Rails get faster when it rains?

Opie

Opie

Stronger than shortstop?
Silver Member
I know this sounds weird, but the rails on our 7ft. Diamonds actually SPEED UP when it rains. I always thought that when the humidity rose, the table would play slower. The cloth is still playing the same, it's just whenever the ball comes off the rail it's springy as hell. It's like a guessing game trying to play shape when it's raining outside. And it's not just me, everyone in the place was baffled by it, even our best players. Has anyone ever heard of this or know what could be causing it? Thanks.
 
Yup, high humidity makes the rails more "bouncy". It's normal effect is to change bank angles. Normally, the cloth slows down a bit though..

This is why players HATE playing in high humidity. It makes playing conditions extremely unpredictable.

Tell the owner to quit being cheap and turn the air conditioner back on.. :D :D :D

Russ
 
This is just one of the reasons why the ability to adjust is one of the most important skills when you play at the higher levels of the game. Even an increase in the size of the crowd can dramatically affect the air's humidity and thus, how the table plays. A few years ago I was playing a guy from Costa Rica (juegabillar or Billyards may remember his name) in a place where half of the room has the pool tables and the other half is used for live entertainment on weekend nights (and it seems like every pretty female under the age of 30 in Puerto Rico shows up--it's enough to make me consider moving). I was giving the guy the eight ball and was drilling him, until the crowd in the dance portion started getting really thick. After a while, I just couldn't get out and control the rock like before, and thankfully, I had the good sense to pull up until the next day before I good and truly stuck. The culprit? The humidity from the crowd's breathing totally changed the way the table played.

For the record, the next day, with the tables playing well, I barbecued him!
 
Opie said:
I know this sounds weird, but the rails on our 7ft. Diamonds actually SPEED UP when it rains. I always thought that when the humidity rose, the table would play slower. The cloth is still playing the same, it's just whenever the ball comes off the rail it's springy as hell. It's like a guessing game trying to play shape when it's raining outside. And it's not just me, everyone in the place was baffled by it, even our best players. Has anyone ever heard of this or know what could be causing it? Thanks.
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Haha thats crazy, some trick shot artist comes in and he calles everyone over to watch his amazingness. So as he sets up the first shot as it starts to rain, but no one notices. 1st shot, (BOING!!!)*%&$# what the heck?!?!? 2nd and 3rd shot people start to leave, so a reputation is ruined all by the wonderful lifegiving rain. lol. :D

Sorry for the rambling, its late and I don't want to go to bed.
 
Opie said:
I know this sounds weird, but the rails on our 7ft. Diamonds actually SPEED UP when it rains. I always thought that when the humidity rose, the table would play slower. The cloth is still playing the same, it's just whenever the ball comes off the rail it's springy as hell. It's like a guessing game trying to play shape when it's raining outside. And it's not just me, everyone in the place was baffled by it, even our best players. Has anyone ever heard of this or know what could be causing it? Thanks.
Click to expand...
I have a 9 foot new diamond in my garage. My garage is drywalled, heated, air conditioned, and carpeted, and just a small gap on one garage door where a little air might come in. Well i am glad you brought this up because i thought i was crazy. When it rains and i am playing the ball will JUMP off the rail and yes it makes it extremely diffulcult to play. I have a humidity gauge out there and this happens even the humidity is in the lower 50's. Its weird
 
Damp conditions

Opie said:
I know this sounds weird, but the rails on our 7ft. Diamonds actually SPEED UP when it rains. I always thought that when the humidity rose, the table would play slower. The cloth is still playing the same, it's just whenever the ball comes off the rail it's springy as hell. It's like a guessing game trying to play shape when it's raining outside. And it's not just me, everyone in the place was baffled by it, even our best players. Has anyone ever heard of this or know what could be causing it? Thanks.
Click to expand...

Not only do the rails speed up, but you will miss a shot now and then that you would normally make in dry conditions.
 
SCCues said:
Not only do the rails speed up, but you will miss a shot now and then that you would normally make in dry conditions.
Click to expand...

Yes, and I find this to be especially true if the balls are not at their cleanest. If the humidity is high, I usually wipe down the balls first with a clean, dry cloth. It makes the situation a little more tolerable, but obviously doesn't help with bouncy rails.

Aaron
 
So does anybody know why? I know the moisture in the cloth slows it down in humid conditions, and I know the balls seem to play a little stickier in the high humidity, but does anybody have a good explanation for the effect on the rails? Does the rubber absorbing water actually make it springier? Does it have to do with the cloth on the rails? I can't figure out why humidity would effect this.

-Andrew
 
Personally, I think it is the cloth.

When I built my own table, I was really worried about nailing the correct cushion height. After I glued the cushions on the rails (and before putting the cloth on), I put the rails on the table. The height was OK, but when I rolled balls into the cushions, they jumped like crazy.

Great, I thought, I have succeeded in building an unplayable table. However, after I put the cloth on, they played just fine.

I would be skeptical that changes in humidity drastically affect the rebound of the rubber (although temperature might), but I think rail performance is very sensitive to the cloth condition.
 
Then it's clear! The cloth reduces the friction between the ball and the cushion in general. The wetter the table becomes, the less the friction is reduced, and the more the ball behaves as if it were striking the naked rubber. Makes sense?
 
VIProfessor said:
Then it's clear! The cloth reduces the friction between the ball and the cushion in general. The wetter the table becomes, the less the friction is reduced, and the more the ball behaves as if it were striking the naked rubber. Makes sense?
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I think we are on the right track.

Here's my hypothesis..as the OB contacts the rail, it compresses the rail and the rail pushes down on the OB, to some extent, into the felt (remember, the point of the rail is above the equator of the OB to keep the OB from hopping on rebound). This action normally results in some friction between the OB and the felt (both on the rail and on the bed) which scrubs off some speed from the OB. The moisture reduces that friction so the OB retains more speed than on a drier table.

I'm not sure how the moisture would effect the interaction of the felt on the rail rubber. Would the moisture allow the felt to move on top of the rubber more or less. For example, when your fingers are slightly wet, they don't slide as well as when dry.
 
mosconiac said:
The moisture reduces that friction so the OB retains more speed than on a drier table.
Click to expand...

Not sure on this, but it seems like higher humidity actually increases the friction between the felt and the ball.

Aaron
 
VIProfessor said:
Then it's clear! The cloth reduces the friction between the ball and the cushion in general. The wetter the table becomes, the less the friction is reduced, and the more the ball behaves as if it were striking the naked rubber. Makes sense?
Click to expand...

Yes, I think this is probably correct. Sounds good to me anyway.

Aaron
 
After some thought, I have another idea. The cloth on the rails is usually stretched pretty tight over the rails, right? Woven cloth will expand (relax) when wet, and tighten back up as it dries, right?

So here's my theory: the dry cloth compresses the rail slightly, meaning that part of its unhindered compress/rebound travel distance is unavailable. This would mean less rebound than if it had that full distance to compress, and re-accelerate the ball away from the rail. When slightly more moist, the cloth relaxes, making a small amount of this travel available that wasn't available when dry, leading to more rebound.

Seems as plausible to me as anything else.

-Andrew
 
Andrew Manning said:
Woven cloth will expand (relax) when wet, and tighten back up as it dries, right?
Click to expand...

I don't know about that, but what I do know is that if you throw your wife's wool sweater in the washing machine along with four pairs of blue jeans and an old pair of sneakers, the wool sweater will come out about six sizes smaller than it went in, smelling like sneakers, and you'll be doing some hard time in solitary :D

Aaron
 
Aaron_S said:
I don't know about that, but what I do know is that if you throw your wife's wool sweater in the washing machine along with four pairs of blue jeans and an old pair of sneakers, the wool sweater will come out about six sizes smaller than it went in, smelling like sneakers, and you'll be doing some hard time in solitary :D

Aaron
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A hard lesson to learn that is...

I think that the increase in friction is the right direction to go with this one...
 
Seems fairly simple to test...Take a damp rag and wipe down the cushion and see if the table plays different.

Let me add another crazy (hypothosis).....When the cloth gets damp it adds weight...could that extra weight cause the cushion to sag (ever so slightly)?????

A slightly lower cushion tip would cause an increased rebound speed...and potentially a hop on the rebound.....(I know.....crazy) :)
 
Aaron_S said:
Yes, and I find this to be especially true if the balls are not at their cleanest. If the humidity is high, I usually wipe down the balls first with a clean, dry cloth. It makes the situation a little more tolerable, but obviously doesn't help with bouncy rails.

Aaron
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This could be part of the problem as well, as our owner regularly has dirty balls.:o
 
In early 90`s there was a column written in Billiardsdigest by Mr.Danny D Liberto under the title `slippery when wet`.you guys can search archives for the right answer.
 
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