Pro's Cues And Their Influence

drivermaker said:
How much influence does a pro have on your future cue buying choice?
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0%

Why is that you ask??? Well its common knowledge that 99% of us don't have the talent of the pros in any sport we play. Only well known pros (in their given sport) endorse any product. Well they can, because the financial gain from endorsing the product will (and does) offset the "cost" of endorsing an "off the self" product that you and I can buy.

Now I think I have to explain this position a bit..... Let me flesh it out.


A pros "off the self " product (club, glove, racket, or what have you) is tailored to what they request by the manufacturer. Via grip.. etc... etc...


Now I think (OK take it with a grain of salt or a drunken selfish theory) a pool cue can be is more like a instrument (like a guitar, violin, or what have you) and a golf club, glove, bat or stick....

Anyone musical, with professional, talent can play a song and have it sound special with any guitar, but the artist with their particular setup and style can make that piece their own. Now I'd respect the guitarist (musician) for a band who is looking for a certain sound over a guy who is shilling a glove or a club....

Our sport is about making balls into pockets. Any stick can do this. A pro will look to sweeten or tune there cue to what there happy with. Now a true artist will look for something that will help them achieve greatness in their art.
 
Now with that being said I always buy a custom (Webb) stick because I can get it (to manufacture) to hit (play) the way I like. Now if I had a gun to my head to buy something off the self it would be a Schon. It would get me 80% of what I'm used to using.
 
I think it depends on how much the pro himself really talks up the cue. I saw Earl Strickland when he was still with Meucci shooting an awesome shot over and over at a pro tournament and loudly proclaiming Meucci was the only cue in the world you can shoot that shot with. I counted Meucci cues among the people in that pro event and over 1/4 of the field was playing with Meucci cues. On the other hand I saw another top pro playing with a ------- brand cue who sponsored him and he told a small group sitting there that he believed brand -------- was better than the brand he was playing with, but if a man will pay you to play with his cues then you play with it. Jim Rempe really talks Meucci up every chance he gets. Those who just put their picture and name out there will help a brand some, but those who really act like their heart is in it will do alot more.
I once was talking to a man from Japan at a trade show who did not recognize my logo and spoke very poor English. But then when his interpeter told him my name was Hightower he said, "Oh Yes, so and so Japanese pro played with one of your cues." He knew I did not pay the guy to play with it. The pro had bought the cue from me a few years earlier at another show. Well the fact that he knew that guy chose to play with my cue must have helped because he bought my two highest end cues to resale. So yes the pros help, but it is not often that a pro will make or break a brand.
Chris
www.hightowercues.com
 
Pros in asia help tremendously, even pros being SEEN in Asia help the cuemaker tons. Look at Mika and Capone: they couldn't tell mike capone from al capone before mika picked up his cue.

It's cuz A.) pool is a real sport over there, and B.) the Japanese/Taiwanese market is rooted in trend purchases like you've never seen.

-Roger
 
buddha162 said:
Pros in asia help tremendously, even pros being SEEN in Asia help the cuemaker tons. Look at Mika and Capone: they couldn't tell mike capone from al capone before mika picked up his cue.

It's cuz A.) pool is a real sport over there, and B.) the Japanese/Taiwanese market is rooted in trend purchases like you've never seen.

-Roger
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That might be the case in Asia, but if any of the custom cuemakers or production companies used this thread as part of their marketing research to determine the benefits of a paid endorsement contract to a pro in order to boost sales, I don't think it bodes too well for them or any of the players in receiving one.

Although there is some influence throughout the respondents here on AZ, it looks like most don't really care. Me...I'm easy. At least to the point of piqueing my curiosity to want to try certain cues if I have the opportunity at a show or tournament. But I wouldn't order one sight unseen or unplayed just because a superstar used one. And then you have certain pro's that aren't even necessarily playing with a cue that they're endorsing or a complete model of it (shaft). I think it's a no-brainer as far as which one I would choose if it was a choice between a Szambotti or a Fury, however, I think it's owed to the paying company to play with their cue or 100% of their cue (shaft and all).

In golf, the major manufacturers employ a private company to stand on the first tee of each and every tournament and take a survey/inventory of what is in each players' bag for drivers, irons, wedges, and putters...which is then reported back to the companies. If it's found that a player is in violation with the contract (some being more lenient or rigid than others depending on the player or negotiation) it could result in a loss of payment on the contract or termination. Maybe it should be that way in pool also. Otherwise, no company will want to hand out an endorsement contract and pay up front and the players will suffer that much more from lack of income.
 
vapoolplayer said:
no i don't. if you're endorsing a product........you would think they would use it. i just know at the fury amatuer tour this month, they listed his name on team fury.

as a consumer, imo, i would think twice before buying a product that the endorsing player doesn't even use.
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He useing his old cue for now till they fix up the cue he like from fury .i asked the same thing to and that is what he told me .at the upa tour ..in 04.But he still plays witha fury cue .but it's not a bad hitting cue ..i know he break with there b/jump cue .and that hit good ...
 
I do think that there are some people who might go out and buy a Schon, for example, if Alex is their favorite player. More than that, however, I believe that it is about the exposure. If you are in the market to buy a cue, chances are you'll look at many different cues from many different cue makers. If it weren't for the fact that some pro plays with <some cue maker>'s cue, you might never have heard of that cue maker and, as a result, would never take their cues into consideration. The fact that some pro plays with that cue, whichever it might be, also gives it some credibility as a quality cue. My brother who isn't a pool player at all, but likes to go play with his friends once in a while, bought a cue-tech. He figured that they must be good cues if that "Duchess of Doom" lady on TV plays with one (that really is what he told me :D).
 
deadstroke32 said:
He useing his old cue for now till they fix up the cue he like from fury .i asked the same thing to and that is what he told me .at the upa tour ..in 04.But he still plays witha fury cue .but it's not a bad hitting cue ..i know he break with there b/jump cue .and that hit good ...
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so he's going to put aside his szamboti for the fury? wonder if he wants to sell the szamboti....... :D

honestly though, i really love the way that cue looks, i've never hit with a szamboti, think i'll try one at the expo.

so yes again players do slightly influence my cue decisions. at least influence me to try a cue. so far on my list is judd and szamboti.

i have a custom cue now, but it wasn't custom made for me, i bought it used. there are a few changes i'll be making to the specs.......so i'm planning on having one built sometime this year.

is szamboti taking orders??? i'd hate hit with one, like it, then not be able to order one.

thanks
 
To know what the pros use might help me consider a cuemaker, especially if it was a maker I've not heard of before. I would never say "I've got to have this cue cuz so-&-so's shooting with it and he's winning".

Some kind of possible defect often prevents me from going with the popular choice in things. For instance, I'll probably never own a Harley Davidson because everybody's got one and it's the motorcycle to aspire to. I had to go with an Acura instead of a plain ole Honda. That kinda stuff.

I like to look at cuemakers who've had a little experience building cues, with a growing reputation, but haven't hit the Big Leagues yet. I feel cuemakers in that position are gonna make some damn good cues because they are striving to be nationally or internationally known and trying to get in a position to make a good living. Plus, their prices have not become grossly over-inflated yet. :)

I'm not opposed to owning cues from the big guys, I plan on buying a nice Dan Dishaw, or something at that level, one day. I own a Dale Perry now, but my $375 Klein custom cue has forced the DP into a break-cue position.
 
vapoolplayer said:
so he's going to put aside his szamboti for the fury? wonder if he wants to sell the szamboti....... :D

honestly though, i really love the way that cue looks, i've never hit with a szamboti, think i'll try one at the expo.

so yes again players do slightly influence my cue decisions. at least influence me to try a cue. so far on my list is judd and szamboti.

i have a custom cue now, but it wasn't custom made for me, i bought it used. there are a few changes i'll be making to the specs.......so i'm planning on having one built sometime this year.

is szamboti taking orders??? i'd hate hit with one, like it, then not be able to order one.

thanks
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The szamboti was give to him when he first strated to play ..
from his home room ..Brian
 
I play with a Schon. To me, I consider this the perfect example of a very solid and standard cue. I compare this cue to my 20 year old Staff (blades) golf clubs. You golfers are probably familiar with these clubs. No gimicks, just pure club. I get great feedback unlike any other club today (actually the clubs pros play generally carry a model name but are much different than the ones you buy in a store or pro shop). No other club today hits as sweet as these clubs, the ball has an excellent flight and perfect spin. Pros prefer blades. I don't want forgiveness in my clubs or in my stick. Just want something that is pure that plays true.

So, to answer your question, I do not look to the pros for equipment, in golf or billiards. There are a lot of very beautiful sticks out there.

#1, no human can consistantly make perfect cues like machines can through automation
#2 no machine can make artistic cues like humans.

So take your pick - functionality or beauty. Remember the key word is consistantly.
 
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deadstroke32 said:
The szamboti was give to him when he first strated to play ..
from his home room ..Brian
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when he first started playing pool? or when he started playing out of capones?
 
vapoolplayer said:
when he first started playing pool? or when he started playing out of capones?
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I asked Rodney Morris last year at the Super Billiards Expo what kind of cue he shot with and how long he had been playing with it. He said he's played with the Szamboti since 1994.

JAM
 
drivermaker said:
That might be the case in Asia, but if any of the custom cuemakers or production companies used this thread as part of their marketing research to determine the benefits of a paid endorsement contract to a pro in order to boost sales, I don't think it bodes too well for them or any of the players in receiving one.
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True. I think this is the paradigm of Asia vs. the States:

Asian players (and western players with healthy exposure in Asia) will sell CUSTOM cues with very good results to the audience there. I think this is mostly due to the fact that there are so many more "serious" players in Taiwan/Japan with money to spend on the sport.

Players in America are better off representing production cue companies (Cuetech, Fury, Predator, etc) because such a small population are even aware of such things as custom cues, and would probably never imagine spending more than $150 on a personal cue.

-Roger
 
buddha162 said:
True. I think this is the paradigm of Asia vs. the States:

Asian players (and western players with healthy exposure in Asia) will sell CUSTOM cues with very good results to the audience there. I think this is mostly due to the fact that there are so many more "serious" players in Taiwan/Japan with money to spend on the sport.

Players in America are better off representing production cue companies (Cuetech, Fury, Predator, etc) because such a small population are even aware of such things as custom cues, and would probably never imagine spending more than $150 on a personal cue.

-Roger
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When non-pool players (people at work, for example) ask how much my cue is worth they are dumbfounded by my answer. It's funny that most people don't think much of spending a few thousand on golf clubs. While they might not all go out and spend that much on clubs, they know that clubs can get that expensive, and it doesn't surprise them. They can't imagine why someone would spend a few thousand on "a piece of wood". I have one guy at work who makes comments about the cost of my cue every now and then. Meanwhile, he has a guitar that probably costs more than my cue and he doesn't see that as being out of the ordinary -- all for a wooden box with some metal strings attached to it! ;)
 
Jimmy M. said:
When non-pool players (people at work, for example) ask how much my cue is worth they are dumbfounded by my answer. It's funny that most people don't think much of spending a few thousand on golf clubs. While they might not all go out and spend that much on clubs, they know that clubs can get that expensive, and it doesn't surprise them. They can't imagine why someone would spend a few thousand on "a piece of wood". I have one guy at work who makes comments about the cost of my cue every now and then. Meanwhile, he has a guitar that probably costs more than my cue and he doesn't see that as being out of the ordinary -- all for a wooden box with some metal strings attached to it! ;)
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I get this all the time from non-players. I've tried to explain the cuemaking process (as best I can), how difficult it is to work with wood, how cues are one of the last precision instruments made from wood (think violins, guitars, etc), and that never seems to get through.

I think it comes down to how they perceive the game. To them a cue is a wooden stick cuz the game is knocking a few balls into pockets, nothing more.

-Roger
 
Jimmy M. said:
When non-pool players (people at work, for example) ask how much my cue is worth they are dumbfounded by my answer. It's funny that most people don't think much of spending a few thousand on golf clubs. While they might not all go out and spend that much on clubs, they know that clubs can get that expensive, and it doesn't surprise them. They can't imagine why someone would spend a few thousand on "a piece of wood". I have one guy at work who makes comments about the cost of my cue every now and then. Meanwhile, he has a guitar that probably costs more than my cue and he doesn't see that as being out of the ordinary -- all for a wooden box with some metal strings attached to it! ;)
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The same person who spends $3.75 daily for a cup of coffee? :D
$500 pair of boots? $100 for one night of sushi?
Btw, the pros don't have much influence with their NON-custom cues IMO.
Meucci one time had 40% of the male pros playing with his cues.
Where is he now?
But, players like you playing with a Padgett, Owen with Schurtz or Efren with a Judd give the makers some good exposure.
 
JoeyInCali said:
Meucci one time had 40% of the male pros playing with his cues.
Where is he now?
But, players like you playing with a Padgett, Owen with Schurtz or Efren with a Judd give the makers some good exposure.
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I'd say Meucci still makes and sells more cues to regular guys and league players than anyone else out there, which is what he was after to begin with.
And I'd say that's been going on for at LEAST the last 10 years or possibly longer. He might have a smaller slice of the pie because there's much greater competition, but if it's not him, who would be the biggest seller of cues to the general public? Cuetec? Viking? Joss? Hey Meucci is getting up there in age, how many years can HE keep grinding it out. He's fat and happy with a decent net worth, not exactly like a lot of other struggling cuemakers trying to make ends meet or have a little extra.

Custom cuemakers MIGHT be getting more exposure here and there, but does that turn into $$$ales?
 
JoeyInCali said:
The same person who spends $3.75 daily for a cup of coffee? :D
$500 pair of boots? $100 for one night of sushi?
Btw, the pros don't have much influence with their NON-custom cues IMO.
Meucci one time had 40% of the male pros playing with his cues.
Where is he now?
But, players like you playing with a Padgett, Owen with Schurtz or Efren with a Judd give the makers some good exposure.
Click to expand...

I'll tell you what -- I have nothing but good things to say about the Padgett that I play with. It's the best looking cue that I've ever owned, and it plays equally well. Even now, after having owned it for over a year, I still have a sense of enjoyment each time I pull it out of the case and screw it together for the first time of the day ... and I don't even get paid to say this crap! ;)
 
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