Pocket size and alterations question

B

bdorman

Dead money
Silver Member
Our community center has an 8ft table (largest the room will accommodate) with approx. 5-inch pockets, point-to-point. It works well for us because most of the players are either very new to the game or 65+ years old. Smaller pockets would make the game too difficult, we'd lose players and then we'd lose the room (the managers of the community center aren't going to keep a room dedicated to a use that's only for 8-10 people...so let's not argue about it, okay?)

Anyway, we'd like to upgrade the table to something like Diamond or Gold Crown. I see that they make 8 or 8-1/2 foot tables but I'm concerned about the pocket size (and the shelf of the Diamond).

But if you "widen" the pocket by increasing the angle-cut of the cushion aren't you going to cause balls to more easily rattle out? It seems like a no-win compromise: a ball will rebound into a tighter pocket but rattle out if you cut the point-to-point cushion opening wider.

Is my logic about the angle-cut of the cushion correct?

Any suggestions for a high quality table with approximately 5-inch pockets?
 
Table

bdorman said:
Our community center has an 8ft table (largest the room will accommodate) with approx. 5-inch pockets, point-to-point. It works well for us because most of the players are either very new to the game or 65+ years old. Smaller pockets would make the game too difficult, we'd lose players and then we'd lose the room (the managers of the community center aren't going to keep a room dedicated to a use that's only for 8-10 people...so let's not argue about it, okay?)

Anyway, we'd like to upgrade the table to something like Diamond or Gold Crown. I see that they make 8 or 8-1/2 foot tables but I'm concerned about the pocket size (and the shelf of the Diamond).

But if you "widen" the pocket by increasing the angle-cut of the cushion aren't you going to cause balls to more easily rattle out? It seems like a no-win compromise: a ball will rebound into a tighter pocket but rattle out if you cut the point-to-point cushion opening wider.

Is my logic about the angle-cut of the cushion correct?

Any suggestions for a high quality table with approximately 5-inch pockets?
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When you say upgrade do you mean purchasing a new table or a used table?
There is several pro 8 size tables new and used on the market today.
I'll suggest that you could find a decent used 8' gold crown and have mark gregory rework the rails to your wishes and you will be pocketing balls as desired.

Rob.M
 
Diamond Home tables come with 5" pockets and their built like a tank, Also you can order the ProAM with League pockets which are 4 3/4".
 
I've seen plenty of Brunswick tables that definitely don't last a lifetime, so you've got commercial grade and home grade tables with any manufacturer. That being said, a Diamond Professional or Pro-Am model with league cut pockets will play good but not too tough. There are also some good Brunswick models that will stand up to commercial use, but play fair without modification.
 
Club Billiards said:
I've seen plenty of Brunswick tables that definitely don't last a lifetime, so you've got commercial grade and home grade tables with any manufacturer. That being said, a Diamond Professional or Pro-Am model with league cut pockets will play good but not too tough. There are also some good Brunswick models that will stand up to commercial use, but play fair without modification.
Click to expand...

The main reason that a Brunswick won't last a life time....is because the mechanics destroy them.......best tables made.
I don't work for Brunswick or any other company.......just worked on just about all the other tables.
Brunswick's commercial tables stand alone....GC5 is without doubt the best table made today.....bar none.

Mark Gregory
 
perfectpocketz said:
The main reason that a Brunswick won't last a life time....is because the mechanics destroy them.......best tables made.
I don't work for Brunswick or any other company.......just worked on just about all the other tables.
Brunswick's commercial tables stand alone....GC5 is without doubt the best table made today.....bar none.

Mark Gregory
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I agree 100% with the part about the guys working on the tables destroying them. That's also why I prefer Diamond tables. There's less margin for error in how the parts fit together, so less wiggle room or need to twist, torque, warp and cross-thread parts to get them together. In my opinion, that better design makes for a better table, but that's strictly from the standpoint of working on them/maintaining them.

Keep in mind, my GC background is pretty limited to 1's and 2's around here. Most of what sells in this area are cheaper import home tables. As a matter of fact, the Brunswick dealers around here have closed up, so I haven't had much opportunity to work on the newer models. I'm sure that contributes to my opinion. You can only put together so many 1's with warped blinds and bent casting ears without thinking they might have some design flaws. :D
 
perfectpocketz said:
Diamond tables aren't even close to a tank.....Brunswick tables are the best tables ever made....and last a life time.

Mark Gregory
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Not going to argue this point, but a GC5 side by side with a Diamond ProAm 20 years down the road in a pool room environment, the GC5 is going to show it's age way more than a Diamond will...with the commercial use placed upon them. They're both great tables don't get me wrong, but at twice the cost of a Diamond, the GC5 can only lose it's value right out the gate, whereas the Diamond over the years is going to actually go up in value, as Diamond, unlike Brunswick...is not going to be building a ProAm2, 3, 4, or 5, but Brunswick is guaranteed to replace it's GC5 with a GC6...it's just a matter of time. Diamond has had it's flaws, but has worked hard to correct them, and has succeeded in making the changes needed to in my view, "perfect their tables" whereas you know as well as I do, Brunswick should have offered the GC5 with a 30mm slate instead of the 1" slate it comes with, the frame of the GC5 can change to much with dry air and humidity, swelling and shrinking the solid wood frame...and I mean a lot, as in overkill...solid wood frame. But, never-the-less...so called "table mechanic's out here working"....can destroy even a "tank" built table...so, in the end, it really makes no difference who builds the best, longest lasting table on the planet...it's only going to last as long as whoever is working on it.

Personally, I like both, the GC's and Diamond's, and don't really care to work on anything else out here in the market...even if it pays the same to do so:D

Glen
 
realkingcobra said:
Not going to argue this point, but a GC5 side by side with a Diamond ProAm 20 years down the road in a pool room environment, the GC5 is going to show it's age way more than a Diamond will...with the commercial use placed upon them. They're both great tables don't get me wrong, but at twice the cost of a Diamond, the GC5 can only lose it's value right out the gate, whereas the Diamond over the years is going to actually go up in value, as Diamond, unlike Brunswick...is not going to be building a ProAm2, 3, 4, or 5, but Brunswick is guaranteed to replace it's GC5 with a GC6...it's just a matter of time. Diamond has had it's flaws, but has worked hard to correct them, and has succeeded in making the changes needed to in my view, "perfect their tables" whereas you know as well as I do, Brunswick should have offered the GC5 with a 30mm slate instead of the 1" slate it comes with, the frame of the GC5 can change to much with dry air and humidity, swelling and shrinking the solid wood frame...and I mean a lot, as in overkill...solid wood frame. But, never-the-less...so called "table mechanic's out here working"....can destroy even a "tank" built table...so, in the end, it really makes no difference who builds the best, longest lasting table on the planet...it's only going to last as long as whoever is working on it.

Personally, I like both, the GC's and Diamond's, and don't really care to work on anything else out here in the market...even if it pays the same to do so:D

Glen
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Well....I have yet to see the diamond table go up in value over the years....sure the Brunswick cost is more....but your purchasing much more of table quality. The rail cap diamond uses is for sure a thing of beauty.
But....nothing more on that table will out last anything on a Brunswick GC5.

The Formica top on Brunswick GC tables will show damage from play and mechanics work for sure...other than the cushions....which diamond uses Artemis cushions...that will last years...but play fast....take more spin...Brunswick super speed play more consistent for pool than any cushion.

Sure...I had some input on the build of the GC5 design and changes from the GC4.....and I truly believe....the GC5 is without doubt not only the best looking commercial table today....but also the best playing table as well.

That GC5 table is build like a tank....and will last a life time for sure....even with today's bad mechanic's working on them.


Mark Gregory
 
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