Safety Players

TheConArtist

TheConArtist

Daddy's A Butcher
Silver Member
Otaye most of my teammates shoot some great stick but they never play safeties because they don't like to they think its not right to play safes, how can you teach them or tell them offensive sells tickets defense wins games? We have a five dollar side pot for whoever shoots the highest and 25 frog skins ain't that much but hey it doesn't bother me it going into my pockets every tuesday night lol, but i can't get through to them, i sound like a broken record hey why didnt' you just play the safe it was right there then they either say i didn't see it, or i thought i could bank it etc... then i have to hear there whining around after the have to shake their opponents hand and congratulate them on there win. Is it you can't teach a dog new tricks or do i have hope. Any suggestions Thanks in Advance. Cole 'TheConArtist'
 
Next time you pick up the money, say, "Ahhhh..oooooo.....safety money.....ooooooo," and rub it all over your body like it is the best thing in the world and you can't get enough of it...."Safety money...."

It shouldn't take long to change their minds.

Jeff Livingston
 
I've been teaching my team to play one pocket. It's improved thier overall game, but most importantly it's improved thier safety play.
 
Ask them if they ever seen great players win big sets without playing safe. They will say yes. Then you ask them hom many sets did they win when they did play safe...the answer: a whole lot more.

Here's a littel diddy to help:


THE SMART PLAY

If you can get out, without a doubt,
then shoot the ball says the man.

If you can't get out, playing safe no doubt,
will give you a chance at ball-in-hand.

Now either way, when you make the smart play,
you can be the run out man

Donovan - 2006 :cool:
 
teaching safties

The team I play on is known for playing safties. And the other teams can't beat us. But it has taken a couple of years of drilling it in their heads to play safe. And to be able to see safties. You have to have structured practices and litterally show them what to look for. Teach them percentages. If it is a low percentage shot, don't take it. Look for a way to hook their apponent. And when it comes to a tournament, if you will make a shot less than 80% of the time, Don't Shoot It. Its a long and drawn out battle to convience and convert someone to the smarter side of pool.

You don't have to be the best player to win, The smartest player is the one that will win the majority of games.
 
That's why ...

Chris' Cues said:
The team I play on is known for playing safties. And the other teams can't beat us. But it has taken a couple of years of drilling it in their heads to play safe. And to be able to see safties. You have to have structured practices and litterally show them what to look for. Teach them percentages. If it is a low percentage shot, don't take it. Look for a way to hook their apponent. And when it comes to a tournament, if you will make a shot less than 80% of the time, Don't Shoot It. Its a long and drawn out battle to convience and convert someone to the smarter side of pool.

You don't have to be the best player to win, The smartest player is the one that will win the majority of games.
Click to expand...

There is difference between playing well and being able to win. Defense is the only way a lessor player can beat a better player. When you hook someone they may know what to do, but the accuracy of them doing it is
in question because they have to jump or kick, and kicking is ALWAYS
questionable, therefore raising your chances of getting back to the table.
Teach someone to 'win', and it opens up a whole new world to them.
 
TCA:

I can sympathize with this situation, as I have been there on a couple of teams in the past. Seems like I was late signing-up (or nobody wanted me! Haha!), so I always got stuck on a "leftovers" team.

On two of the teams, I transformed the players into safety players just by "leading by example". They watched my success with safety (and smart) play and by the time the year-end tournament came around, they were good players. One team took first place in the standings and the year-end tourney, the other was 13th place in standings and FIRST place in the year-end tourney.... Tranformation, Man!!!

Sportsmanship is harder to teach and is kinda like teaching someone not to litter or a puppy not to pee on the rug... when they do it (bad sportsmanship) you gotta rub their nose in it a little.

Play the role of the teacher, but mostly by example... they will follow if they want to improve.
 
chris hit the nail on the head here, it is all about percentages, if you are shooting a 50/50 shot, and the defense is an easy one, then shoot the 85 percent lock up defense shot, and make the other player shoot the hard low percentage shot, then ask them how many times they get out with ball in hand or a better look after the other player makes a hard kick shot. also what alot of people dont understand, if you are playing a player who is shooting very good and is in stroke, several defenses can frustrate them, they come up to the table 2 rail kicking or very hard cut shots several times in a row, and can sometimes take them out of their high gear, and you get a chance to get into gear by shooting easier shots with ball in hand.
 
The best way to teach these people that defensive shots/safeties are a valuable part of the game and something that every player should have in their arsenal is to use them to your advantage. Obviously, these are players that will go for the shot every time. So, safe them every chance you get. Once they realize that they keep losing to your game, they'll come around. If they don't, they're idiots.

I played in a tournament last weekend and should have done well but my opponent got me on three on the very first rack. He had a lock-up safe game and, whenever he was in doubt about an offensive shot, had left me in jail. I lost 7-1 when I shouldn't have lost at all.

Defense wins games.
 
The thing that makes it hard to convert these players is its harder to shoot a safty than it is to make a ball. it takes practice to shoot a good defensive game. When you shoot a defensive shot, ball control is critical. You are only dealing with a matter of an inch or so that you can stop the ball or balls in to get a good hook. When they shoot to make a ball the speed is nowhere as critical.
It is very difficult for players to shoot soft enough to be prficient at defence without practice. A good drill to practice this is simple. Place a quarter on top of the object ball. Shoot the cue ball into the object ball soft enough to roll the quarter off the front of the ball. If you hit it to hard the object ball will slide out from under the quarter. After the get to where they can roll the quarter off the front of the ball from a foot away start trying from farther away. It is very frustrating trying to do this but it will teach you what soft is.
 
Chris' Cues said:
The thing that makes it hard to convert these players is its harder to shoot a safty than it is to make a ball. it takes practice to shoot a good defensive game. When you shoot a defensive shot, ball control is critical. You are only dealing with a matter of an inch or so that you can stop the ball or balls in to get a good hook. When they shoot to make a ball the speed is nowhere as critical.
It is very difficult for players to shoot soft enough to be prficient at defence without practice. A good drill to practice this is simple. Place a quarter on top of the object ball. Shoot the cue ball into the object ball soft enough to roll the quarter off the front of the ball. If you hit it to hard the object ball will slide out from under the quarter. After the get to where they can roll the quarter off the front of the ball from a foot away start trying from farther away. It is very frustrating trying to do this but it will teach you what soft is.[/QUOTE/]


thanks, i'll use this to sharpen my own defensive skills.:D

teach them to use restricted follow. if you don't know what i mean watch byrne's gamebreakers. it is mastered very quicky, and i think it is one of the best shots for defensive play.
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Thanks guys for the replies, on another site a buddy said what they do on their team is they have the lowest shooter wear a pink shirt the next week. I thought that was funny and a kewl way to get them to start playing the high percentage shots, so i will have to take your guys advice and throw the shirt into the mix LOL. Thanks again guys, Cole 'TheConArtist'
 
A good way to get somebody to pay attention to defense is to get them in games for a little dough.

Let em feel the misery of handing over even just a couple of Jacksons because they were too lazy to think much about playing safe or looking for 2-way shots. It's like showing up for a test in school without having studied right ... a lot of the time you're taking wild guesses. Or maybe you've got an inkling of the right answer, but because you haven't done your homework, you keep leaving short straight-in shots, or have to sit and watch somebody run out yet again from the 6 with bih.:(
 
BarBox 8Ball Rules

In that other thread they'd call this chicken shit pool....lol Seriously from the perspective of a beginner, when I get to the table I'm looking to stay there as long as I can......I want to pocket a ball. Now it's very hard for me to shoot a pure defensive shot. In general if I'm in a tight spot...like I got 4 left and you're shooting at the 8 I try to pick the ball that if I miss will leave the hardest shot on the 8.....but in Most cases I will try to pocket that ball and run out....I was playing a guy and had him down with 3 on the table and me on the 8. He could have pocketed a ball and maybe run them out....instead he played safe a couple times in a row....I was able to get a good hit on the 8 each time and when he tried the 3rd safe I managed a tough bank to win the game. He could have won if he'd gone on offense...instead he just prolonged the inevitable and drew comments from the railbirds about chickenshit pool.....lol
Safety in the pool room is all about remembering to put condoms in your cue case for after the match...
 
DelaWho??? said:
- Seriously from the perspective of a beginner, when I get to the table I'm looking to stay there as long as I can......I want to pocket a ball. ...
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This is what this thread is about. Beginners want to stay at the table as long as they can. Unfortunately, it usually isn't long enough to win. Experienced players know that winning comes from keeping control of the table. The hard thing to learn is that often, defense is the best way to control the table. Unless you know you can run the table out, you want to control the circumstances when you allow you opponent to have a turn. Think about football...how easy is it for your opponent to score if you have a weak defensive game?
Steve
 
Well right now when someone sits me down, I usually walk away from the table feeling like I beat myself....there's always a turning point and it's crystal clear....I'll miss a shot I know I can make in the middle of the run and because I "know" I can make the shot and see the whole way out...I miss leave the other guy set up and it's over...Most of the time I know what I did wrong to miss but the killer is the pocket rattle and hang......That's frustrating but not so bad if I get back to the table....Bottom line this is a complicated game and I have alot to learn
 
Great thread.

I believe that most players don't enjoy safety play. They came to the poolroom to pocket balls, not to play safe.

Then there are those play some safes but have a selective memory and seem to only remember the times it backfired, due to either failure to execute or because opponent did something phenomenal or lucky. It scares me how often I've heard players remark "I'd rather go down shooting" as an attempt at ratonalizing such a style of play.

And then there are those who have learned that safety play advances the cause of winning so much that it MUST be utitlized frequently.

It is at the very moment that players begin equating playing safeties with winning that they start to commit themselves to playing them, because everybody enjoys winning!

Oddly enough, this lesson is usually learned the hard way. When an undisciplined player plays against an outstanding defensive player, they start to realize that part of the reason they are not winning is that they are getting far less than half of the good looks (meaning realistc run ouit chances) at the table. Once that fact starts to get under the skin, they start to mend their ways.

Both straight pool and one pocket are great games to refine one's defensive skills, as one is presented with so many positions in which there is no realistc shot to play. In addition, these games require, and therefore develop, superior speed control to execute many of the common defensive shots.
 
DelaWho??? said:
Well right now when someone sits me down, I usually walk away from the table feeling like I beat myself....there's always a turning point and it's crystal clear....I'll miss a shot I know I can make in the middle of the run and because I "know" I can make the shot and see the whole way out...I miss leave the other guy set up and it's over...Most of the time I know what I did wrong to miss but the killer is the pocket rattle and hang......That's frustrating but not so bad if I get back to the table....Bottom line this is a complicated game and I have alot to learn
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This is the problem we are talking about here. If you can see the shot, then you can make it. True! BUT, what percentage of the time do you make it as opposed to taking a safety and trying to get a better position off the opponent making a tough shot to just hit a ball. Many times the safety is much easier to make than the tough shot.
 
Donovan...Point taken but when I say I miss a shot I know I can make I'm taking about a high percentage shot. The kind of shot if I was walking up to the table to start my turn would be a piece of cake.....yet 3 or 4 balls into a run I miss. Because I was sure of the pocket I'm thinking toward the next shot and I'll stand up out of the shot too soon or pull the cue or whatever.
If I'm looking at a table with nothing but low percentage shots I will select the shot with my opponents leave in mind....I will try to pocket a ball without leaving my opponent good if I miss.... At this stage in my game I'm only going into a pure defensive shot if there is no other alternative.....I'm still working on ball control and have a bit of a heavy hand so it's tough for me to bury the cue ball away. It seems right now I end up in a better defensive position if I try a low percentage shot as I described than if I try pure defense......but I'll get there..
 
DelaWho??? said:
Donovan...Point taken but when I say I miss a shot I know I can make I'm taking about a high percentage shot. The kind of shot if I was walking up to the table to start my turn would be a piece of cake.....yet 3 or 4 balls into a run I miss. Because I was sure of the pocket I'm thinking toward the next shot and I'll stand up out of the shot too soon or pull the cue or whatever.
If I'm looking at a table with nothing but low percentage shots I will select the shot with my opponents leave in mind....I will try to pocket a ball without leaving my opponent good if I miss.... At this stage in my game I'm only going into a pure defensive shot if there is no other alternative.....I'm still working on ball control and have a bit of a heavy hand so it's tough for me to bury the cue ball away. It seems right now I end up in a better defensive position if I try a low percentage shot as I described than if I try pure defense......but I'll get there..
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It sounds like you are starting out in the right direction. Stay with it my friend.

A few years ago, I was told by a good player something that started me to really think about safeties. I kept leaving the six or the seven playing 9-ball and that I could still win if I would just duck once I got too far out of line, instead of trying to recover so much. I was like you, leaving a little strong after making a 4 or 5 balls.

SO, it took me like 3 months before I actually tried to do just that. All of a sudden I was winning games again, instead of giving someone else a three ball run. Anyway, getting out of line a little is one thing, but once you get out of line a lot check out all your options. It worked for me.
 
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