Questions on Breaking

Zphix

Zphix

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Glad I remembered this before it slipped my mind -

Breaking is probably the weakest part of my game because I either make no balls on the break with a good spread, or will make 3 balls on the break.. almost no in-betweens.

Before, when I broke, I was hitting hard and the CB would fly off the table so I powered down - now have found a happy medium.

Anyway, I've heard a lot of talk about where it's best to break from and what a specific break is designed to do - like certain 9 ball breaks (off the second diamond with english) are designed to make the head ball in the side pocket.

I'm more concerned with 8-ball breaks. So guys - any advice on where to break from?
 
I am not expert. I think breaking as explain in the Zero-X DVD. Sounds good in theory. You want to figure out what speed to apply while hitting the head ball full. So that the cue ball is sliding at impact. That way it transfers it's power to the head ball. Leaving the cue ball with no power. At least that's what I got from it. May be what SVB does and he has a great break. Not many people practice the break. In the video he just set up the head ball and breaks. Focusing more on hitting the head ball full and letting the cue stop dead. Believe using center english. Adjusting speed and aim until the cue stops dead. This way your transferring power and controlling the cue ball.
 
jburkm002 said:
I am not expert. I think breaking as explain in the Zero-X DVD. Sounds good in theory. You want to figure out what speed to apply while hitting the head ball full. So that the cue ball is sliding at impact. That way it transfers it's power to the head ball. Leaving the cue ball with no power. At least that's what I got from it. May be what SVB does and he has a great break. Not many people practice the break. In the video he just set up the head ball and breaks. Focusing more on hitting the head ball full and letting the cue stop dead. Believe using center english. Adjusting speed and aim until the cue stops dead. This way your transferring power and controlling the cue ball.
Click to expand...

Most power breakers and great breakers like SVB, Bustamante, and Archer also hit just above center ball because the forward roll will stop the CB dead in the center of the table.
 
Guess that's the question? Is it speed or technique? Sure players hit it much harder than SVB. Now they have break speed apps. What's has more power? A break at 30mph with less power transferred from the cue ball or a break at 25mph where more power is transferred from the cue ball? It's all mind blowing to me. I have no idea. You hear one theory that seems to make sense. Then you here a different theory and that makes sense. Should have paid more attention in school.
 
Personally it is rare that I break dry in 8-ball. I break from the second diamond and I am trying to make the head ball in the side pocket. When I make a ball I would say that about 60% of the time it is the head ball that I make (either in the side or it gets kicked up to the corner shortly before it would have went in the side pocket). The rest of the time that I make a ball it is likely going to be made in the corner in the kitchen opposite the side that I am breaking from.

I started trying this break after watching Corey Deuel many times. He doesn't hit them unnecessarily hard and he makes the head ball in the side and he gets a good spread. It took alot of practice of just rack and break but these days I do not have to put alot of effort into making it. The key for me is to use a little bottom english and hit the head ball just ever so slightly right of center and only hitting the cue ball at about 17-18 MPH (varies based on table conditions). Give it a try sometime.
 
If you are thinking you will break at 25 mph, you might want to think again! 25 is damn fast!. Best I could do was 21 with control. I break from center table and go for good spread....as well as making a ball. Also I'm wanting to squat cue ball center table. If I'm getting good spread and leaving CB center table, but not making balls, that's when I make adjustments....usually speed adjustments. I go for a full ball hit to transfer as much energy to rack as possible.
 
Technique and timing, is more important than hitting them hard imo.

I don't play much 8 9 or 10 ball, but it seems to me that breaking in 8 ball for most players isn't even an advantage. How often, if you make a ball, do you run out, and how often do you make a few and miss, making it easier for your opponent to run out with less traffic in their way? Maybe its a good move to pass the break anyway?

Usually, 8 ball wasn't the game of choice for the better player years ago. ( I don't know about today, I'm ready for bed when pool halls open these days, :) ) anyway, A very common hustle years ago when a better player was playing a weaker one in 8 ball was to offer the break to them. In addition, the hustle went on, ...."and if you don't make anything, i'll take 1 or 2 off the table and let you continue.

The hustle being, the player still can't get out, and now the better player has removed their obstacles and runs out easier.

So my thought is, if you can't get all the way out, maybe not breaking is best regardless.
 
Watch breaks

Zphix said:
Most power breakers and great breakers like SVB, Bustamante, and Archer also hit just above center ball because the forward roll will stop the CB dead in the center of the table.
Click to expand...

If you watch good breakers you will find the cue ball is not even on the table when it impacts the object ball. There is a slow motion video posted recently on AZBilliards of SVB that shows it. They hit down on the cue ball jumping into the object ball which causes the cue ball to pop up.

If you look at the table where Shane practiced his break you will find a circle of white burn marks where the cue lands just past the side pocket. A good player from here who knows Shane well was doing the same thing. The difference he said Shane's level of accuracy was much better as Shanes circle of burn marks was smaller.
 
Zphix said:
Glad I remembered this before it slipped my mind -

Breaking is probably the weakest part of my game because I either make no balls on the break with a good spread, or will make 3 balls on the break.. almost no in-betweens.

Before, when I broke, I was hitting hard and the CB would fly off the table so I powered down - now have found a happy medium.

Anyway, I've heard a lot of talk about where it's best to break from and what a specific break is designed to do - like certain 9 ball breaks (off the second diamond with english) are designed to make the head ball in the side pocket.

I'm more concerned with 8-ball breaks. So guys - any advice on where to break from?
Click to expand...

There is almost no one way, or even 10 different ways to break. The one thing that is 100% true for everything in pool, practice. You should be able to hit very hard and not have the cueball jump off the table. If it's doing that, you have an issue with your stroke or the rack is loose. When the front ball is not tight, it can cause the cueball to jump too much.

Make sure the rack is tight, the break spot and speed depends on the table and if the rack is, in fact, tight. If the 8 ball rack front ball does not freeze due to table issue, break the 2nd ball break. How to break for success varies from table to table and from rack to rack. You need to learn as much of the variables as you can.

Get Joe Tuckers breaking DVD, it's probably the best one done on the subject, although most of it deals with 9 ball.
 
I have been spending a lot of time practicing my break lately.

For 8-ball on a barbox, I've been doing the second-ball break. I put the cueball a couple ball-widths off the long rail and cue below center. I usually make a ball on the break and have a shot on something. (I play in a NAPA league so it's open after the break.) With the second-ball break you don't want to (and don't need to) hit the rack very hard. The important part is hitting the second ball solidly and not launching the cue ball off the table.

For 9/10 ball my only concern is hitting the head ball solidly and controlling the cue ball. If I break dry but stop the cue ball dead in the center of the table, it's a successful break. Alternately, if I pocket 3 balls but watch the cue ball rocket around the table, it's a bad break.
 
I will echo that there is no one way and I believe very table dependent. Even the same tables seem to vary from day to day. I have taken a bunch off my break and look for the right angle to squat the cb, make a wing ball, and get the 1 ball setup so I have a shot into the corner pocket. Also should have added looking for the best speed to make the wing ball.

Here is a clinic by Corey Deuel in breaking. Very imaginative and effective on the bar box.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZa59OiRJd8

People like Earl Strickland and others are in a constant search for how to break. For the pros, it is life or death.

Al
 
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The first place to start is gaining some knowledge. Knowing what you want to accomplish & understanding how to do what you want to do will give you a good start. Then it's practice, practice, practice.

High level players address the Break Shot just like any other shot. They try to hit the object ball correctly, with correct speed, in order to have position for the next shot. They actually do this, while whacking away at the rack.

Good Luck
 
Its baffling to me that no ones said this yet.

You want consistent results breaking? Start with a consistent rack. If you were to set up a robot that hit the same speed and accuracy but gave it varying racks with different gaps then it would never be consistent.

It's about the equivalent of setting up a straight in shot and having to hit a deformed OB.

If you can't get good racks then, of course ur gonna need to know how to smash em. But it's all luck from there.

Or you could become Corey and learn how to read the racks. But that's like looking at a 9 ball or more combination shot.

Pools greatest fallacy is bad racks and mismatched ball sets.
 
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