Question on cue position for using english

[Makey98]

I am having trouble determining something about using english properly and aiming.

Lets just assume I am lined up dead straight with a ball and I am using right english. (No reason I can think to do this, but just for explanation.) Do I line up my cue with the cue ball and the object ball and the center of the pocket and then pivot the cue to the right? As in move the butt of my cue to the left and the tip to the right slightly. Or do I shift the entire cue over to the right? Does that make sense?

Basically, do I get lined up for the shot and then move the tip over or do I approach the cue ball lined up with the object ball with the cue over the the right? I have mixed success both ways and I am not sure why? I can't tell if when I pivot if the english is throwing the cue ball in the pocket or if my aim point is my actual contact point.

thanks.

 

[Z3R0]

Really depends what you're trying to accomplish. Most people align the cue dead center of the cue ball and then adjust the tip towards the english they are wishing to use.

Sometimes, in order to acheive the result you want, it may be better to actually align to
either side of the cue ball. The drawback I see to this is the potential for miscue and undesirable results.

I'm not an expert on using english, I mainly just use the basics at this point to secure good positioning. From my experience it's best to align dead center then adjust just your cue towards the english you're wanting to use.

A good example of this is using english to accomplish a simple bank shot. If you set a cue in the middle of the table, align dead center then adjust the tip to the right slightly, you'll notice the cue ball will pull to the right after the bank.

This isn't necessarly always what will happen if you set up just on the right side of the cue. So, in short my personal suggestion is to always align your tip in the neutral middle of the cue ball, then adjust the tip(by shifting the butt of the cue) to aim at the english you want to use.

 

[DogsPlayingPool]

I am having trouble determining something about using english properly and aiming.

Lets just assume I am lined up dead straight with a ball and I am using right english. (No reason I can think to do this, but just for explanation.) Do I line up my cue with the cue ball and the object ball and the center of the pocket and then pivot the cue to the right? As in move the butt of my cue to the left and the tip to the right slightly. Or do I shift the entire cue over to the right? Does that make sense?

Basically, do I get lined up for the shot and then move the tip over or do I approach the cue ball lined up with the object ball with the cue over the the right? I have mixed success both ways and I am not sure why? I can't tell if when I pivot if the english is throwing the cue ball in the pocket or if my aim point is my actual contact point.



thanks.

Mackey, of the two methods you mentioned the first is commonly referred to as Back Hand English (BHE) and the second one Parallel English. Both methods are used.

Two things to consider when using english are "throw" and "deflection".

Your post indicated you are familiar with the effects of throw but deflection should also be taken into account. When applying english the cue ball will tend to deflect (or squirt) a bit in the opposite direction of the english applied (right english will cause the CB to deflect left etc.). BHE, or a combination of BHE and FHE (forward hand english) tends to offset deflection to some extent.

For a discussion of this check Joe Tucker's video:

http://billiards.colostate.edu/normal_videos/new/NVB-24.htm

or from Dr. Dave:

http://billiards.colostate.edu/normal_videos/new/NVB-71.htm

This, and a lot of other really good info is available on Dr. Dave's site:

http://billiards.colostate.edu/

Hope this helps.

 

[Tramp Steamer]

You may be worrying more than you need. When looking at the cueball think: "Cue right, go right. Cue left, go left." For instance, if you were looking at a normal staight in shot and you were right of the cueball centerline when you struck it, the cueball would strike the object ball left of it's centerline which would cause the object ball to go to the right.
Practice a medium length, straight to the back of the pocket shot, cueing a tip's width from the cueball centerline and observe how the object ball reacts when struck. Then make small adjustments as to where you strike the object ball until the ball goes into the pocket. It'll come to you.
And, above all, resist the urge to learn an aiming system. They will only confuse, and delay your progress, and in many cases cost you money that you could have otherwise spent on equipment. If they were worth their salt the very best players would be using them, and if you don't believe me ask your local shortstop.

 

[alstl]

I'm not trying to sound like a smart ass but if you hit enough balls you will figure out where to aim and how to adjust for english. It doesn't hurt to ask for advice but some things are best learned by doing.

 

[Ratta]

alstl,

i think he asked about the technique itself. It s a great difference if you re stepping directly into the shot already aligned to use english-or if you stepping into the shot aligned to the center of the cb and then trying *something* out like back-hand-english. Or even stepping aligned to center and then make a parallel shift to use english.

Sure you will learn this also, if you ve played 250.000 balls-- but his question was ok in my opinion.

lg
Ingo

 

[Bob Jewett]

I am having trouble determining something about using english properly and aiming.

Lets just assume I am lined up dead straight with a ball and I am using right english. (No reason I can think to do this, but just for explanation.) Do I line up my cue with the cue ball and the object ball and the center of the pocket and then pivot the cue to the right? As in move the butt of my cue to the left and the tip to the right slightly. Or do I shift the entire cue over to the right? Does that make sense?

Basically, do I get lined up for the shot and then move the tip over or do I approach the cue ball lined up with the object ball with the cue over the the right? I have mixed success both ways and I am not sure why? I can't tell if when I pivot if the english is throwing the cue ball in the pocket or if my aim point is my actual contact point.

thanks.

You have already learned that you have to adjust for squirt. The required adjustment depends on the amount of side spin, whether you are also hitting the ball high or low, how much elevation you use (all shots are elevated to some degree), the condition of the cloth and balls, the speed of the shot, the length of the shot, etc. One of the most important factors is the shaft of your cue stick, and how much squirt it causes.

As mentioned above, lining up as if for no side spin and then pivoting about your bridge hand (backhand english) will compensate for squirt in the correct direction but whether it is the right amount of compensation depends on all of the above and how long your bridge is.

I'd suggest that you either work out on your own how each of the things mentioned above influences what happens on side spin shots or find an instructor who can demonstrate how they come in. Eventually you have to work all of that into the unconscious part of your game -- you can't be thinking about all of that and expect to make a ball.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

do I get lined up for the shot and then move the tip over or do I approach the cue ball lined up with the object ball with the cue over the the right?

First understand what you're trying to accomplish. You're finding the right amount of angle to aim "offline" in order to compensate for squirt. So you want to end up with your stick at a slight angle (in the direction of tip offset) to the intended CB path, not parallel with it.

Different sticks need different amounts of compensation and so do different shots. Backhand english (aiming centerball and pivoting at your bridge for english) works best when your bridge length (the actual pivot point) is matched to your shaft's "squirt pivot point" - so low-squirt cues don't work well. Because of swerve even perfectly matched pivot points won't produce the actual aim compensation needed for every shot, so you'll have to learn it mostly by practicing and paying attention to where you hit the CB and what happens. But getting a closer start with BHE may be helpful.

I usually just put my bridge and stick on the table already at the slight angle I think is needed, but if I'm practicing or being extra careful I aim the shot with my bridge and stick on the centerball aimline and then estimate and make the squirt adjustment from there (by picking up my bridge and repositioning it and the stick all at once).

pj
chgo