Rotation 8-Ball

cueman

cueman

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I wonder why Rotation 8-Ball has not become more popular through the years. Everyone is complaining about 9 and 10 Ball being too easy for the pros. Have any of you ever played rotation 8 ball with the full rack? It is a tough game. Short rack of 9 balls is too easy, but full rack is pretty tough.
 
I've played a variation of that with my honorary nephew, a BCAPL Grand Master. Regular 8 ball, only he has to play rotation with his. He usually still wins, but it evens things out enough to make it interesting.
 
Rotation 8 ball would be interesting with pros, but the safety play would likely be unbearable. When you have a different legal object ball than your opponent playing safe/hooking/snookering would be very very easy. The ease of playing safe would likely over shadow the other skills in the game. Even the very best escape artists would have a difficult time with how easy even an average player would have it hooking them if they get a decent look at their object ball.
 
Wheelsno3 said:
Rotation 8 ball would be interesting with pros, but the safety play would likely be unbearable. When you have a different legal object ball than your opponent playing safe/hooking/snookering would be very very easy. The ease of playing safe would likely over shadow the other skills in the game. Even the very best escape artists would have a difficult time with how easy even an average player would have it hooking them if they get a decent look at their object ball.
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True...there needs to be an honor system in place of no intentional safety play...
 
pwd72s said:
True...there needs to be an honor system in place of no intentional safety play...
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With all due respect, pwd72s...honor system to not play safeties?

You're kidding, right?
Safety (aka defense) is an absolute important component of any game.

I wouldn't play a pool game where intentional safety shots were not allowed,
whether I were a pro or amateur. :boring2:
 
Wheelsno3 said:
Rotation 8 ball would be interesting with pros, but the safety play would likely be unbearable. When you have a different legal object ball than your opponent playing safe/hooking/snookering would be very very easy. The ease of playing safe would likely over shadow the other skills in the game. Even the very best escape artists would have a difficult time with how easy even an average player would have it hooking them if they get a decent look at their object ball.
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One good safety to where your opponent couldn't hit their next ball in order resulting in ball in hand would speed things up .
 
Safety would be fine if you can shoot your other balls but have to make them in order and if you make a ball out of order it spots and is bih for the opponent. This wouldn't make safeties so crippling but also wouldn't reward wild kick shots either.
 
Drop The Rock said:
Safety would be fine if you can shoot your other balls but have to make them in order and if you make a ball out of order it spots and is bih for the opponent. This wouldn't make safeties so crippling but also wouldn't reward wild kick shots either.
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That is excellent thinking....it could work.

But if someone is looking to slow the game down, LAST POCKET 8-ball is a good game.

And there are already some great games for those who want a different pace.....
.....one-pocket and straight pool
 
Wheelsno3 said:
Rotation 8 ball would be interesting with pros, but the safety play would likely be unbearable. When you have a different legal object ball than your opponent playing safe/hooking/snookering would be very very easy. The ease of playing safe would likely over shadow the other skills in the game. Even the very best escape artists would have a difficult time with how easy even an average player would have it hooking them if they get a decent look at their object ball.
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In rotation 8 ball, is a legal hit making contact with only the lowest numbered ball in my suit, or is a legal hit making contact with any of the balls in my suit?

So if I am stripes and I am shooting at the 10 ball, could I still make a legal hit by making contact with the 11-15 balls? That would make playing safe easy in order to hinder me from making the ball I need to, but still would allow me to make a legal hit on one of my balls to avoid giving my opponent ball in hand.
 
A good alternative to stop the easy safes is on your first shot of a run you can shoot any one of your colored balls, but the next shot of the run has to be the lowest numbered ball of your color. I think that simple rule change would speed it up and keep it fun.
 
cueman said:
A good alternative to stop the easy safes is on your first shot of a run you can shoot any one of your colored balls, but the next shot of the run has to be the lowest numbered ball of your color. I think that simple rule change would speed it up and keep it fun.
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I like this idea. Or another one could be that you are allowed to call the lowest numbered ball of your opponent's color at the start of your run. I will try out both of these variations with a player of similar standard - I have a hunch that it can only be good training for competitive standard 8 ball.
 
They had a league for this called american rotation, it was played a few sessions around here, it was call safety so if you missed and the opponent didn't have a shot he could make you shoot it.
 
Not about rotation of 8 ball but the rules of 8 Ball years ago stated that the one had to be made in a designated side pocket and the 9 in the other side pocket. I think this rule was changed because of the coin op bar tables.

I don't remember if those balls had to be pocketed first or how the designated pocket was determined. I would also think that the place in the rack for the nine and one has to be in a certain spot.

🎱
 
TheBook said:
Not about rotation of 8 ball but the rules of 8 Ball years ago stated that the one had to be made in a designated side pocket and the 9 in the other side pocket. I think this rule was changed because of the coin op bar tables.

I don't remember if those balls had to be pocketed first or how the designated pocket was determined. I would also think that the place in the rack for the nine and one has to be in a certain spot.

🎱
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Yes that was an option in the rule book when I was a kid. You could make them anytime, but it had to be in the designated side pocket or it spotted up.
 
stevea said:
They had a league for this called american rotation, it was played a few sessions around here, it was call safety so if you missed and the opponent didn't have a shot he could make you shoot it.
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I thought American Rotation was like normal rotation, but just gave different points to the balls instead of one player shooting solids and the other stripes.
 
This is a game already. And has tournaments. It's called Saratoga, and two balls are removed from the rack to speed the game up a bit. Also, if you hook yourself, no jump cue allowed. if your opponent hooks you, jump cue use is allowed.

Johnny Archer and Rodney Morris come to Wyoming to play the major Saratoga event every year, and we've seen Corey Deuel and Oscar Dominguez as well.

The game is not as prone to amateurs beating pros as you might think. It's like any other game. Pros make better decisions on a consistent basis than amateurs do. They kick and bank better as well. Pros can run multiple racks of Saratoga to make up for luck of amateur. If the amateur gets a ball on the rail in between two of opponent's balls, and misses bank? He's done.

If anyone has an interest in running Saratoga tournaments, they should contact E.J. Glode or Monte Thayer in Wyoming. I don't have their contact info, but they are not hard to find online. They are the distributors for Andy Cloth in America, as well..

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?p=5074591

Short Bus Russ - C Player
 
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