how should i respond to someone ,that assumed they could "take a whole book of photos" of myself doing a table installation? i barely know this person and certainly dont trust them, and believe i have nothing to gain from this. would you allow just anyone to film your daily routine at work, question you about all the whys and whynots? to me ,it was obvious this person wants to know how to install a table, they have more available resources than i do by far and im a lil concerned.thanks in advance.
question for all...
- Thread starter mechanic/player
- Start date
If you let him, he'll go even further.
He'll pick your brain after that.
Been there, done that.
I used to install audio/video systems, satellites and now a computer tech.
He'll pick your brain after that.
Been there, done that.
I used to install audio/video systems, satellites and now a computer tech.
I would have stopped the person and asked what they were doing, taking my pictures and so on. If you are installing in a pool room, you can't stop people from watching you, but photographing you? Give me a break. Unless they want to pay you for the privilege of photographing you while you work, I'd tell them "no way". Why? Well, let's say you have proprietary knowledge and business secrets that you don't want divulged. Although I've watched some fellows install cloth, and it didn't seem too difficult to me, I know there are people who don't do a very good job, and there are those who do, and those who are great at it. I bet you do a really nice job. Why should you just give away your knowledge and experience acquired over a long time to someone without receiving anything in return?
If for some reason you don't have the option of stopping the fellow from taking your pictures while doing it, you should at least let him know that if the pictures appear anywhere, in a book, or magazine, or online, that you'll be in touch with a lawyer to secure your legal rights.
My two cents worth.
Flex
If for some reason you don't have the option of stopping the fellow from taking your pictures while doing it, you should at least let him know that if the pictures appear anywhere, in a book, or magazine, or online, that you'll be in touch with a lawyer to secure your legal rights.
My two cents worth.
Flex
flex ,we must think alike,apparently this is going to take place during todays installation and i am not going to let this happen.i did not like the reason why he wants to do this and couldnt respond at that time because of where i was and who was around at the time. when i get home this evening i will post what happened and provide a lil more background info. i'm just looking for everyones input ,thanks for the replys.
Leaches
On many occations I have had people watching what I do and even asking questions. I don't have a problem with it and kind of expect it. I would have a BIG problem with someone taking pics or videos of me working on a table- to the point that I would pack up my tools or ask them to leave. I do tell them that "We charge extra for lessons on how to work on a pool table". Send the guy a bill for $500.00 wether it is real or not, It will get him thinking or at least piss him off.
On many occations I have had people watching what I do and even asking questions. I don't have a problem with it and kind of expect it. I would have a BIG problem with someone taking pics or videos of me working on a table- to the point that I would pack up my tools or ask them to leave. I do tell them that "We charge extra for lessons on how to work on a pool table". Send the guy a bill for $500.00 wether it is real or not, It will get him thinking or at least piss him off.
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thanks slatehumper,i also have no problems talking to or showing the customer how its done so that they can dissamble the table if ever they had to. however i do have a problem with someone in this industry,with more resources than i have by far, wanting this info i have worked so hard to learn. they said it was for the customers to see,i would have called b.s. on them but i had to bite my tounge at that time due to where i was.
Some random thoughts...
1. Some people are just nutty with photos. They take pictures (and lots of 'em) of everything. I know a couple people like this and I know there are many more. The advent of digital cameras that can store hundreds of pictures at a time has created this. Without film, it's essentially "free" to take as many pictures as you want and decide what to keep/print/etc later. I don't know if this is the case here, but if I was one of those photo nuts and was having a table installed, I'd probably want a bunch of pictures of the event.
2. If they really wanted to "steal" all your secrets or learn how to install a table, it would make A LOT MORE sense to just set up a camcorder somewhere and videotape the process. Why would you want to pick through dozens (or hundreds) of photos when you could see everything in real time?
3. I don't know the actual legalities, but it would seem to me that in their own house they should be able to take as many pictures as they want and you can't do anything about it. Of course you are free to leave, or to not even do the job at all. In reading the thread, I came to the conclusion that when you go to the job you plan to tell them that you don't want pictures taken. In doing this, I think you should be prepared to lose the job, since it's possible they will respond that they will take the pictures if they "damn well please."
Personally, I wouldn't want someone taking a ton of pictures of me either, whether or not they planned to use them for some gain. I'd just be uncomfortable. Good luck with whatever you decide.
~Chris
1. Some people are just nutty with photos. They take pictures (and lots of 'em) of everything. I know a couple people like this and I know there are many more. The advent of digital cameras that can store hundreds of pictures at a time has created this. Without film, it's essentially "free" to take as many pictures as you want and decide what to keep/print/etc later. I don't know if this is the case here, but if I was one of those photo nuts and was having a table installed, I'd probably want a bunch of pictures of the event.
2. If they really wanted to "steal" all your secrets or learn how to install a table, it would make A LOT MORE sense to just set up a camcorder somewhere and videotape the process. Why would you want to pick through dozens (or hundreds) of photos when you could see everything in real time?
3. I don't know the actual legalities, but it would seem to me that in their own house they should be able to take as many pictures as they want and you can't do anything about it. Of course you are free to leave, or to not even do the job at all. In reading the thread, I came to the conclusion that when you go to the job you plan to tell them that you don't want pictures taken. In doing this, I think you should be prepared to lose the job, since it's possible they will respond that they will take the pictures if they "damn well please."
Personally, I wouldn't want someone taking a ton of pictures of me either, whether or not they planned to use them for some gain. I'd just be uncomfortable. Good luck with whatever you decide.
~Chris
I took pictures of my table as the mechanics were putting it together. I wanted them if I was ever going to sell it, so the prospects could see how well it is made. The mechanics didn't care as I didn't capture any assembly knowledge, just table parts. And how would a simple player like me use this knowledge anyway?
If the guy's in the industry though, then you have someone with a higher potential to use the photos for monitary gain. Find out why and what he's going to do with them and then maybe you can get a share of it----or maybe you could do what he plans to do and keep it all. Look a this as a potential opportunity.
Jeff Livingston
If the guy's in the industry though, then you have someone with a higher potential to use the photos for monitary gain. Find out why and what he's going to do with them and then maybe you can get a share of it----or maybe you could do what he plans to do and keep it all. Look a this as a potential opportunity.
Jeff Livingston
Qnut said:
My initial thought was that as the subject of the photos you would have to permit the use of your image. Dude you're gonna be a model ! They should treat you as one, and pay for the rights to your image. I recall at least one previous thread that discussed pictures and their ownership, and some professional photographers responded. Perhaps they have an opion in this matter ? I don't think that someone can take pictures of a specific person, then use those pictures for commercial purposes without permission of the subject. Of course one of the most common conditions of granting permission starts with a $.
My daughter was involved with a dance troupe around here, and also took some modeling lessons. In both cases we had to sign a waiver on the use of her image by the troupe / agency. They just can't take a picture then use it for advertising etc., even if it's a bunch of 9 years olds taking a class, they need to cover the legal bases. It can't be much different between Canada and the US on this issue.
Dave
mechanic/player said:
make your own video and sell it to the guy (& others,,,),,,,,JMHO
mechanic/player said:
Well, there is something fascinating about watching a pooltable get built. I can understand this person might want to know everything that went into their table and if you're confident in your work, this shouldn't be a problem. Your "gain" is business. If you say 'no', you risk this person going to a competitor and you give him reason to question your work.
I can understand that surveilance can be a little uncomfortable and building a table and teaching someone to build a table are separate agreements. If I were you, I would simply say that if he would like to film you, it would require an additional fee and charge whatever you'd be comfortable with.
I find the best approach to dealing with an unusual client is to increase rates so that if they agree to it, at least you're making money off of it. You should never say 'no' outright. Customers HATE the 'no' word. Simply make sure that if he's going to get what he wants, he's going to have to pay for it.
I read about these type situation alot. Mainly out of curiousity. and that there never seems to be a consistent judgement.
In todays world everyone has a camera, camera-phone, video camera or
video on their phone. Whats legal and not?
I believe that in public you have no rights to not be photographed or
video taped. But I am not 100% sure on that one.
I am sure that for many years we will have this type agenda before judges
many times over.
I wish there was a www.askthejudge.com site.
I saw that Barbra Streisand sued a photographer for publishing a picture of her home. He was taking coastline pictures and one of the pics had her home in it. He mentioned that it was her house.
He won I am pretty sure.
In todays world everyone has a camera, camera-phone, video camera or
video on their phone. Whats legal and not?
I believe that in public you have no rights to not be photographed or
video taped. But I am not 100% sure on that one.
I am sure that for many years we will have this type agenda before judges
many times over.
I wish there was a www.askthejudge.com site.
I saw that Barbra Streisand sued a photographer for publishing a picture of her home. He was taking coastline pictures and one of the pics had her home in it. He mentioned that it was her house.
He won I am pretty sure.
when i got to the customers house,the camera was sitting on the table.i went about my buisness and built the frame,when we were discussing table location he broke it out and took a picture of the frame and stated that he was there to film the entire assembly. at that time i asked why and he said he was told to,i politely told him he could take as many pics of the table parts as he wanted and i would explain anything he did not understand and even let him do a rail if he liked,but i clearly said no pics of me at work. i told him i did not agree to this and that i didnt know what this persons intentions were with these pics. he understood totaly and didnt bother me anymore.
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nfty9er said:
hmm,every man has his price.i guess it would depend on who my helper was!
I can understand your concern. But look on the bright side, just because someone watches video of you working on a table doesn't mean they can do it. There are a lot of nuances they will never pick up on if they don't know what to look for. I've seen Tiger Woods play golf, and I don't play like he does. If you do high quality work, word will get out that you're the person to go to.mechanic/player said: