Question on Moving a ball during stroke and cue ball crossing path
- Thread starter LSU1018
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Two answers same question
My opinion in one pocket you would have the option to restore to position prior to movement or leave it where it lies. This is the case because incoming player does not have ball in hand. I think this would hold true in games without ball in hand.
Next in a 9-ball 10-ball or any game played with ball in hand. I
ncoming player would have cue ball in hand and option to restore would not be given to same player so balls stay as they are.
only my opinion
ULTIMATE-BILL
My opinion in one pocket you would have the option to restore to position prior to movement or leave it where it lies. This is the case because incoming player does not have ball in hand. I think this would hold true in games without ball in hand.
Next in a 9-ball 10-ball or any game played with ball in hand. I
ncoming player would have cue ball in hand and option to restore would not be given to same player so balls stay as they are.only my opinion
ULTIMATE-BILL
I don't know what the official rules say in this unique situation.
My guess is... adding a foul to the mix doesn't change the whole "option" thing, unless the rulebook specifically says "but if they foul, the option is no longer available."
I think the option should always be there, because you never want a carelessly moved ball to work to the shooter's advantage. The option guarantees he will always be worse off if he brushes a ball, and therefore he shouldn't try to get cute and 'accidentally' nudge it.
My guess is... adding a foul to the mix doesn't change the whole "option" thing, unless the rulebook specifically says "but if they foul, the option is no longer available."
I think the option should always be there, because you never want a carelessly moved ball to work to the shooter's advantage. The option guarantees he will always be worse off if he brushes a ball, and therefore he shouldn't try to get cute and 'accidentally' nudge it.
I just wanted to mention, the Joss Tour uses a different rule which I think may become more popular. Once you've struck the cue-ball, touching any ball with your hand or cue is a foul. Prior to the shot, any moved balls can be restored to their original position without penalty. In my opinion, it's the best way to handle moved balls in a non-referee situation.
Cue Ball Fouls Only
The World Standardized Rules, 2011, page 27, indicates that first you determine if there is a foul. If it is a foul then the rules for that game apply.
If it is not a foul then the opposing player has the option of replacing the ball(s) to their original position or leaving them as they are.
These rule books are available right here on AZ Billiards. It's good to have a book and support this site.
The World Standardized Rules, 2011, page 27, indicates that first you determine if there is a foul. If it is a foul then the rules for that game apply.
If it is not a foul then the opposing player has the option of replacing the ball(s) to their original position or leaving them as they are.
These rule books are available right here on AZ Billiards. It's good to have a book and support this site.
It's really simple. If you've moved a ball and have not shot yet, it's not a foul and your opponent can move the ball back. If you've moved a ball (before, during or after) and you've already shot, it's a foul. Your example would be a foul since the opponent did not have an opportunity to restore position before the cueball was hit.
Exellent question.If it was deliberate foul the ball(s) can be restored.
If you foul in 1 pocket you pay a 1 ball penalty.If you intentionaly foul in 1 pocket you pay a one ball penalty.If you deliberately foul it can be considered the same as raking the balls (forfiet),so if the balls cannot be restored to the satisfaction of both players it is a forfiet or re-rack.
This situation may have just been a simple foul in wich case you spot a ball and leave the balls where they lay.Intent is important here since you don't want some1 rearanging the balls in thier favor under the guise of a simple foul.
If you foul in 1 pocket you pay a 1 ball penalty.If you intentionaly foul in 1 pocket you pay a one ball penalty.If you deliberately foul it can be considered the same as raking the balls (forfiet),so if the balls cannot be restored to the satisfaction of both players it is a forfiet or re-rack.
This situation may have just been a simple foul in wich case you spot a ball and leave the balls where they lay.Intent is important here since you don't want some1 rearanging the balls in thier favor under the guise of a simple foul.
In the BCAPL there is no restoration option if a foul is committed under the "disturbed ball" rules (rule 1.33). The WPA rules are not real clear on this but the way I read them it suggests the same thing as the BCAPL rules - no option to restore on a foul.
Intuitively it makes sense that restoring position would not be allowed. Reason being that when playing cue ball fouls only, the primary basis a foul is granted under the disturbed ball provisions is precisely because restoring position is not accurately possible so therefore the player must incur a foul. So logically how can you call the foul AND restore the balls when the whole basis for the foul is that you can't determine the correct way to restore the position accurately?
Here's the BCAPL rule:
Rule 1.33.4:
Intuitively it makes sense that restoring position would not be allowed. Reason being that when playing cue ball fouls only, the primary basis a foul is granted under the disturbed ball provisions is precisely because restoring position is not accurately possible so therefore the player must incur a foul. So logically how can you call the foul AND restore the balls when the whole basis for the foul is that you can't determine the correct way to restore the position accurately?
Here's the BCAPL rule:
Rule 1.33.4:
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