Putting a Predator or OB-1 Shaft on custom?

[Sheldon]

I don't care what kinda 'pixie dust' is sprinkled on any given shaft...whether it be an aftermarket laminated, or a cuemaker's custom shaft...it is only going to be as accurate as the person stroking it!

While I have nothing against an aftermarket laminated shaft, I just really prefer a very stiff playing shaft, and so, seek out those makers who have a reputation for making such. A stiff shaft will tell you pretty immediately if you are having a stroking issue or not...they are not very forgiving, in that respect. I feel my game has improved greatly as a result of this philosophy.

It really comes down to a matter of preference. I prefer a nice ol' fashioned solid wood shaft made for my cue. Let's face it, after a certain point, it is no longer the cue (butt or shaft), but the person's ability, or lack thereof, to put it to it's best use.

Well said, and gets to the crux of the matter. Your opinion is one that is widely held, in my experience.

 

[BPG24]

So no one that is calling Platinum liars is going to back their statements up huh...

Go figure

 

[UGA330]

Let me start out by saying that I do not want to start a thread on whether you guys do or don't like shafts like the 314-2 or OB-1.

My question is this: Once you take as a given that a customer likes playing with a 314-2 or OB-1, would that customer be wasting his money by getting a custom just to put one of these low deflection shafts on it instead of playing with one of your shafts?

Would one of your cues with a 314-2 on it play different than a Viking or McDermott with a 314-2 on it?

I do see on some custom cuemakers sites that you can buy their customs with Predators or OB-1, yet I often hear it thrown around that there's no point in buying the custom if you're not going to take advantage of custom cuemaker's great shaft.

Thanks in advance for the info.

David

In my opinion, just stick with a standard maple shaft. The whole shaft debate is a bunch of hype. The OB-1 is foam filled from end to end and sounds dead, not lively like a maple shaft. The predator shafts just provides a lot of vibration in a cue. All of these shafts have a dead feel to me.

If you want to improve your game, get a custom maple shaft with the taper you like to play. The tip and taper are the biggest factors in shafts, the rest is all hype.

JMO

 

[Sheldon]

So no one that is calling Platinum liars is going to back their statements up huh...
Go figure

So far, you are the only one saying that. Perhaps you need to go back and re-read what was said, maybe you will figure out why no one bothers to answer your misguided question.

 

[masonh]

that test you regard so highly compares the Predators to a bunch of j/b cues and some low budget production cues,so yes i will be the first to call the test bullshit.i am not calling Platinum liars by any means but the test doesn't make any fair comparasons.when they do a test comparing Predators to good custom cues then you can use it is a reference,but even then it is still up to the player to adjust.what is the difference between adjusting 1" or 1.2"?do oyu really think that it will make you a good player?it won't.

 

[BPG24]

So far, you are the only one saying that. Perhaps you need to go back and re-read what was said, maybe you will figure out why no one bothers to answer your misguided question.

Maybe you need to reread what was said. I am not the only one calling out the people who claim that it is all a myth. Since you read so well, please find us some info that disprove the tests.

I better not hold my breathe

 

[Hidy Ho]

So no one that is calling Platinum liars is going to back their statements up huh...

Go figure

Well, my "proof" is not scientific at all ... *BUT*

When I started out playing pool, I was all about 314 shaft and Predator. Why use a high deflection maple shaft when there is lower deflecting laminated shaft around? Then I switched to OB-1 shaft because ... it was new and it seemed to provide better feedback with low deflection.

Now, I just play with hard maple shaft? Why? I dunno??? I seem to be able to make the balls and get in position better with it ... seems to give me more feedback. As I became better player (and I'm still very much mediocre at best), some level of deflection didn't seem to bother me too much. In fact, I was able to perform certain shots because of deflection.

I tried switching back to 314 and OB-1 but couldn't play one pocket with these shafts. I seemed to have harder time with cue ball positioning.

I still don't like "whippy" shafts but there are certain cue makers who can make nice stiff hitting shafts.

Interesting enough, there was another guy who I played with and he was also a Predator guy .... I turned him onto a Rick Howard cue and ever since then he's also been playing with hard maple shaft instead of laminated shaft.

 

[BPG24]

that test you regard so highly compares the Predators to a bunch of j/b cues and some low budget production cues,so yes i will be the first to call the test bullshit.i am not calling Platinum liars by any means but the test doesn't make any fair comparasons.when they do a test comparing Predators to good custom cues then you can use it is a reference,but even then it is still up to the player to adjust.what is the difference between adjusting 1" or 1.2"?do oyu really think that it will make you a good player?it won't.

So why not conduct a real test, or make a spliced shaft that is even better than the ones being mass produced. I am just dying for a great custom cue maker to take a design like predator has and use quality components to put it together. There is no question about whether or not most custom cue makers use better quality materials and have great pride in their work. Sometimes I think I like cues more than actually playing pool anymore, due to the type of people found in some pool rooms

I have owned more than 10 of the cues that your teacher made, still have one and love it. Alex is underrated in the cue world IMO, but there is definitely truth in the advantages to having a low deflection shaft and until someone comes with facts that disprove the tests than I don't understand anyone even arguing about it. there are some American made cues on that test and not just a bunch of J/B cues

I have stated before that I have had many great non laminated shafts, mostly from custom cue makers, and I do not like all of the low deflection shafts because some of them play like crap.

Someone please provide some facts about the tests being trash. Or devise a non biased test that includes great custom shafts versus all of the low deflection production models, and use custom built butts that compliment each shaft just like you would do for a customer and then this debate will be over

 

[BPG24]

Jazz........

I totally agree with you on the whippy shafts not being right for most good players with a stroke. I didn't like the OB-1 for this very reason. If OB-1 starts making shafts that are much stiffer and still provide great feel than I will be the first one their list.

Please God let one of the many talented custom cue makers make us all some shafts that give us the very best of both worlds

 

[Sheldon]

You just don't get it. The "tests" are meaningless to someone that can form their own opinion. The claims they make simply don't apply well in the real world. The REAL TEST is playing with different shafts until YOU decide what is right for you.
Bill Dominiak is making some 8 piece radial shafts that he told me are very high quality. Perhaps if you can figure out how it should be cut and put together to achieve the hit you want, you can get someone to build you your perfect shaft.

 

[BPG24]

You just don't get it. The "tests" are meaningless to someone that can form their own opinion. The claims they make simply don't apply well in the real world.
Bill Dominiak is making some 8 piece radial shafts that he told me are very high quality. Perhaps if you can figure out how it should be cut and put together to achieve the hit you want, you can get someone to build it for you.

WTF are you talking about?

I live in the same world you do. Many people including alot of Pros believe that that there are advantages, if they didn't they wouldn't use them. Why would anyone who plays pool for a living use a piece of equipment that would hurt their game? Hurting their game would cost them alot money and make it much harder to make a living. So maybe it is you that just doesn't get it

As for Bil Dominiak, I will have to check those out. thanks for the info

 

[masonh]

you are right someone should do a test.which cue on that list would you go out and buy to play with?on another note i know i love cues more than pool and have for years.i don't know why but i love cues,and now i love wood even more than cues.all i do is hunt and buy wood now.

 

[Hidy Ho]

Jazz........

I totally agree with you on the whippy shafts not being right for most good players with a stroke. I didn't like the OB-1 for this very reason. If OB-1 starts making shafts that are much stiffer and still provide great feel than I will be the first one their list.

Please God let one of the many talented custom cue makers make us all some shafts that give us the very best of both worlds

Ask Mason to make you a shaft .. you will be impressed. I know I was ...

 

[BPG24]

you are right someone should do a test.which cue on that list would you go out and buy to play with?

The tests are on the shafts, or at least that's the way I understand it.

To answer your question

Schon
Joss
McDermott
Viking
Mezz
Pechauer

I believe that these are made very well compared to most production cues, that is just my opinion and not based on facts. All of them are on the list.
I would have to change the taper of some of them in order to make them play like I wan them to, but my experience with them hasn't shown me that they are made badly.

I have only owned about 100 cues personally but have played with many many more. I know that on AZB there are people that have owned 1000's of cues and my experience may not be at the same level as them.

Most good pool players could use these cues and still play well IMO

I prefer custom cues, but these that I listed would do if I had no other choices

 

[BPG24]

Ask Mason to make you a shaft .. you will be impressed. I know I was ...

Jazz, I have no doubt that Mason makes a great cue. If he is as dedicated as he appears to be, he will be known well in the cue world one day.
He has a good teacher and the work that Mason has already displayed in the cue gallery seems to be both inventive and well made.

 

[ridewiththewind]

WTF are you talking about?

I live in the same world you do. Many people including alot of Pros believe that that there are advantages, if they didn't they wouldn't use them.

I am of the opinion...opinion being the key word here...that the reason many pros use Predator ( and the various other aftermarket 'flavor' of shafts) is because most of them do not and/or will not take the time to take care of their own equipment. With that said, they do not have the luxury of waiting for new shafts to be made for their 'money makers' by a custom cuemaker...shafts take time. Aftermarket shafts are readily available for immediate aquisition, in just about whatever thread size is needed.

I would venture a guess that many pros treat these shafts as 'disposables'...no muss, no fuss...kinda like condoms.

Lisa

 

[Ridge Runner]

Maybe the problem here is comparing deflection with accuracy?? In the hands of a skilled shooter that is comfortable with the "hit", any type shaft can be deadly or not.
John

 

[BPG24]

Maybe the problem here is comparing deflection with accuracy?? In the hands of a skilled shooter that is comfortable with the "hit", any type shaft can be deadly or not.
John

I don't think anyone will argue with you about whether or not a skilled player could use anything that they are comfortable with.

Deflection directly relates to accuracy since no one in the world (Efren included)
can create a perfect stroke every time.

The argument is about some people stating opinions claiming that something that has been proven is not correct... And not one of them has proven their opinions to be true.

Many people who don't like these shafts don't give them the amount of time it takes to adjust aiming/spin/feel
I hated the 314 the first time I tried one. Had no control over the spin, missed cut shots that I would normally make 9/10 times etc.. Like any other new technology there is an adjustment period and you have to be dedicated to giving it an honest try

 

[BPG24]

I am of the opinion...opinion being the key word here...that the reason many pros use Predator ( and the various other aftermarket 'flavor' of shafts) is because most of them do not and/or will not take the time to take care of their own equipment. With that said, they do not have the luxury of waiting for new shafts to be made for their 'money makers' by a custom cuemaker...shafts take time. Aftermarket shafts are readily available for immediate aquisition, in just about whatever thread size is needed.

I would venture a guess that many pros treat these shafts as 'disposables'...no muss, no fuss...kinda like condoms.

Lisa

I am sure that you are correct about the way some Pro's treat their equipment and dispose of them. Many pro golfers do the exact same thing.

That still doesn't mean that they don't understand the advantages of using these shafts. There are many other shafts out there that they could chose.

I am waiting for someone to tell me that pros use Predators etc. because they get paid to do so.. Not many players make much money off of endorsements in this sport. (in the US anyway).. I wish they did, given the amount of dedication it takes to make it to the top level. The pros making a living gambling and winning tournaments will use what they like best most of the time. Otherwise they are only cheating themselves

 

[masonh]

you are right on about pros playing with them.the champions can play with almost anything.i am buying you a Viking next Christmas and you have to play with it for year.