Problems With This Shot

CreeDo said:
My bad, I thought your bridging over the 6 ball meant an elevated cue butt... it looks like it would only affect it a few degrees though. Still, swerve might have been what caused the miss.

I disagree with Russ's zigzag path under the 6 ball. The general rule applies - minimize cueball movement. With the zigzag path it's very easy to end up on the 50 yard line... you hit a foot short on your 6 feet of travel (very possible) and it's sitting on the rail with a 40+ degree cut in the side or corner. If you hit it one foot too hard up near the head spot and it becomes a real tester.
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Creedo,

The point Louis and I were trying to make is that by playing the Z path, you are actually playing position for a shot in 4 different pockets, and you don't have to worry about spinning the ball.

Yes, if you hit this shot a foot too hard, or a foot too soft, the shot gets tricky.. But any of the two feet in between leaves a good shot.

No worries though. A soft follow cross table with a longer shot on the 6 is a lot better for some people. It's just that I don't like cutting the 6 backwards with a fairly forceful draw stroke. So, I try to find other position routes.

Personally, I like to accept a small risk (for my style) of getting non optimum shape, in order to be out for sure if I am successful.

I've seen a lot of those 4-5 foot shots where you have to stun across table fairly firmly jawed out on tight tables.

Russ
 
Russ Chewning said:
Creedo,

The point Louis and I were trying to make is that by playing the Z path, you are actually playing position for a shot in 4 different pockets, and you don't have to worry about spinning the ball.

Yes, if you hit this shot a foot too hard, or a foot too soft, the shot gets tricky.. But any of the two feet in between leaves a good shot.

No worries though. A soft follow cross table with a longer shot on the 6 is a lot better for some people. It's just that I don't like cutting the 6 backwards with a fairly forceful draw stroke. So, I try to find other position routes.

Personally, I like to accept a small risk (for my style) of getting non optimum shape, in order to be out for sure if I am successful.

I've seen a lot of those 4-5 foot shots where you have to stun across table fairly firmly jawed out on tight tables.

Russ
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If I'm bridging over the 6-ball (as is the case in the diagram), I really like your shot. Hit it firm and you take so much out of the equation. If I can level my cue, I'm going to float that 5-ball in and hold up the cue-ball.
 
Jude Rosenstock said:
I dunno. From what I see here, I'm spinning this ball in with right. My goal is to have the cue-ball die before it crosses the middle of the table which shouldn't be tough to do. My reason for using no draw is simple - You get swerve that way and you're likely to overcut the ball. You can use right, hit it slightly thicker since you'll throw it a little and not get much cue-ball movement.
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I'm inclined to agree with Jude's plan. Keep it simple. A touch of right should allow you to pocket the 5 and have the CB end up near the middle of the table for the 6.

Other suggestions like Russ's zig-zag path :eek: add more complexity than is necessary here. You could make the 5 and easily lose position on the CB for the 6.
 
i like aaron and jude's assesment here - to play to hold for the next ball whatever it is, the angle is too much to play it without any sidespin. so soft speed, low right english.

OR, and unless i'm mistaken and nobody has noticed, you could just play it centre ball ish to go into the rail and bounce directly out to the opposite long rail, slight touch off that and you have the six all in the corner pocket. the eight is close enough to the middle of the table to provide a big enough window to play position under it i think.


also something was mentioned i read this thread i think about cardinal rule of minimal cue ball travel. surely this is wrong, because it goes against two more important rules in playing postion into the line of the shot if possible and keeping the shots natural (ie touch of outside rather than heaps of inside english on a shot). any thoughts?
 
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Jude Rosenstock said:
If I'm bridging over the 6-ball (as is the case in the diagram), I really like your shot. Hit it firm and you take so much out of the equation. If I can level my cue, I'm going to float that 5-ball in and hold up the cue-ball.
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Oh yeah.. definitely.. I only shoot this shot if I have to jack up a little..

Russ
 
maybe table differences come into play? on a fast cloth surely just draw won't kill enough speed off the cue ball to hold for the six?
 
sounds like your stroke failed you...

These words of yours seem important to me:

"...so i eased up a little, and tried to put too much low right on the shot, compensating for hitting it a little easier. also, i had to bridge over the 6-Ball which somewhat affected the shot and stroke."

It reminds me somewhat of golf...instead of taking a smaller club and giving it a full swing, we grab a larger club and take a slower swing...we decelerate the swing. Which leads to disaster. You've got to give it a full swing.

Sounds to me like you were probably not fully convinced of the stroke you were going to use. When you say 'let up' that sounds to me like you didn't stroke it with authority...that instead of the cue gaining velocity as it is stroked - it decelerated...and like the above golf swing...disaster strikes.

My hunch is you had too many thoughts about the dangers of this shot...and there are real pitfalls here...and were not fully confident that you had the right plan of attack...meaning to fully focus on the stroke that you need at that particular time.

Make your calculations...take your time...then make your clear decision on how you will successfully play the shot...then get down and focus on the shot...and trust your stroke...

Peace...
 
DrCue'sProtege said:
ok posters, i had this shot at the table a couple of nights ago, and proceeded to mess up. i overcut this, and shot the 5-Ball into the short rail along Point B. i intended to hit this with just a little easy low right, trying to bring the cue ball back to around Point A.

i wanted to avoid the 8-Ball at all costs, and not get anywhere near it.
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DCP, You might want to try simplifying this pattern a bit. Move the CB so that it is one diamond away from the 5. Now make the 5 and get position on the 6. When you become proficient with this simplified pattern, move the CB so that it is two diamonds away from the 6. Repeat drill, each time increasing the CB's distance from the 5.

The goal is to start out by practicing with an easier layout, become proficient at it, and then increase the level of difficulty. :)
 
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