reyes vs bustamante - exhibition match

larrynj1

larrynj1

aka uncle larry
Silver Member
i had the pleasure of seeing these two play a race to 15 last night in PJ's Billiards in Linden, NJ. absolutely amazing play by both of them. karen corr, julie kelly, and helena thornfeldt were also in attendance. nice party type of atmosphere, this must be like the old time room exhibitions that were common-place years ago. this is what is healthy for the game of pool.
 
I was there also and think the owners of PJs need to be commended for what they are doing. This is the second match they have set up and the room is getting better and better all the time.
 
ssach, my sentiments exactly. many room owners are too short sighted to see the benefits a show like this brings to the room and the business in general.
 
Hi Folks,

Our former room manager tried the same thing. Santo vs. Busti for $3000. They played a race to three one hole and eleven in 9 ball. He couldn't get twenty people to put up $30 each to watch. How sad! The excuse I heard most was "I play there every day, why should I have pay. It should be free" I see those guys play just about every month. I still wanted to see them up close and personal. Am I missing something? Perhaps I'm in the wrong on this.
 
That is sad... $30 to see Busta play Santos.... The charge last night was $20. The pros were taking pictures and signing autographs. I got my $20 worth to say the least. Alot of people showed up, but I don't think the room came close to covering the $9000 event. But, I think they are trying their hardest to promote the game and make their room one of the best. If you want a great place to shoot stop bye...Prices are fair and the owners are great..can not say enough good things they have really turned the place around.

Pool will go no where if you (the customer, the fan, the player) can't even support your local pool room when they try to do something positive for the game.
 
cardiac kid said:
Hi Folks,
Our former room manager tried the same thing. Santo vs. Busti for $3000. They played a race to three one hole and eleven in 9 ball. He couldn't get twenty people to put up $30 each to watch. How sad! The excuse I heard most was "I play there every day, why should I have pay. It should be free" I see those guys play just about every month. I still wanted to see them up close and personal. Am I missing something? Perhaps I'm in the wrong on this.
Click to expand...

CK, I think you are wrong. In establishing the market value of such an exhibition, you need to consider each of the following points:

1) Professional male players regularly and routinely give the pro pool product away for free when they gamble in public. In doing so, they cheapen their own product. Many I know take the view "why pay to see them when I can watch them gamble and pay no admission at QMasters in Virginia, the Cue Club in Nevada, or in the side action at Derby City. No pro wants to admit it, but the fact is that all the side action devalues the pro pool product, by making opportunities to watch the best for little or no money abundant.

2) Even top-flight pro competition is very inexpensive to attend. One can see all seven days of the BCA Open, which has an elite international field, both Men's and Women's division, for about $90 (the approximate cost of an all-event General Admission pass). That's about 250 pro matches for $90, or about 28 cents per match.

When an exhibition comes my way, I'll pay a large price to attend, but to support the sport, not because I think it's worth it. I have no problem with anybody who feels that it isn't worth $30 to watch two top players like Santos Sambajon and Francisco Bustamante play each other.

I greatly admire room owners that stage and fund exhibitions, but I also completely respect the position of room owners that suggest that they don't get their money's worth, even factoring in any short-term boost in business their pool room enjoys.
 
Last edited:
sjm,

Perhaps you misunderstand my comments. I'm sad that people here in Rochester would not step up. I bought two tickets because a friend of mine wanted to attend and was broke.

Fourteen years ago, Tony Vaccaro, founder of Classic Billiards and several friends went deep into their pockets. They produced a sixteen player 14.1 Invitational event with the best the game had to offer at that time. Rempe was the first winner with a miracle comeback from 195 - 5 to win 200 -195 over Mike Sigel. The next year, the same event again brought players from across the country. Sigel won over Varner. My point is, the same guys that wouldn't support the Santo/Busti event wouldn't support the 14.1 events for the same reason. The events were failures only from the lack of local spectator support. Greater New York / New Jersey has twenty times the potential. They know a great event when they see it. We don't! We won't.
 
cardiac kid said:
sjm,

Perhaps you misunderstand my comments. I'm sad that people here in Rochester would not step up. I bought two tickets because a friend of mine wanted to attend and was broke.

Fourteen years ago, Tony Vaccaro, founder of Classic Billiards and several friends went deep into their pockets. They produced a sixteen player 14.1 Invitational event with the best the game had to offer at that time. Rempe was the first winner with a miracle comeback from 195 - 5 to win 200 -195 over Mike Sigel. The next year, the same event again brought players from across the country. Sigel won over Varner. My point is, the same guys that wouldn't support the Santo/Busti event wouldn't support the 14.1 events for the same reason. The events were failures only from the lack of local spectator support. Greater New York / New Jersey has twenty times the potential. They know a great event when they see it. We don't! We won't.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the clarification, CK, and your point is well made and well understood.
 
It's true. The side action at Derby City was so popular that the matchups often had a hundred people watching while the tournament match crowds were sparse. At the Super Billiards Expo the buzz was all about the challenge tables and who was up and who was down. The main challenge table had a couple hundred people around it from open til close every day.

There is currently no one who is promoting these events and creating a market for them. At one time there was a promoter named Syl Livingston who worked all year booking events for his roster of players. Brunswick once had a stable full of players that were on tour constantly when they weren't competing. Willie Mosconi said in his autobiography that getting the exhibition job with Brunswick saved him financially.

I sincerely believe that with the right setup the pros could in fact make a decent living on the exhibition tour. I believe that there is a market for it and there are plenty of people who will pay to see a good billiards show. As it is though with the sporadic nature of such exhibitions and general lack of promotion it is no surprise that the response is often lackluster.

John
 
The other issue to consider is that very few people are aware of an event like this even taking place, I play regularly at Crown Billiards in Pompton Lakes and Rockaway Billiards in Rockaway and nobody in either room was aware of this taking place. I would have certainly taken the drive and paid to see these two play.
The rooms that are interested in holding exhibitions should contact the other room owners and get the word out to the the people that would be interested to attend, you can't expect just your local patrons to all be available to attend, the fans and the players that you want to support you are the people that you can reach thru the other rooms.
Just some thoughts to consider.

Jim
 
Railbird said:
The other issue to consider is that very few people are aware of an event like this even taking place, I play regularly at Crown Billiards in Pompton Lakes and Rockaway Billiards in Rockaway and nobody in either room was aware of this taking place. I would have certainly taken the drive and paid to see these two play.
The rooms that are interested in holding exhibitions should contact the other room owners and get the word out to the the people that would be interested to attend, you can't expect just your local patrons to all be available to attend, the fans and the players that you want to support you are the people that you can reach thru the other rooms.
Just some thoughts to consider.

Jim
Click to expand...

Jim. this is also true of rooms that i frequent. it seems no one was aware that this was goin on as little as 20 miles away. most of the people i spoke to would have loved to attend. the trouble is that room owners are reluctant to promote ANYTHING outside their own room for fear of losing any business. the newpapers don't consider pool a sport and is thus not newsworthy.
word of mouth still generated more than 100 fans at this thing.
 
cardiac kid said:
I'm sad that people here in Rochester would not step up. I bought two tickets because a friend of mine wanted to attend and was broke.
Click to expand...


You just said the magic word...unfortunately there are too many "brokes" or cheapskates that are involved in the game.

Promotion is a big part of any venue also. If you don't know how to promote, take the time and do it wisely, nobody will know about it.
 
larrynj1 said:
Jim. this is also true of rooms that i frequent. it seems no one was aware that this was goin on as little as 20 miles away. most of the people i spoke to would have loved to attend. the trouble is that room owners are reluctant to promote ANYTHING outside their own room for fear of losing any business. the newpapers don't consider pool a sport and is thus not newsworthy.
word of mouth still generated more than 100 fans at this thing.
Click to expand...

Sad state of affairs isn't it!

Well speaking of promotion, are you aware that on Sept. 24th, 25th & 26th the NJ Straight Pool Championship is being held at Comet Billiards in Parsippany, NJ. This years US Open Runner-Up is the reigning NJ Straight Pool Champion, although I do not know if he is coming to defend his title or not.

Last years tourney provided for some fantastic straight pool.

Jim
 
and unfortunately, the nyc grand central station tournament is scheduled the same weekend as the nj straight pool thing. i think i'll go watch straight pool.
 
I think the pros are in a situation where many of them don't make enough money just playing the tournaments. This forces them to gamble which affords sweaters the opportunity to view these matches for free. I don't know what the solution is but I think SJM makes a great point and until this changes somehow, the sport is going to suffer because of it.

Also, many room owners are in the business to make a buck and that dollar doesn't necessarily have to help pool at all. They're just trying to survive and support their families just like everyone else. If they can make more money selling food, having video games and all kinds of other things besides pool, that's what they're going to do. Unfortunately, pool often takes a back seat in many of the pool halls I've been in. One place I used to go to had 32 4 1/2 by 9's and covers many of them each evening with plywood and vinyl table clothes so they can have pizza birthday parties on them. It's disgusting but the room owner has made enough money over the years to buy a house in an exclusive neighborhood worth over $1,000,000. He didn't make that kind of money promoting pool. He used pool as just one hook to get people to walk into his place so he could figure out creative ways to get people to spend their money in his establishment.
 
larrynj1 said:
and unfortunately, the nyc grand central station tournament is scheduled the same weekend as the nj straight pool thing. i think i'll go watch straight pool.
Click to expand...
Sorry you are wrong. The NYC tournament is a week after. I plan to attend the straight pool tourney myself to support the local players.
 
my apologies, the world summit in nyc is 9/30 - 10/3 and nj straight pool is the week before.
 
larrynj1 said:
and unfortunately, the nyc grand central station tournament is scheduled the same weekend as the nj straight pool thing. i think i'll go watch straight pool.
Click to expand...

I'll be at the Straight Pool Tourney on Sunday for sure, I'm not sure if I can get there for any of Friday or Saturdays matches as of yet, still hoping.

Jim
 
[

Also, many room owners are in the business to make a buck and that dollar doesn't necessarily have to help pool at all. They're just trying to survive and support their families just like everyone else. If they can make more money selling food, having video games and all kinds of other things besides pool, that's what they're going to do. Unfortunately, pool often takes a back seat in many of the pool halls I've been in. One place I used to go to had 32 4 1/2 by 9's and covers many of them each evening with plywood and vinyl table clothes so they can have pizza birthday parties on them. It's disgusting but the room owner has made enough money over the years to buy a house in an exclusive neighborhood worth over $1,000,000. He didn't make that kind of money promoting pool. He used pool as just one hook to get people to walk into his place so he could figure out creative ways to get people to spend their money in his establishment.[/QUOTE]

I don't see anything disgusting with the room owner making money to buy a million dollar house.He put up his money,he took the chances,he came up with alternatives for making it.I can't figure why you would make such comments,unless its jeoulosy.
If you want a joint to be just 20 tables and nothing else,then spend the money and open one up.With todays rents the fees for time won't come near making the nut every month.I am not a room owner but I sure would lkike to hear from some of them on this.
Bob
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top