Phillipino dominance?

f210 said:
I think they did this already. If I remember it correctly, Wu, Chao and Yang, etc came over to play against Manalo, Orcullo, Corteza and a couple of others I can not remember at this time and team Philippines beat Taiwan pretty handily even without Efren and Bustamante. And Manalo and Orcullo were not even famous players then so it was considered as the Philippine's second rated players against the best from Taiwan.
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I knew someone would bring this up...

I followed this match-up closely, and by all accounts the equipment they played on was a sham: slow-nap cloth, bucket pockets, hometown fans.

The pockets were secondary, but I don't think any of the Taiwanese players (with the exception of Chao and Lee and a few older players) have ever SEEN nap cloth in person. The Taiwanese tour is played on some kind of knock-off 760, it's lightning fast and the pockets are all tighter than a normal triple-shim.

In any case, you can say that a win is a win but if there's ever a rematch in Taiwan under home-town equipment specs, I would bet very large on the Taiwanese contingent.

-Roger
 
f210 said:
I totally agree. The Taiwan players, IMHO, only do well when they are in their own country and sometimes in Asia. Take then out of their comfort zone and they do not do very well compared to the Filipinos who can play in any country and usually do excellent.

Wu and Kuo went to the USA for the IPT and they hardly made a dent. Wu even failed to qualify the first time and when he did, he was hardly noticed. Compare it to Orcollo who qualified his first try in a very strong field. He is the only player together with Reyes who ended up in the top 5 of the 2 IPT tournaments. We certainly noticed Orcollo and Manalo when they first came to the USA but cannot say the same for Kuo and Wu.
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I agree that the Taiwanese are most comfortable in Asia. But consider the fact that Efren and Parica and other old time Pinoys have set up shop in the US for decades, and they have effectively laid down some very important logistical framework for latter Filipinos looking to tour stateside. They can also communicate in English.

With the exception of Chao, no Taiwanese player have had any reason to tour the U.S., and Chao's record here is plenty impressive. Wu and Kuo's gutshot draw for the IPT is a joke, that's for sure, but remember that Wu is the reining World 8-ball Champion (for whatever that's worth), which was played in UAE, of all places.

If the IPT did not fizzle out, and the Taiwanese place a concerted effort into acclimating to the American environment (the way Pinoy players have), I see no reason why they can't perform on par.

-Roger
 
jay helfert said:
Actually, you make good points here. Definitely a tougher match if they play on "fast cloth", as the filipinos lose some edge they have with the tight cue ball control they play.
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Overall I think the Taiwanese players are forced to play with tighter cue ball patterns, precisely because the cloth is so fast and the pockets so damned small.

But, on heart alone, I still would have to bet on them. They seem to figure out a way to win under any conditions.
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Definitely agree that the Pinoys have more heart, and more personality. Have you ever seen a live telecast of a Taiwanese tour event? It's like they're playing at a funeral.

-Roger
 
Honestly...when come to accuracy, the Taiwanese are better. They are train with small pockets everyday. Most pro cannot even make it to round 1 during the WPC2005 and there is many missing shots.
 
f210 said:
I think they did this already. If I remember it correctly, Wu, Chao and Yang, etc came over to play against Manalo, Orcullo, Corteza and a couple of others I can not remember at this time and team Philippines beat Taiwan pretty handily even without Efren and Bustamante. And Manalo and Orcullo were not even famous players then so it was considered as the Philippine's second rated players against the best from Taiwan.
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Are you saying they did this before "once" out of many "tries"?:D
 
buddha162 said:
but if there's ever a rematch in Taiwan under home-town equipment specs, I would bet very large on the Taiwanese contingent.

-Roger
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There was. Efren and Django played Chao and Yang in Taiwan and beat them. There was even a YouTube link posted here at one time, remember?
 
Sprite said:

Are you saying they did this before "once" out of many "tries"?:D
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1 time only per my recollection and it was before the careers of Manalo and Orcollo took off.
 
bandido said:
There was. Efren and Django played Chao and Yang in Taiwan and beat them. There was even a YouTube link posted here at one time, remember?
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That was a "fun" scotch-doubles match before the main event, hardly a rematch of a mosconi-cup style vein. The spirit of that match-up was Pinoy Sensai -Grasshopper vs. Chinese Sensai - Grasshopper...except in the case of Yang and Chao the grasshopper has surpassed his master.

-Roger (it was a very fun match to watch, but please...)
 
buddha162 said:
That was a "fun" scotch-doubles match before the main event, hardly a rematch of a mosconi-cup style vein. The spirit of that match-up was Pinoy Sensai -Grasshopper vs. Chinese Sensai - Grasshopper...except in the case of Yang and Chao the grasshopper has surpassed his master.

-Roger (it was a very fun match to watch, but please...)
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:) excuses, excuses..hahaha LOL:p
 
Where did this guy go ? :rolleyes:

Playsome said:
This is sooo not true about the U.S. contingent of pool players. Corey, Gabe, Schmidt, and many others SVB speed and UP could beat and have beaten the best the world can offer. We have DOZENS of world beaters here, believe it! ........................ Marc
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The players you mentioned are no doubt great players.. But besides corey I don’t think they would be really up to par with the filipinos and taiwanese. SVB is so good but he couldn’t even qualify for the worlds where as “no named” taiwanese and filipinos took almost all of the qualifiers.

Playsome said:
Most of the field at the WPC would go broke on the road here in the USA...Also, it is laughable to think JSchmidt didn't go out of fear of the competition! .......................... Marc
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Go broke on the road in the US ?? You got to be kidding right ??? the field at the WPC is the best in the world .. a road trip to these guys is going thru the philipines.. not the US

Have you seen “most of the field” from the wpc play yet ? or you just talking out your ass ? and who said that JS didnt go because he is scurred ?? nobody said that ?
 
f210 said:
I think they did this already. If I remember it correctly, Wu, Chao and Yang, etc came over to play against Manalo, Orcullo, Corteza and a couple of others I can not remember at this time and team Philippines beat Taiwan pretty handily even without Efren and Bustamante. And Manalo and Orcullo were not even famous players then so it was considered as the Philippine's second rated players against the best from Taiwan.
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Is this the one they had in SM Megamall?
 
f210, as I had said previously. those tourneys were just invitational, meaning "not an official group vs group tournament like a mosconi cup". there was nothing to be fought over except for some cash incentives. as long as it is not an official tourney, we can never say who is the best team for that year of play. I'm talking about a group event ok?! though it's a fact that the filipinos are ahead when it comes to money games and individual tourneys (2006 report). I think that is is also fair for team asia to have a tourney like that of a mosconi. I think the name Reyes Cup fits perfectly well. however considering it is Reyes' tourney, I guess he will be barred from playing being it's godfather. :D

Roger, I have seen those telecasts alright. it almost bored me to death if I haven't change the channel for 10 mins. lucky that I was able to escape with my life. :D the players were stiff as sticks. it's like watching some dead men staring at the table without any reaction. I hate to say this but it was like pool at it's brink of extinction :D
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NO, you won't see Phil VS Taiwan in an officially sanctioned tournament. It will have to be Phil VS China. :)

An army of Chinese picking up cue stick that is a scary thought.
 
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Hail Mary Shot said:
f210, as I had said previously. those tourneys were just invitational, meaning "not an official group vs group tournament like a mosconi cup". there was nothing to be fought over except for some cash incentives. as long as it is not an official tourney, we can never say who is the best team for that year of play. I'm talking about a group event ok?! though it's a fact that the filipinos are ahead when it comes to money games and individual tourneys (2006 report). I think that is is also fair for team asia to have a tourney like that of a mosconi. I think the name Reyes Cup fits perfectly well. however considering it is Reyes' tourney, I guess he will be barred from playing being it's godfather. :D :D
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Hey, I am all for it. Better yet, instead of just Philippines and Taiwan, have another World Cup of Pool, but this time have 5 to 8 players per team/country and not only 2 like the last one. I will still put my money on Team Philippines.
 
Playsome said:
Most of the field at the WPC would go broke on the road here in the USA...Also, it is laughable to think JSchmidt didn't go out of fear of the competition! .......................... Marc
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LOL, if most of those players can easily get a player's visa to go on tour the USA, Americans will probably ask the goverment to put a quota on foreign players that can get into the US pool scene.

This guy thinks that because almost 2/3rd of the field in WPC are unknown, that most of the players have sub-par skills.
 
just for info. Inorder to qualify for a spot in the WPC tourney, one must earn enough points. to earn these points, one must enter into tournaments sanctioned by the WPC. but also entering these tournaments mean that you must atleast be in the top 10 of every tourney inorder to have a chance of being seeded in the WPC (a sure way of entry). these tournaments often have large turnouts of participants from a minimum of 100 participants. some tournaments can even reach more than 200 participants (this figure is in Asia alone). because of this large turnout, tournaments have quotas. the qualifying alone is tough enough for these participants. imagine a field of 200 participants scrambling for a spot in the WPC. yet the WPC only allows a field of 128 participants. so the point is, there is no fluke in qualifying. each and every one of these qualifiers got what it takes and have the potential to become a champion. alcano is a good example, the guy was even on the waiting list of qualifiers and was almost around dead last of the field of 128. yet he won the WPC. I hope PLAYSOME got the point. :D
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Filipino dominance?

Fleece's assesment that only one American (Earl) as against the Filipinos holds most of the majors is true. But if the gauge of dominance is in terms of money, local and international titles won, I bet my last penny on the Filipinos. Moreover, they have just joined the American pool scene some 21 years ago, yet they have amassed already the biggest prizes there are....


www.filipinopool.com
 
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