Jim: Dont want to get in the middle or into a pissing contest with you, BUT;
Didn't AF want to use simonis cloth, break from the rail and a couple of other considerations. And that is why the IPT picked LJJ to play MS. please enlighten all of us if there were other reasons why she was not picked...........................mike
 
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cueball1950 said:
Jim: Dont want to get in the middle or into a pissing contest with you, BUT;
Didn't AF want to use simonis cloth, break from the rail and a couple of other considerations. And that is why the IPT picked LJJ to play MS. please enlighten all of us if there were other reasons why she was not picked...........................mike
Click to expand...
and alternate breaks, too, I believe... :rolleyes:
 
cueball1950...<<please enlighten all of us if there were other reasons why she was not picked...........................>>

From my personal knowledge, each of the issues you mention were part of the negotiations but NYC Dude said in the thread that he KNOWS FOR A FACT that what happened is that the WPBA refused to permit her to play.

Whether the IPT went to other players than LJJ before getting to her was not mentioned by NYC. He then went on to report that when LJJ was invited and was also forbidden to play by the WPBA, LJJ "retired" from the WPBA on the theory that even if she lost to MS, she would earn more money than she was likely to earn for the balance of her career on the WPBA.

I have come to BELIEVE BUT DO NOT KNOW FOR A FACT that NYC Dude's version is correct and none of the WPBA pros who post here commented one way or the other.

Tending to suggest his version is correct is that LJJ no longer appears on the WPBA rankings nor did she compete in the U.S. Open (and possibly some earlier tournaments.)

Whether he was right or wrong though, he was correct that I did not KNOW for a FACT that my version was correct and it was sort of an insult to MS...i.e. ducking a woman (although I do NOT think that it was and think that AF could give MS a run for his money on any given day) but I should not have posted such a remark without characterizing it as an opinion not based on personal factual knowledge.

At that point, the comments between me and NYC Dude got pretty bitter and it is not my purpose here to piss people off. I would hope to contribute positively to this forum and don't think I did so in my exchange with the Dude.

Therefore, my apology.

Let me finally repeat what I said in the former thread which was to the effect that I have great respect for LJJ. She was and is a great champion and well deserving of her membership in the Hall of Fame.

Regards,
Jim
 
PS...Not to "pick the scab" but if NYC Dude's version is NOT correct...then he owes ME an apology!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (-:

But he posted with great authority on the matter and I will assume that he is correct until proven otherwise. But for SURE...I don't KNOW what happened...exactly...for a fact.

Regards,
Jim
 
av84fun said:
cueball1950...<<please enlighten all of us if there were other reasons why she was not picked...........................>>

From my personal knowledge, each of the issues you mention were part of the negotiations but NYC Dude said in the thread that he KNOWS FOR A FACT that what happened is that the WPBA refused to permit her to play.

Whether the IPT went to other players than LJJ before getting to her was not mentioned by NYC. He then went on to report that when LJJ was invited and was also forbidden to play by the WPBA, LJJ "retired" from the WPBA on the theory that even if she lost to MS, she would earn more money than she was likely to earn for the balance of her career on the WPBA.

I have come to BELIEVE BUT DO NOT KNOW FOR A FACT that NYC Dude's version is correct and none of the WPBA pros who post here commented one way or the other.

Tending to suggest his version is correct is that LJJ no longer appears on the WPBA rankings nor did she compete in the U.S. Open (and possibly some earlier tournaments.)

Whether he was right or wrong though, he was correct that I did not KNOW for a FACT that my version was correct and it was sort of an insult to MS...i.e. ducking a woman (although I do NOT think that it was and think that AF could give MS a run for his money on any given day) but I should not have posted such a remark without characterizing it as an opinion not based on personal factual knowledge.

At that point, the comments between me and NYC Dude got pretty bitter and it is not my purpose here to piss people off. I would hope to contribute positively to this forum and don't think I did so in my exchange with the Dude.

Therefore, my apology.

Let me finally repeat what I said in the former thread which was to the effect that I have great respect for LJJ. She was and is a great champion and well deserving of her membership in the Hall of Fame.

Regards,
Jim
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Well if Randy said he knows for a fact the real reason then i myself would tend to believe Randy. He, from what i know of him, is an honest man and somewhat in the know in the pool world. He has an unwavering love for the game and i know he keeps up with what is going on in the pool world. So if Randy says it is so. then there is a 98% chance of being correct.....mike
 
cueball1950...<<So if Randy says it is so. then there is a 98% chance of being correct.....mike>>

Right...which is why I offered my apology.

Regards,
Jim
 
here is the real story. after mike met kevin, kevin said, who do you think you can beat without any problem? mike sigel said without hesitating, loree jon jones. kevin said, well, then consider loree jon jones your gift from me. that's exactly what happened. she was picked because that was the only pro on earth sigel felt very confident about beating. trust me sigel did not want to approach the likes of an allison fisher!
 
8-Ball Ernie...So, you know for a fact that the WPBA did not prohibit AF and LJJ's participation in the event?

If you don't mind my asking, what is your source of that information?
Thanks!
Jim
 
8-ball bernie said:
here is the real story. after mike met kevin, kevin said, who do you think you can beat without any problem? mike sigel said without hesitating, loree jon jones. kevin said, well, then consider loree jon jones your gift from me. that's exactly what happened. she was picked because that was the only pro on earth sigel felt very confident about beating. trust me sigel did not want to approach the likes of an allison fisher!
Click to expand...

You don't know much I must say!
First of all, Mike had contacted AF about a year earlier for the match. She did not return KT's calls. The plan was to do challenge matches only, no tour. Then they decided to go ahead with the tour...then contacting AF again for the kick off match. She wanted certain cloth ect....and did not sign the contract so KT called LJJ! Period! He picked her beacuse of her resume, she is and was a great player and HOF inductee! Not to mention her beautiful face and TV coverage! Though the WPBA did have something to do with it as well. That's really no one's business! Just like KT"s "personal life" is no one's business!
 
8-ball bernie said:
here is the real story. after mike met kevin, kevin said, who do you think you can beat without any problem? mike sigel said without hesitating, loree jon jones. kevin said, well, then consider loree jon jones your gift from me. that's exactly what happened. she was picked because that was the only pro on earth sigel felt very confident about beating. trust me sigel did not want to approach the likes of an allison fisher!
Click to expand...


Bernie, you should quit while you are ahead. This is total BS! Your credibility rating just went to zero.
 
cptbreak...<<Just like KT"s "personal life" is no one's business!>>
A genuine thanks for your comments. But of course, KT's personal life is EVERYONE's business. He is a public figure and a famous (or infamous)celebrity so his life's activities are "newsworthy" and basically fair game.

I HATE some of the tactics used by the paparazzi...like running into celebrity's cars to obtain photo ops...I really HATE that but on the other hand, before celebrities become celebrities they "beg borrow and steal" to get press recognition and would sign CONTRACTS allowing unlimited photo ops just to get recognition.

It's when they get rich enough that they don't need the money that they start to *****.

(-:
 
cptbreak....OK, I have now CONFIRMED from a person, who shall remain nameless, but who was directly and intimately involved in the negotiations...that your version of the facts is essentially correct.

Therefore, NYC Dude's version is absolutely WRONG.

I am not going to withdraw my apology to him because I think that my verbiage got a little too nasty...so that part of the apology remains.

However, I now invite him to reciprocate with an apology of his own and I OFFER THE FOLLOWING CHALLENGE.

If he can prove, conclusively, that the WPBA officially refused to permit AF to compete...and then refused to let LJJ compete and then LJJ "retired" so as to be able to compete...I will send a check for $5,000.00 to any Qualifier player of his choice if he will do the same.

Conclusive proof MUST be a document, including any e-mail that proves his point and NOT any kind of he said/she said mumbo jumbo.

I say there is no such document and that therefore, NYC Dude has it wrong. Bet me sir.

Someone needs to copy this challenge to him because he has me on ignore...which if I might rally to my own defense...was inappropriate given the nature of the vast majority of my posts here.


In fact, NYC Dude, all the WPBA did was to "fart around" to quote my source, for a length of time at which point the deal was offered to LJJ and she took it in a heartbeat.

There was NO OFFICIAL REFUSAL on the WPBA's part as the Dude suggested that he knew for a FACT while blistering me for posting falsely.

I suggested that MS "ducked" AF and my "source" agrees that he might have vastly preferred to play LJJ than AF.



Regards,
Jim
 
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