Passow or Brunswick - one and the same?

[Mr. Bond]

This has turned out to be a little more interesting than I would have expected. But we do need some more information to proceed....

Just like the ball return system, we may also be able to identify it by the pocket irons, or the dimensions of certain pieces...

I need pics of a corner pocket iron, not installed on the table, from the top and the bottom..

And measure the dimensions of a leg (how wide) examp: 10"x9" square.

And, look for a tiny sticker anywhere on the table that says " Union Made "


As a side note: In the photo of the second table, the caption mentions the table being " Bauhaus style"...
However, from what I understand thus far, the Bauhaus movement didn't really emerge until the 20's and 30's, and this table appears to pre-date that period altogether. Especially if Passow built it circa 1900 as the caption suggests.

It may be more reasonable to label it as an example of 'german modernism'.

 

[eileenwilson]

tell me about it, i'm am trying to find anything online... i appreciate your help!

we should take delivery this week, i'll snap the pics and get the info for you then.

thanks!!
eileen

 

[eileenwilson]

It's getting setup now! Got some pics of it, taking more.

The leg is 8.5" X 8.5" - 23" tall

Pocket iron pics coming as well.

 

[eileenwilson]

and here are the pics, there's a lot so bear with me. There was numbers all in the insides, so I wanted to be sure to get that. No Union Made sticker anywhere and no other identifying marks really.... hope this helps! BTW, I LOVE IT, it plays beautifully, and the rails turned out gorgeous! He did such a great job re-vitalizing this!

 

[eileenwilson]

and more! I have plenty more, let me know if you need any

 

[eileenwilson]

here she is all done

 

[Randy from Indy]

Yeah, it's a Passow, I had the same model in a 12 snooker, never could find a model name & it took a decade to sell it!

 

[manwon]

I have done extensive research in an attempt to learn the history of a Passow table I have owned for the last 60 years. It was made around 1900. I believe it was made for Passow by Brunswick. Here's why;
1. The manufacturer's metal label on the end rail identifies the table as Passow and Sons. The nameplate is, however, in the identical shape of the Brunswick logo used on many tables. Only the name is different.
2. According to a former Brunswick employee whom I spoke to 30 years ago and who was then retired (probably long gone), he told me Brunswick often made tables for other retailers and put the dealer's name on the table instead of their own.
3. My table is identical to the Brunswick Delaware model.
4. The description in the Passow 1907 catalog and the Brunswick Delaware model have nearly identical descriptions, including the use of the patented steel rod through the legs into the frame.
Does anyone out there have any other information that could either verify or contradict my reasoning?
My table does have a serial number printed in ink on the underframe but no names or other identifying marks.
Thanks for any light you can shed on this.

Many table repair companies at that time would switch out the name plates on tables after they worked on them or restored them. I think it was an early form of advertising. I even have some cues here in my shop that have a label change to reflect a company that to my knowledge never made cues.

I think this was a common thing back in the day, so I suspect your right the table is most likely a Brunswick. Have you ever had the table apart and looked for any of the part numbers or serial numbers?

 

[Mr. Bond]

Yeah, it's a Passow, I had the same model in a 12 snooker, never could find a model name & it took a decade to sell it!

Did the rails have diamonds or round MOP like this one?

Did it have leather shields with "snaps" like this one?

Did it have a Passow nameplate?

 

[Mr. Bond]

It's getting setup now! Got some pics of it, taking more.

The leg is 8.5" X 8.5" - 23" tall

Pocket iron pics coming as well.

Thanks for all the pics. They really help a lot.

However, here's the number one problem: Table makers copied each other. And did so frequently. This is part of the reason that Brunswick defended their patents so adamantly...

(I'm gonna go ahead and post this information here, rather than sending you an email so that some of the general public will get to see how difficult it can be to simply identify the maker of a table)


Your "Passow" table has a few dopplegangers....







Apparently this model was copied, by more than one table maker.
These two catalog images are from 1912 and 1918 but neither are Passow.
As a matter of fact, Passow may have even copied it from someone else.
Without a patent record, or something, how would we ever know for sure?

My concerns are as follows:

1. Your table has round, what appears to be mother-of-pearl sights, as opposed to ivory or some other type of "diamond" shape sights. This seems to be inconsistent for the time period. (The Passow patent that you posted also shows diamond shaped sites on the rails circa 1913)

2. The rail caps ( the rail's surface) also appears to be in exceptionally good condition for its age.

-This leads me to believe that either the rails are not original, OR, the rails have been totally re-veneered. This would explain round sights being added later, and "new" looking wood on the rails.

3. Your table has "#6" pocket irons. The table in the Passow patent you posted has #3 pocket irons. (But Passow could have used both, we don't know this for certain)

4. The ball return doesnt match Passow's patented ball return. Although he most certainly had more than one type of ball return over the years, so this doesnt matter that much.


out of time now...more later

 

[eileenwilson]

thanks! crazy, this table is a mystery!

 

[Mr. Bond]

I consulted with several experts from the east coast, the midwest, and the west coast. Each was skeptical, but all admitted that they could see no reason why it wouldnt be a Passow table. In other words, it's not exactly a slam dunk case, but considering all things, it's probably a Passow.

Enjoy!

P.s. maybe we'll get lucky and some better documentation will surface some day.

 

[heyjerr]

I had the privilege of buying Eileen's table when she was forced to move it almost 2 years ago. Plays great but am wondering if any new info has come to light on this model and approximate date of manufacture?

Jerry