Safeties vs Slop

[LegitStick1234]

So on Friday nights I play in a small town rotation league. They do not like safeties at all most of them. There are a hand full of decent teams and the rest not so great. We were playing the worst team in the league Friday night and I was playing a gentleman that hit the ball real hard. This rotation game is slop as long as you hit the lowest ball on the table first anything can go in. Well he made 3 shots that went 4 rails and fell in, not in the pocket he was intending. So he hooked me on a shot and I played a safety and he blew up saying it is chicken %&$& pool. I just kept playing because it isn't worth the altercation, but I got to thinking... How can a safety be considered cheap pool, yet if you miss so bad and go 4 rails and make it that isn't cheap pool? I know he is a banger, but if you play pool against people that do not play competitively safeties are frowned upon, but slop isn't. A good safety can be real hard to pull off sometimes!

 

[buckshotshoey]

So on Friday nights I play in a small town rotation league. They do not like safeties at all most of them. There are a hand full of decent teams and the rest not so great. We were playing the worst team in the league Friday night and I was playing a gentleman that hit the ball real hard. This rotation game is slop as long as you hit the lowest ball on the table first anything can go in. Well he made 3 shots that went 4 rails and fell in, not in the pocket he was intending. So he hooked me on a shot and I played a safety and he blew up saying it is chicken %&$& pool. I just kept playing because it isn't worth the altercation, but I got to thinking... How can a safety be considered cheap pool, yet if you miss so bad and go 4 rails and make it that isn't cheap pool? I know he is a banger, but if you play pool against people that do not play competitively safeties are frowned upon, but slop isn't. A good safety can be real hard to pull off sometimes!

I'd ha e done it 3 or 4 more dimes to him.

 

[PhilosopherKing]

I'm not a league player, but, in tournaments, I don't usually play safeties against considerably weaker opponents, even when giving big weight.

It demoralizes some people and upsets the others, and hurts the turn-out, in the long run.

 

[ceodynamo]

don't sweat it

don't sweat the petty stuff just pet the sweaty stuff. Seriously though just roll your eyes and say oh well. You didn't do anything wrong.

 

[robertod]

Defense is a great part of many sports. Why not in pool?

 

[pt109]

I like how Corey handles those guys...
“I don’t make the rules, I just play by them.”

 

[hang-the-9]

So on Friday nights I play in a small town rotation league. They do not like safeties at all most of them. There are a hand full of decent teams and the rest not so great. We were playing the worst team in the league Friday night and I was playing a gentleman that hit the ball real hard. This rotation game is slop as long as you hit the lowest ball on the table first anything can go in. Well he made 3 shots that went 4 rails and fell in, not in the pocket he was intending. So he hooked me on a shot and I played a safety and he blew up saying it is chicken %&$& pool. I just kept playing because it isn't worth the altercation, but I got to thinking... How can a safety be considered cheap pool, yet if you miss so bad and go 4 rails and make it that isn't cheap pool? I know he is a banger, but if you play pool against people that do not play competitively safeties are frowned upon, but slop isn't. A good safety can be real hard to pull off sometimes!

Hold on, they are playing Rotation, but don't like safties? That is strange. Usually people that complain about safeties only know about 8 ball and not even the real rules at that.

In fact it would be a long time before you could even find a random player in a place that even heard of Rotation as a game. I played in a 9 ball tournament where 3 players were asking us "where are the rest of the balls?" LOL And one of them owned a pool table and the others played with him at his house! How you manage to buy a pool table and only know about 8 ball?

I'd explain the difference between bar pool and real pool and see if he wants to continue being a banger or become a "player".

Or you can just tell him that was not a safe, I am just really bad at making a ball hehe. That is what those type of players do anyway, they pretend they were trying to make a ball but really were playing cueball the whole time, and when they leave you a tough shot they make a big scene about how they missed the shot.

I'm lucky enough to play in tournaments and a league where a good safe is often noted as well as making a good shot, maybe the better players in your league should do some educating and lessons to the players that don't have a clue yet.

 

[LegitStick1234]

I live in a town with some competitive teams, but the rotation league is a league that is played by a bunch of teams in the smaller farm towns in the area. So there are some good players and some real poor. The rules they play by are a bit different than the game you know and love. We have 6 man teams and play against the same person for 3 games. Each ball worth face value. So a total score of 120 per game. Total team points at the end of the night wins. There is no ball in hand it is kitchen and if the object ball is in the kitchen on a foul it can be spotted. So there are a lot of spot shots. It is fun to play here and there. Most of the guys are super fun to hang around.

 

[KRJ]

Yep, remember when I got back into pool 15 years ago after taking off 15 years after college (playing once or twice a year with a buddy was about it)

Joined a league (didn't even know they existed) until a neighbor moved from Seattle and he explained that leagues are pretty popular, so we got a team.

Played a safe against a woman, and she asked me "do you have a p#ssy too" She was mad about it me wanting to get ball in hand and try and win the game? Tried to speak to her after the game but she wanted to part of it, she was right and I played chicken shit pool.

I know my teammates didn't play many safeties, but they were just above banger level. But, I had other teams play them against me? WTF? Nothing you can do about folks that refuse to accept the fact that they will continue to lose if they don't play defense.

 

[CGM]

Safety play is imperative to competitive rotation play. You should always be playing the table, not the opponent as far as Im concerned. If the situation calls for a safety, play a safety. I wouldnt get angry if someone better than me tried to 3 foul me. It would just mean I need to work on my kicking game. Its part of affective play.

 

[bradsh98]

In a general sense, the object of the game is to make balls. At the lower level, that is the only aspect that the players are focused on. Regardless of how the ball finds the pocket, the goal is still the same: to pocket balls.

When you play a safe, you have demonstrated zero intent to pocket a ball. Often times, that is not necessarily understood by the lower levels. This lack of understanding generally leads to hard feelings.

If this truly bothers you, I suggest that you either alter your game, when playing with the lower caliber players (so as to avoid conflict), or don't play with them at all.

 

[buckshotshoey]

We were playing Valley 8 ball and I scratched on a shot. My opponent placed the cue ball in the "kitchen". I old him he had ball in hand anywhere. He refused and said ball in hand is not playing pool.

He was stuck in bar rule mode and just couldn't understand it. He lasted one session.

 

[Bob Jewett]

So on Friday nights I play in a small town rotation league. ...

A couple of approaches:

Just play your regular game. Maybe throw in Corey's line from above. (I used to play in an eight ball league in which safeties were forbidden. The good players played by the rule. The wiley old farts played the "Oops, I missed" safeties but had no chance to win anyway.)

Try to play two-way shots when you don't have anything simple to shoot at. It might not dawn on them that you are mostly playing safe. Be sure to line up your pocketing attempt in an obvious way, like that carom the 3 ball off the 12 to hit the 15 shot (while dragging the cue ball up the table to behind the 4).

Go for the gusto. If you have no direct shot, try to set every ball on the table in motion. Fight fire with napalm. Oh, and pull the cue ball up the table to settle behind the 4.

I'm curious.... What is the penalty for a bad hit? Shoot again if the opponent asks?

 

[hang-the-9]

We were playing Valley 8 ball and I scratched on a shot. My opponent placed the cue ball in the "kitchen". I old him he had ball in hand anywhere. He refused and said ball in hand is not playing pool.

He was stuck in bar rule mode and just couldn't understand it. He lasted one session.

I never understood the rules that bar players play by considering their skill level and the fact that the better players play by the WPA rules in most cases when playing each other. If you can't make two balls in a row without luck, why on earth are they playing by bar rules like no touching another ball or a rail? It would be like some random dude racing in the Daytona 500 and not stop to change tires because that is for sissies LOL I used a bridge one time and one of the players told me I was cheating. Granted he was pretty drunk, but that is still funny. Good players play by a set of rules and use equipment that the crappy players think is under them to use. SMH.

 

[LegitStick1234]

I'm curious.... What is the penalty for a bad hit? Shoot again if the opponent asks?[/QUOTE]

If you do not contact your object ball the other player gets the option of cue ball in the kitchen or leaving it where it lies. Whichever benefits the best. If you choose the kitchen and the object ball is in the kitchen then you would spot it.

 

[Bob Jewett]

I'm curious.... What is the penalty for a bad hit? Shoot again if the opponent asks?

If you do not contact your object ball the other player gets the option of cue ball in the kitchen or leaving it where it lies. Whichever benefits the best. If you choose the kitchen and the object ball is in the kitchen then you would spot it.

So under those rules you could just miss a ball "unintentionally" and maybe leave no shot at all if the ball is down on the foot rail behind blockers?

 

[ctyhntr]

The rules for the games you love were different from 20-30 years ago. Old timers would tell me when they played in 9-ball tournaments back in late 80's, they would ask to clarify we playing 9-ball or Texas Express rules?

For 8-bal, BCA adopted World Standardized Rules (WSR). Before that, most folks were used to BIH behind the kitchen, take what you make on the break. Safeties in some social circles were considered dirty pool.

Ball in Hand anywhere on the table is a powerful incentive for attempting a safety and your league rules appears to remove that incentive.

I live in a town with some competitive teams, but the rotation league is a league that is played by a bunch of teams in the smaller farm towns in the area. So there are some good players and some real poor. The rules they play by are a bit different than the game you know and love. We have 6 man teams and play against the same person for 3 games. Each ball worth face value. So a total score of 120 per game. Total team points at the end of the night wins. There is no ball in hand it is kitchen and if the object ball is in the kitchen on a foul it can be spotted. So there are a lot of spot shots. It is fun to play here and there. Most of the guys are super fun to hang around.

 

[buckshotshoey]

I never understood the rules that bar players play by considering their skill level and the fact that the better players play by the WPA rules in most cases when playing each other. If you can't make two balls in a row without luck, why on earth are they playing by bar rules like no touching another ball or a rail? It would be like some random dude racing in the Daytona 500 and not stop to change tires because that is for sissies LOL I used a bridge one time and one of the players told me I was cheating. Granted he was pretty drunk, but that is still funny. Good players play by a set of rules and use equipment that the crappy players think is under them to use. SMH.

I hear ya! Some old dogs just refuse to learn a new trick.

 

[Black-Balled]

I never realized how much your game hinges on the 4, Bob.

A couple of approaches:

Just play your regular game. Maybe throw in Corey's line from above. (I used to play in an eight ball league in which safeties were forbidden. The good players played by the rule. The wiley old farts played the "Oops, I missed" safeties but had no chance to win anyway.)

Try to play two-way shots when you don't have anything simple to shoot at. It might not dawn on them that you are mostly playing safe. Be sure to line up your pocketing attempt in an obvious way, like that carom the 3 ball off the 12 to hit the 15 shot (while dragging the cue ball up the table to behind the 4).

Go for the gusto. If you have no direct shot, try to set every ball on the table in motion. Fight fire with napalm. Oh, and pull the cue ball up the table to settle behind the 4.

I'm curious.... What is the penalty for a bad hit? Shoot again if the opponent asks?

 

[MattPoland]

In the old days before Texas Express took hold, bar rules were that you always had to try a shot. You could sneak in a two-way shot or get away with “I’m just trying to hit it” but an obvious safety could get you taken out back. Road players knew this well. The mentality the OP is facing just grew out of that history and never caught up. It is odd to see that in a rotation game as most get the rules and strategy explained to them before they play. But it is common to see no safeties in a ring 9-ball game. But even then you hear players boast that they gave an “honest effort” with a smile on their face.


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