Rough money chart

[Wags]

Here are some Money stats. I'll let the gurus figure out who probably loses their cards and who probably gets new ones. I don't know how the IPT is going to do it but they promised all current card holders $13,000 for the year while announcing the xcelled tournament. Is that the benchmark? It looks like alot more than 50 will lose their cards.

View attachment IPT Stats.doc

 

[cigardave]

I don't believe that it's difficult at all.

After the Masters in Chicago, the 2006 money list will be finalized based on each cardholder's accumulated winnings in three tournaments... the NA Open, this one going on right now.. and the Masters in Chicago.

The bottom 50 of the current IPT cardholders (or as they are now called in some online files, IPT Pros), will not retain their cards for 2007... UNLESS they finish high in the year-end Tour Qualifier in Vegas. You could also say that after the Masters in Chicago, the bottom 50 have lost their cards... and to be a cardholder in 2007, they must do well in the (2007) Tour Qualifier in Vegas, which coincides timewise with the 2006 KOH Tournament.

The first criteria will be money earned, the second criteria will be games win %.

Pretty simple, I believe.

 

[jjinfla]

keep one thing in mind. That was the way KT was going to do it.

Now that it is sold, or so I heard, the new owner may do it differently.

Just thought I would give you guys something new to think about.

Man, this sure is a long tournament. I sure can't imagine people wasting all that money and time out of their lives attending it. Maybe they should have one round every week or so culminating in a final tournament for the big bucks. But a continuous tournament like this is nuts.

Jake

 

[cigardave]

Man, this sure is a long tournament. I sure can't imagine people wasting all that money and time out of their lives attending it. Maybe they should have one round every week or so culminating in a final tournament for the big bucks. Jake

Man, the travel expenses would be brutal it were done as you've suggested... especially for those coming from overseas.

 

[Snapshot9]

Comments ....

keep one thing in mind. That was the way KT was going to do it.

Now that it is sold, or so I heard, the new owner may do it differently.

Just thought I would give you guys something new to think about.

Man, this sure is a long tournament. I sure can't imagine people wasting all that money and time out of their lives attending it. Maybe they should have one round every week or so culminating in a final tournament for the big bucks. But a continuous tournament like this is nuts.

Jake

Your comments are food for thought, but I don't see Ho involved that much in details of the tour, that's why KT is still there. I believe his influence will be more on a 'macro' level. I don't think this close to a year end of a tour year, that major changes would come about, that's kind of like reniging on a contract at this point.

Yes, they are long tournaments, but considering the number of players, how could you really shorten it up without wearing the players out? Playing about 12 hours a day is stressful enough. Playing once a week building up would not maintain interest overall for the GENERAL PUBLIC, let alone some of us Pool fanatics.

I would imagine that most changes to come about will be announced prior to the 2007 tour year begins. Ho will probably offer some overall direction for the tour, Kt will take it into account, offer up suggested changes affecting the tour, with Ho approving or disapproving. I am sure that future event locations will be a subject Ho will address.

The IPT has made good strides since the it's inception, and I think they will continue to improve it whereever they can. It is like one of the Old World ships loaded up with people and supplies setting out for a new land.
We don't know where we will end up, but the journey sure is interesting.

They seem to be listening to the Pool public and the players and trying, and that is about all you can expect from anyone.

 

[Wags]

I don't believe that it's difficult at all.

The bottom 50 of the current IPT cardholders (or as they are now called in some online files, IPT Pros), will not retain their cards for 2007

The first criteria will be money earned, the second criteria will be games win %.

Pretty simple, I believe.

Actually, I don't think it's that simple. I thought that ALL card holders lose their 06 cards and 07 cards are reissued to the top 100 money winners which means that more than 50 current card holders will lose cards. I could be wrong, but that is my understanding.

If just 50 players lose cards, yes pretty simple, except how is the IPT going to adjust for the $13,000? Bring everyone below that amount up to that amount? or adjust by just adding $4,000 to everyones earnings (as the bottom place in the tournaments now total $9,000)?

Either way, your interpretation or mine, that $13,000 lurks in who is gone and who wins 07 cards. So far with 235 players participating in both events and many Q's above that $13,000 mark makes it very interesting.

Does anyone know absolutely for sure which way it works? We do know that the Q-Tournament will have 50 cards up for grabs, but who gets to be in the select 100?

Also, will current card holders that lose cards get an automatic entry into the Q-tourney?

 

[TheOne]

Actually, I don't think it's that simple. I thought that ALL card holders lose their 06 cards and 07 cards are reissued to the top 100 money winners which means that more than 50 current card holders will lose cards.

I believe this is the best way of looking at it to understand it. Everyone loses their card and the top 100 get a new one. The only questions that seem to be unanswered are:

1) Will all the the current card holders get invited to the 2007 qualifers if they total more than 50? I believe this will 100% be a yes, because they now have to each pay $2000 each for the privilege so its good business for the IPT.

2) We know that the card holders who finish on less than 13k will have their money made up to 13k, but will this count towards the ranking? Given that this wouldn't be money won and would be unfair towards the qualifers I suspect not.

 

[rackmsuckr]

I believe this is the best way of looking at it to understand it. Everyone loses their card and the top 100 get a new one. The only questions that seem to be unanswered are:

1) Will all the the current card holders get invited to the 2007 qualifers if they total more than 50? I believe this will 100% be a yes, because they now have to each pay $2000 each for the privilege so its good business for the IPT.

2) We know that the card holders who finish on less than 13k will have their money made up to 13k, but will this count towards the ranking? Given that this wouldn't be money won and would be unfair towards the qualifers I suspect not.

On point #2, it would not be unfair to the qualifiers, since that was a reasonable expectation to at least clear $3K for every member at the London tour stop. What might be considered unfair to some is that the members now have one less stop to capitalize on any advantage of being a member and that many could have earned much more in London than the $3K.

 

[TheOne]

On point #2, it would not be unfair to the qualifiers, since that was a reasonable expectation to at least clear $3K for every member at the London tour stop. What might be considered unfair to some is that the members now have one less stop to capitalize on any advantage of being a member and that many could have earned much more in London than the $3K.

I understand that Linda and I think this will be a VERY tricky issue. However I am slightly in favor of it not counting. The reason being is that this tournament IS NOT going to happen so given the money list is based on money WON. IMO it would be extreemly unfair if the money that is simply handed over to the card holders pushes them up the rankings. The qualifiers have done it the hard way, many of them have spent thousands of dollars trying to earn a tour card for themselves, it would be a travisty if a sinlge one of them had this taken away from them due to a hand out. But I do agree that the IPT should honor the 13k, it just shouldn't be counted as money won.

 

[Snapshot9]

What I heard ...

One of the guys on SAPPA said he heard that The London Event was being moved back to the States, so have you considered that the event will still take place, but just in the States rather than England? Then the issues regarding money would not be at issue then.

(also I just noticed on the stats page of the Reno tournament, 37th through
60th place has $15,000 for all players in that ranking. I wonder if that if they are going to double back and respread declining prize money per ranking for those platyers?)

 

[TheOne]

One of the guys on SAPPA said he heard that The London Event was being moved back to the States, so have you considered that the event will still take place, but just in the States rather than England? Then the issues regarding money would not be at issue then.

(also I just noticed on the stats page of the Reno tournament, 37th through
60th place has $15,000 for all players in that ranking. I wonder if that if they are going to double back and respread declining prize money per ranking for those platyers?)

well they already said its not happening and theyll make the money up, but would be easier if they do hold it of course!

Yeah theyll change the money, porb old code that needs updating on their website

 

[rackmsuckr]

I understand that Linda and I think this will be a VERY tricky issue. However I am slightly in favor of it not counting. The reason being is that this tournament IS NOT going to happen so given the money list is based on money WON. IMO it would be extreemly unfair if the money that is simply handed over to the card holders pushes them up the rankings. The qualifiers have done it the hard way, many of them have spent thousands of dollars trying to earn a tour card for themselves, it would be a travisty if a sinlge one of them had this taken away from them due to a hand out. But I do agree that the IPT should honor the 13k, it just shouldn't be counted as money won.

We will have to agree to disagree then. I see your point and commend all the qualifiers, but what was really taken away was the London stop where everyone surely would have WON the $3K. The qualifiers knew what they had to do all along in terms of money won to pass the members. To give them the free pass by discounting the money that would have been won is not right, IMO. It isn't the member's fault that it was cancelled. In the beginning, there were never going to be any qualifiers at all, and now members only have 1 stop to themselves.

Next year, it looks like this issue will resolve itself, as there will be very few qualifiers who won't make it...if not based on money, then for the tour card tournament at the end of the year. I don't see a very successful qualifier program coming into play next year at all, since almost everyone of note will already be in the IPT.

I also feel that eliminating almost all the women and the HOFers as members will be detrimental for the overall cachet of the tournaments. If they would reserve 10 spots for the women and have Karen Corr, Jasmin, Allison, Sarah Ellerby, Jeanette, Hsin Mei Liu, Pan, and maybe Monica/Helena/Ewa/LJJ/Julie Kelly or any other woman player of note, and the same for the HOFers it would maintain the excitement of the men vs. women thing and the old guard vs. the new guard. Some of them can still play!

 

[jjinfla]

I agree with The One. The 2006 Tour Card is just that, a 2006 Tour Card. To receive a 2007 Tour Card one has to finish in the top 100 of the ranking.

It looks like $20,000 in winnings might be enough to finish in the top 100. 38th place in this tournament receives $20,460.

The next 50 will be selected through the qualification process.

Providing Ho does not want to change anything.

The gifts to the weak players, women, old timers was given in 2006. Now it will be up to only the very best to be allowed to play. There is no affirmative action in sports.

Jake

 

[TheOne]

I agree with The One. The 2006 Tour Card is just that, a 2006 Tour Card. To receive a 2007 Tour Card one has to finish in the top 100 of the ranking.

It looks like $20,000 in winnings might be enough to finish in the top 100. 38th place in this tournament receives $20,460.

The next 50 will be selected through the qualification process.

Providing Ho does not want to change anything.

The gifts to the weak players, women, old timers was given in 2006. Now it will be up to only the very best to be allowed to play. There is no affirmative action in sports.

Jake

Have to agree Jake, I certainly hope it doesnt change as this seems like the best way of doing things. I have to say that although I was pretty vocal about the way the IPT selected the original 150 allowing the qualifiers to earn a card + the 50 at the end of the year was a great decission. This has fast tracked the whole process of filtering out the weak players and the IPT will be a lot better for it IMO.

Linda, yep def disagree but can see where your coming from. However as a total neutral (not a card holder or a qualifier) I think there will be an uproar if this handout takes spots away from the guys who have done it the hard way. Imagine if you was a qualifier who had spent 10k trying to win a card, and after the last event you was ranekd 80th. Then a week later the IPT add the 3k handout to the selected players and you lose your 100k IPT card, thats sure going to suck! The selected players have had there chance to prove there good enough, if they're not in the top 100 after 3 events then I don't think they deserve another free ride!

 

[smashmouth]

The sad truth is there are many IPT members who can't even win a single
match and really have little business playing alongside the world's best.

 

[onepocketchump]

I am 100% certain that the IPT will handle this in a way that generates a lot of discussion, admiration, disgust, moralizing, negativity, and general controversy on this board.

Anyone want to bet on this? I am giving 2:1 odds..... :->

John

 

[Renegade]

Where's JAM? I miss her posts. She's been unusually quiet this tournament....