opinions-my 9' practice helping or hurting my bar box game

CueJunkiee

CueJunkiee

Shoot with the Best TOOLS
Silver Member
i play constantly on 9' gold crowns at local billiard hall. arramith balls, cleaned frequently, cloth cleaned frequently, he has many different cloths on different tables so i switch around. It is 7 minutes from my house and i get frequent flyer break on table time and it's quiet and no booze, loud music. Alot of regulars looking for games <no action usually>Now on APA league, most of my games are on bar boxes. Alot of times dirty balls that seem to hit like clay. Cloth that is like unmowed grass. Rails that bounce like concrete. Cue balls of all weights and sizes. Now i also play in tournaments but also on bar boxes. There the tables are descent and balls aren't terrible.....

So i play at my place 12-15 hours a week minimum. I can 'read' the balls and rails and the different cloths pretty well. But when i go to a barbox, sometimes i have a real hard time adjusting... At the bar i play out of our barbox is well maintained, balls are good quality so i rarely if ever lose at my home turf <i only play there on league nite-no practice> It sorta plays like the gold crowns i'm used to....


Am i just spoiled with good equipment? Should i go shoot on 'junkie stuff' more often?

Dunno- i placed terribly over the weekend and this has been bugging me. After i lost, i went straight to the poolhall i always goto and shot ten times better....

thoughts? Help? is there a 'trick' from going to 9' to barbox in aiming or something? there's also a couple places i play that has a 'cannonball' <heavy and oversized>for a cue ball on a coinop table-how do ya adjust for that whale of a thing?
Anyone else have this problem>?:confused:
 
It seems to me that since you do well on your well maintained bar box at your home bar that distance isn't an issue with you, it's playing with different equipment (dirty balls, dead rails and such.)

I like to get out to the different poolrooms/ bars that I'll be playing league nights a couple of days before a match just so I can get a feel for the equipment. This has worked well for me except for one time when I found out that they switch balls at one particular place prior to league night. Well that didn't hurt either because instead of playing with dirty balls I had nice clean ones.

Anyways, I find that when your playing on a table with dirty balls it's better to play shape that leaves you less of an angle or a straighter shot so that you don't get as much throw on the balls when you cut them.
 
That big cue ball really blows, to say the least. They are heavy, AND larger. Standard red circle is 4 3/8 and most tavern balls are are 2 3/8. You must adjust your cut shots, follow, and draw. Also, the cue ball tends to drift differently.

The difference on a bar table an regulation are that you must play the corners more on a bar table, use more specialty shots, like shooting over a ball, off a rail, etc. Speed control and dealing with clusters also becomes more important as well.

Just my random thoughts.
 
CueJunkiee said:
i play constantly on 9' gold crowns

So i play at my place 12-15 hours a week minimum. I can 'read' the balls and rails and the different cloths pretty well. But when i go to a barbox, sometimes i have a real hard time adjusting...

Anyone else have this problem>?:confused:
Click to expand...

Anybody who does any amount of time on both size tables will absolutely have this problem. Anyone who says they don't, IMO, hasn't had the amount of exposure to true excellence in bar pool play to make the assessment. A lot of people judge "easiness" by their shotmaking. This can be a costly mistake against seasoned bar table players.

Just like adjusting from one game to another, adjusting from one size to another is exactly that: adjusting.

The good shotmakers with decent but not great position play will find it easier to play on a big than the smaller tables. If you're going to be playing on both, you need to practice on both.

If I play a bar table tournament, I stay away from 9' tables for the few days leading up to the tournament. And vice versa. It just makes good sense.

All that being said, crappy equipment makes for crappy play. It doesn't matter if it's a small table or large table. Crappiness knows no size. Some people will just play less crappy than others on crappy equipment.

Fred
 
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Cornerman said:
Anybody who does any amount of time on both size tables will absolutely have this problem. Anyone who says they don't, IMO, hasn't had the amount of exposure to true excellence in bar pool play to make the assessment. A lot of people judge "easiness" by their shotmaking. This can be a costly mistake against seasoned bar table players.

Just like adjusting from one game to another, adjusting from one size to another is exactly that: adjusting.

The good shotmakers with decent but not great position play will find it easier to play on a big than the smaller tables. If you're going to be playing on both, you need to practice on both.

If I play a bar table tournament, I stay away from 9' tables for the few days leading up to the tournament. And vice versa. It just makes good sense.

All that being said, crappy equipment makes for crappy play. It doesn't matter if it's a small table or large table. Crappiness knows no size. Some people will just play less crappy than others on crappy equipment.

Fred
Click to expand...

Good advice.
 
Cornerman said:
Anybody who does any amount of time on both size tables will absolutely have this problem. Anyone who says they don't, IMO, hasn't had the amount of exposure to true excellence in bar pool play to make the assessment. A lot of people judge "easiness" by their shotmaking. This can be a costly mistake against seasoned bar table players.

Just like adjusting from one game to another, adjusting from one size to another is exactly that: adjusting.

The good shotmakers with decent but not great position play will find it easier to play on a big than the smaller tables. If you're going to be playing on both, you need to practice on both.

If I play a bar table tournament, I stay away from 9' tables for the few days leading up to the tournament. And vice versa. It just makes good sense.

All that being said, crappy equipment makes for crappy play. It doesn't matter if it's a small table or large table. Crappiness knows no size. Some people will just play less crappy than others on crappy equipment.

Fred
Click to expand...

Very good advice, like you said a good shot maker will find it easier to play on a big table that is me, league nights i find it tough cause i play on big tables and those tables are where i practice so when i play on bar box tables i find it tough to adjust cause there is little room to move the cueball around. But you have nailed it
 
thanks guys... atleast it's not just me... i just gotta drive the extra 20 min and hit the bar tables before the tourney's i guess.....
 
CueJunkiee said:
i play constantly on 9' gold crowns at local billiard hall. arramith balls, cleaned frequently, cloth cleaned frequently, he has many different cloths on different tables so i switch around. It is 7 minutes from my house and i get frequent flyer break on table time and it's quiet and no booze, loud music. Alot of regulars looking for games <no action usually>Now on APA league, most of my games are on bar boxes. Alot of times dirty balls that seem to hit like clay. Cloth that is like unmowed grass. Rails that bounce like concrete. Cue balls of all weights and sizes. Now i also play in tournaments but also on bar boxes. There the tables are descent and balls aren't terrible.....

So i play at my place 12-15 hours a week minimum. I can 'read' the balls and rails and the different cloths pretty well. But when i go to a barbox, sometimes i have a real hard time adjusting... At the bar i play out of our barbox is well maintained, balls are good quality so i rarely if ever lose at my home turf <i only play there on league nite-no practice> It sorta plays like the gold crowns i'm used to....


Am i just spoiled with good equipment? Should i go shoot on 'junkie stuff' more often?

Dunno- i placed terribly over the weekend and this has been bugging me. After i lost, i went straight to the poolhall i always goto and shot ten times better....

thoughts? Help? is there a 'trick' from going to 9' to barbox in aiming or something? there's also a couple places i play that has a 'cannonball' <heavy and oversized>for a cue ball on a coinop table-how do ya adjust for that whale of a thing?
Anyone else have this problem>?:confused:
Click to expand...
Just an idea you should start a tournament at your hall and invite all those bar players...good luck
 
Fred said it right but I think the key sentence was about "good shotmakers with decent but not great position play will find it easier to play on a big than the smaller tables" with an emphasis on decent but not great position play. Shortcomings in position skills are greatly magnified on a bar box and players who usually do very well on a big table can find themselves hooked because they missed their target by only a couple inches. This is especially true in the early part of the game when it is most congested.
 
so any practice ideas to increase my position play?? I went to the 9' last night and decided to run a few 9ball racks... i then really noticed after listening to you guys my position is suffering...Then i played an apa 7 in 8ball for a while and was about 50-50 in wins.. i can make great shots, but now i need to work on my positioning... ideas or some reference to where i can get some?
 
Differences ...

On a regulation, you have to zone in more for the shots,
since they are usually longer and sometimes more extreme,
and some players have difficulty making end to end shape
sometimes, but also, sometimes they get a little 'loose' with
their shape since you have so much room to get it.
One area that hasn't been mentioned yet, is that I have always
found that banking on a full sized table is quite a bit different
from a bar table in the way the balls react because of the rails.
 
CueJunkiee said:
i play constantly on 9' gold crowns at local billiard hall. arramith balls, cleaned frequently, cloth cleaned frequently, he has many different cloths on different tables so i switch around. It is 7 minutes from my house and i get frequent flyer break on table time and it's quiet and no booze, loud music. Alot of regulars looking for games <no action usually>Now on APA league, most of my games are on bar boxes. Alot of times dirty balls that seem to hit like clay. Cloth that is like unmowed grass. Rails that bounce like concrete. Cue balls of all weights and sizes. Now i also play in tournaments but also on bar boxes. There the tables are descent and balls aren't terrible.....

So i play at my place 12-15 hours a week minimum. I can 'read' the balls and rails and the different cloths pretty well. But when i go to a barbox, sometimes i have a real hard time adjusting... At the bar i play out of our barbox is well maintained, balls are good quality so i rarely if ever lose at my home turf <i only play there on league nite-no practice> It sorta plays like the gold crowns i'm used to....


Am i just spoiled with good equipment? Should i go shoot on 'junkie stuff' more often?

Dunno- i placed terribly over the weekend and this has been bugging me. After i lost, i went straight to the poolhall i always goto and shot ten times better....

thoughts? Help? is there a 'trick' from going to 9' to barbox in aiming or something? there's also a couple places i play that has a 'cannonball' <heavy and oversized>for a cue ball on a coinop table-how do ya adjust for that whale of a thing?
Anyone else have this problem>?:confused:
Click to expand...
EVERY GAME AND TABLE SIZE IS ALWAYS HELPFUL AS LONG AS YOUR HITTING SHOTS WHERE NATURAL FOLLOW THROUGH IS USED. IF YOU PLAY IN A GOLF GAME THATS THE ONLY ONE THAT MAY HINDER BASIC IMPROVEMENT THO IT TOO WILL GIVE YOU ANOTHER PERCEPTION OF THE TABLE YOU HAVE NEVER HAD BEFORE,hope this helps you.
 
If I could add anything to this discussion that has not been said, it would be this. Regardless of the size, if the equipment is on the crappy side, dirty balls, lean on the table, and so forth, you will find to play better on it you will have to hit shots more firm. Or in some extreme cases, pounding 'em in hard to be accurate.

The problem is that you will feel this rhythm in a short while and when you leave to play on nicer equipment, it will begin to follow you. Well, you obviously know what that WILL do to your game over time. If you play hit 'em hard on the 7', and for long sessions, it will start to deteriorate your 9' game. Unless of course you are staying aware of this fact and don't let it invade you. :) Obviously, the reverse happens too, but it seems to be easier to adjust hitting them harder than going back to pocket speed. JMO
 
CueJunkiee said:
so any practice ideas to increase my position play??
Click to expand...
Learn to accurately predict and control the the path of the cue ball. What I mean is, the line it will follow when caroming off of the object ball. Knowing exactly where you are going to hit the first rail at, will greatly improve your positioning, very quickly.

Tracy
 
CueJunkiee said:
so any practice ideas to increase my position play?? ideas or some reference to where i can get some?
Click to expand...

Most books have good position drills, but you probably know that already. If you can't bring yourself to do drills religiously, then try playing rotation on the 9-footers. Use a relatively soft break to keep most of the balls in the lower 1/2 to 2/3 of the table to sort of mimic bar box crowding, and start with ball in hand after the break. Let us know when you reach the 50% level against the ghost so we can be sure to avoid playing you for money :).

Rotation is (used to be, anyway) *the* game in the Philipines. I've always thought that was the reason players from there did so well at 9-ball. It was also the primary game among Hispanics in Texas and around San Diego when I was a kid and up through the early 1970s. When I returned to playing pool two or three years ago, I noticed that nobody played rotation, and that the overall level of play had deteriorated considerably among the 9-ball crowd.
 
thanks guys still keep it coming!!!
i was actually doing some drills and a guy who played pool for a livin' ,now deals cues and hangs around my poolhall-he showed my some advanced 9ball drills... i'll be working those for a while!! i'll see how i shoot on one of the 'terrible' bar tables tonight in my league.... big cueball and all! i don't plan on losing <G>
 
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