Our Bar Rules and Playing System
- Thread starter Push&Pool
- Start date
According to his (similarly dumb) posts a year ago he's in Croatia. His expert advice then was "hit 'em hard".
pj
chgo
Investigate "RAM shot" for more info.
Yes, thanks - that's what I meant, brain fart.
The OP said he had fun, and that's what games are mostly about, no? I think it can be fun and interesting to experience other cultures, and varying bar pool rules certainly fit into that, in my opinion; as long as you are clear on the rules before you start, and locals don't spring rules on you mid-game that are to their advantage.
One part I don't understand is this:
"They are only allowed to shoot forward, in the direction towards the foot rail, in a way that their cue doesn't pass over either corner pocket. That pretty much means they can only shoot at balls positioned between right and left side pocket and the head spot, and at anything below that. If an opponent's ball or the 8 ball completely block the allowed shooting arc, the player is allowed to draw the cue ball behind the head spot until a legal shot is possible."
What does it mean, "their cue doesn't pass over either corner pocket?" Does it mean their cue stick can't be angled past the foot-end corner pockets? (I think re-reading it and writing this question cleared it up for me, but I'd like to hear the answer.)
I wonder if there's an urban anthropologist out there interested in cataloging and classifying bar pool rules.
Can you please say where this game was played?
Thanks,
jv
Sure, rules like these are used in Croatia, and as far as I know in the surrounding countries as well, maybe even farther than that. No idea where they first originated from. But pretty much every pool player here, casual or serious, knows and plays by them, with more advanced players usually playing each other using world standardized rules as well. I've personally used both, and I'd choose these bar rules and 7ft tables over anything else any day. I simply find the game much more enjoyable when played this way.
Regarding the specific rule you asked about, yes, you can't angle the cue beyond the corner pockets. If you're, for example, trying to shoot a ball positioned next to the side pocket, you need to be careful your cue butt doesn't pass over the corner pocket. If it does, you need to readjust your aim or pick a different shot which you can make legally.
And since you mentioned someone classifying bar rules around the world, I've seen an article about it a while ago. I don't seem to be able to find it right now, perhaps the page was deleted. It was quite short but interesting nonetheless.
Yes, but.... The point is, the BCA rule book doesn't consider coin-op tables, and is therefore inapplicable to bar play. In addition to what you cite as an exception, you'd probably have to waive alternate break as well, since in bars with coin-ops one doesn't play matches.
I think it would be great if a beer or booze company would come up with a set of coin-op rules, print them up, and distribute them to bars. Of course, then we'd have arguments over "Coors Rules" versus "Budweiser Rules," and so forth.
Here are some simple rules. Easy to remember too.
Call the pocket and if you don't make the ball, it's ball in hand.
You get good fast or die!!
Call the pocket and if you don't make the ball, it's ball in hand.
You get good fast or die!!
Until about 10 or 12 years ago I played a fair amount of 'bar rules' pool, and most of the rules I see here are familiar to me. And having lived in seven different states and having traveled quite a bit for work, I've seen a lot of variations on the basic set of "bar rules." In many cases, "bar rules" are simply crutches that came about for weaker players.
The problem with bar rules is that they can vary depending on where you're playing, and even who you're playing.
Once I played as couple guys from Australia, and they had a rule (this became known as "Australian" rules) where if you ran out your suit and missed the 8, your opponent got ball-in hand. I questioned the truthfulness of this "rule" but both men were adamant that this was a standard rule where they were from. I simply altered my tactics so that I never found myself in a situation where I ran out my suit with a difficult 8 ball placement.
I think that's the trick to playing bar rules in general; most of the rules are the same as you'll see in any bar anywhere, such as "you take what you break" or you have to call your shot, as in "I'm shooting the 4, the 4 into the rail, off the 9, 4 into the corner pocket," instead of just "4 in the corner." One simply makes adjustments for some rules, and avoids the ones that don't make sense.
It's still pool, after all, whatever the rules. If you're a good enough shot, you just don't allow those oddball rules to come into play.
The problem with bar rules is that they can vary depending on where you're playing, and even who you're playing.
Once I played as couple guys from Australia, and they had a rule (this became known as "Australian" rules) where if you ran out your suit and missed the 8, your opponent got ball-in hand. I questioned the truthfulness of this "rule" but both men were adamant that this was a standard rule where they were from. I simply altered my tactics so that I never found myself in a situation where I ran out my suit with a difficult 8 ball placement.
I think that's the trick to playing bar rules in general; most of the rules are the same as you'll see in any bar anywhere, such as "you take what you break" or you have to call your shot, as in "I'm shooting the 4, the 4 into the rail, off the 9, 4 into the corner pocket," instead of just "4 in the corner." One simply makes adjustments for some rules, and avoids the ones that don't make sense.
It's still pool, after all, whatever the rules. If you're a good enough shot, you just don't allow those oddball rules to come into play.
Nah, I'll definitely stick to no shot calling and no ball in hand. Those two make the game too straightforward for me. You either make the shot or you lose.
Our bar rules allow for different approaches to the game. You can be more aggressive if you're a very accurate player and have a good position play, and attempt to pocket as many balls as quickly as possible, leaving yourself an easy shot on the 8. A friend of mine is mostly like that.
Or you can have a more defensive strategy, so if you fail to make your shot, or have no good balls available in the first place, you leave your opponent locked down and unable to hit mostly anything. You draw out the game when necessary, patiently waiting for an opening or an opponent's mistake to finish the game. My best friend's style leans somewhat in that direction.
Finally, you can be something like me. If I have a good shot available, or if the shot is difficult but I'm confident I'll make it, I'll take it. If no good options are available, I'll do one of the following: 1. Play a simple defensive shot to lock down my opponent, without trying to pocket anything 2. Try to open up a problem ball for future use 3. Select a cluster of my balls and smash it full speed, hoping to drop at least one of my balls, and rearrange the table in the process to hopefully gain more advantageous ball positions for the rest of the game. And if the opponent plays defense on me, I often blast away at anything I can legally hit, in order to force my way out of a difficult position and potentially create problems for my opponent.
In the end, when the three of us play each other, it comes down to who has the better day. We're all capable of defeating each other, despite the differences in our style and skillset. That's the result of the great balance our rules bring to the game.
I like it...
When I show kids in the room things, I tell them ( with as serious a face as I can ) "If you miss a straight in ball, it's a foul. If you miss a " semi-difficult" shots ( which I think is actually a misnomer. For me, there are no "semi-difficult" shots. It's all mental. If you can make contact in the proper spot on the OB, it will go. If you hit it with the proper english, correct stroke, correct speed, you will get position ), it's a half foul."
Usually they look at me like I'm full of s**t. Which, ok, yeah... I *am*. But, the smarter ones realize I'm really saying "Don't miss straight in balls. You'll get penalized one way or another."
And you will...
Cinch the shot.
I'd agree on that one. A good player remains a good player, no matter which rules are applied. However, one needs to adapt the strategy and playing style to the specific ruleset. For example, I would never smash away from a difficult position in a call shot game. You wouldn't intentionally send the 8 ball in the kitchen and scratch at the same time if there's ball in hand applied, while it's a perfectly good tactic where I play. Also, there are many things to watch out for when it's last pocket, such as preferably not pocketing your last ball in a side pocket, or choosing a pattern which ultimately leads to an easier shot on the 8.
I think you already learned that these forums are not for players that like made up rules, especially convoluted ones. These sound more or less like any other "rules" that you would find an any random bar played by players that don't know how to play or what the rules to games are. A bit like what you would find if you tried to play baseball with some people from the Amazon rain forest that only learned to play by watching one game without the sound on. Sometimes a ball is hit and you run, sometimes a ball is hit and you don't run, sometimes the guy catches the ball but you are not out, but no-one knows why or what causes that to happen. Your rules are just like that.
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Bar pool is no different than other bar games such as:
Virtual Darts
Air hockey
Pinball
Pac-man
Corn hole
Beer pong
Shuffleboard
Photo booth
Pop-a-shot
At a bar recently an annoying guy was playing pool, and foosball, and darts.
I told him he was a triathlete
It's not that I don't like bar pool, it's just that I hate bar pool.
Virtual Darts
Air hockey
Pinball
Pac-man
Corn hole
Beer pong
Shuffleboard
Photo booth
Pop-a-shot
At a bar recently an annoying guy was playing pool, and foosball, and darts.
I told him he was a triathlete
It's not that I don't like bar pool, it's just that I hate bar pool.
I'm aware this forum isn't dedicated to bar pool. First of all, I'm not forcing anyone to play this way, I posted it here for people interested in this topic to read and comment. If someone doesn't want to participate in the discussion or somehow feels offended by talk of bar rules, they don't need to read a single letter. That's why the words "Bar Rules" are in the thread title.
Second, these rules may be "convoluted" comparing to world standardized rules, but they have a long tradition and are used by thousands of players across several countries every day. Sure, there are regional and local differences, but the core of these rules remains the same. The fact is, even serious pool players here use them when playing for fun. It's something basically every pool player learns as they first pick up a cue.
So it isn't something I made up with my friends overnight because "regular" pool was too hard or something. It has long ago become a game of its own in our region, quite different from both the world standardized 8ball, and the US bar 8ball. Yes, we can still play using standard rules, at least some of us who are more invested into pool. But I like the bar version more. Simple personal preference. Not saying one or the other is better, as both have their ups and downs.
To conclude, I advise that none of you treat this just as 8ball played by bad players. There's a large number of very experienced players, both casual and tournament level, who play this way here. Better treat it as a separate pool game, as it's hardly the 8ball you know. Though still, as we said earlier, a good player here is a good player there and vice versa.
"They are only allowed to shoot forward, in the direction towards the foot rail, in a way that their cue doesn't pass over either corner pocket."
It's a tough choice as there are many worthy contenders, but this one appears to be the most moronic rule of the bunch.
It's a tough choice as there are many worthy contenders, but this one appears to be the most moronic rule of the bunch.
That there is signature worthy.
One other thing I'll say about bar pool rules.
As I mentioned earlier, I believe that bar rules are intended to give weaker players a better chance against better players. For instance, none of my co-workers can really play, though a couple are decent shot makers. But if I bear down just a little and play to win, using safeties, etc., none of them can beat me.
Oh, once in a while one will get lucky and take a game, or even two. But even in a short race to 3, I'm winning that every time. So when I play with them, we play a version of bar rules, with the addition of "no safeties." Which taught me to play "two-way" shots instead. Bar rules gives them a slightly better chance of taking a game, winning a beer, and I don't have to play left-handed or with my eyes closed or whatever.
Last word:
We should all be playing bar pool occasionally. At least if we have any thought to growing the game. Because pool is on the decline, or at least it is in every town and every state I've lived in so far in the last 33 years. Bars are getting rid of their pool tables in favor of dance floors or karaoke or just extra floor space for tables. Just in the last five years I've seen at least 10 bars I used to frequent get rid of their tables.
And many of the other places I shoot now are barely keeping themselves afloat.
Getting more strictly amateurs to enjoy the game can only benefit our game as a whole.
Getting off the soapbox now.
Peace.
As I mentioned earlier, I believe that bar rules are intended to give weaker players a better chance against better players. For instance, none of my co-workers can really play, though a couple are decent shot makers. But if I bear down just a little and play to win, using safeties, etc., none of them can beat me.
Oh, once in a while one will get lucky and take a game, or even two. But even in a short race to 3, I'm winning that every time. So when I play with them, we play a version of bar rules, with the addition of "no safeties." Which taught me to play "two-way" shots instead. Bar rules gives them a slightly better chance of taking a game, winning a beer, and I don't have to play left-handed or with my eyes closed or whatever.
Last word:
We should all be playing bar pool occasionally. At least if we have any thought to growing the game. Because pool is on the decline, or at least it is in every town and every state I've lived in so far in the last 33 years. Bars are getting rid of their pool tables in favor of dance floors or karaoke or just extra floor space for tables. Just in the last five years I've seen at least 10 bars I used to frequent get rid of their tables.
And many of the other places I shoot now are barely keeping themselves afloat.
Getting more strictly amateurs to enjoy the game can only benefit our game as a whole.
Getting off the soapbox now.
Peace.
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That last thing about pool being on the decline is something I noticed here too. It's still popular, but several bars closed or got rid of the pool tables in the last several years. Big tournaments are great and all, but it's the casuals and amateurs that keep pool afloat. A long time ago I already said that we as a community need to promote and improve low-level league play, by making it as fun and attractive (and cheap) as possible for the average person, especially younger ones. Casual bar tournaments with a little cash or beer as reward are also the way to go. Anything that makes pool accessible, cheap and fun for the masses, and profitable for bar and pool room owners as well.