Sell Gold Crown IV? Buy Diamond?

side pocket angles

My name is Greg founder of Diamond. I of course would be proud to sell you a Diamond , but that's not the main reason for this post. You're problem on the goldcrown side pocket can be fixed with a very knowledgeable mechanic like Ernesto Domingis. What's required is changing the facing ANGLE. The angle should be closer to parallel, as the facing angle directs the object ball to the other facing. I made a similar mistake earlier in my career on a few Diamond tables. The correct angle should not interfere with a ball being pocketed on the side pockets of a pool table. If you get the ball thru the gate it should go. This is not the case on a corner pocket. The facing angle is very critical and has to be ajusted according to the pocket opening! The facing angle on a corner pocket determines how far up the rail a ball can contac and not jar. Other factors also affect corner pocket tuffness as humidity, dirt, cloth wear and speed while shooting. You can call me at 812-989-6665 and I'll be able to explain better.
 
I think part of your problem is a bad install. The first thing I noticed when looking at your picture is the cloth in the pocket.There shouldn't be large cuts in the cloth anywhere in the pockets,all the staples should be on the bottum of the wood backing not in the pockets.Where they chip balls are scratch your hands.And the crease on the face pads is caused by not cutting away excess cloth.
 
NoBull9 said:
I think part of your problem is a bad install. The first thing I noticed when looking at your picture is the cloth in the pocket.
Click to expand...

The other thing I noticed (which I very much doubt makes a difference to your problem but I'm just venting here) is that large gap where the pocket iron meets the rail. I've seen this before on a brand-new GCIV and cannot understand how Brunswick can make a product with such poor tolerances and/or design that allows this to happen on what is supposed to be their premiere professional table.
 
DCP,
How cool is AZBilliards??? You ask a question about a table, and the president of the company offers to help.

Kudo's to Greg for manufacturing a great product, for promoting the DCC, and for contributing here on AZB.
 
The casting can be adjusted from the bottom of the table.Remove the pockets loosen the bolts that attach the castings to the rails and adust.It looks to me the casting need to be pushed forward and down.Simple fix.Again the installer just didn't take his time and from the look of the cloth in the pockets it doesn't surprise me.
 
but the installer/mechanic is one of the best, from what Williebetmore and Mark Wilson have told me. Mark Wilson told me he was one of the few in the states he would completely trust to work on his tables.

now i dont know what to do about this...........

DCP
 
I've been in the billiards industie for about 17 years.I've worked on just about every make of pool tables out there.And never would have I left a pocket looking like that. I don't know if the person or person's where having a bad day or what we all have bad days.I'm just saying it's not the type work I would leave behind.The cloth in the pocket looks bad,those cuts in the cloth should not be there in the pockets.The casting is not installed the correct way and these are only the things I can see from your picture.Just asking did they reuse the cloth on the table or was it new cloth.If it is cloth that was being restretched then I might can under stand why the cloth is cut the way it is in the pocket.
 
this installer/mechanic (from Orner Billiards in Indy) did the cloth when i bought the table brand new. he also recovered it in Electric Blue, and then the currect Powder Blue.

every time it looks the same, with the crease in the cloth in the middle of the side pocket facing. he has told me thats the way it HAS TO BE DONE on this table!

thats why i would like to see a pic of Williebetmore's GCIV side pockets, i believe he uses the same mechanic. and again, this mechanic is considered one of the best from what everyone tells me. and IIRC, Jeanette Lee's cousin was the guy helping him the last time he was down - unless they were just telling me this as a joke, but the guy was oriental looking.

DCP
 
Post 21 Says It All

Re-Read post #21....That is your most correct answer.

Look at the angle your pocket is cut....now imagine a a ball hitting at from any kind of steep angle...It is going to spit it out not in...The steeper the angle the worse it spits it out...All the GCs I have played on play do the same thing.

The crease I would be less worried about, but it could have an effect....(especailly if the crease is slightly "below" the equater of the ball...could cause a upward deflection angle.

If the guy is telling you that is the only way it can be done, it is becuause that is the only way "he" knows how to do it.

I have a GC and it is not done the way yours is....There is a "verticle" fold in the cloth, but the impact area is smooth.

Sell the GC....get a "D"
 
so, if the facing angle is the problem, and since it is somewhat open now and causing balls to pop out, would it be reasonable to assume some type of shim could be installed on the side pockets? thereby closing up the facing angles and making the side pockets more parallel and thus direct balls into the pockets instead of spitting them back out?

or is that a really stupid idea?

DCP
 
DrCue'sProtege said:
this installer/mechanic (from Orner Billiards in Indy) did the cloth when i bought the table brand new. he also recovered it in Electric Blue, and then the currect Powder Blue.

every time it looks the same, with the crease in the cloth in the middle of the side pocket facing. he has told me thats the way it HAS TO BE DONE on this table!

thats why i would like to see a pic of Williebetmore's GCIV side pockets, i believe he uses the same mechanic. and again, this mechanic is considered one of the best from what everyone tells me. and IIRC, Jeanette Lee's cousin was the guy helping him the last time he was down - unless they were just telling me this as a joke, but the guy was oriental looking.

DCP
Click to expand...

You might want to talk to the mechanic and give them the opportunity to fix it, especially now that you have stated their name. If they have such a good reputation, maybe it was a fluke, and maybe they'd want to make it right. Now that you've stated their name, it would be good to give them a chance to prove themselves, in case you're hurting their rep unfairly. :cool:

Edit: I know you asked him about the crease, but I was assuming you hadn't told him about the balls spitting out. Sorry if I'm wrong about that.
 
Last edited:
never mentioned his name at all.........

and he's been told twice about the problem i perceive i have with my side pockets spitting out balls, and the crease in the middle of the facing.

DCP
 
DrCue'sProtege said:
never mentioned his name at all.........

and he's been told twice about the problem i perceive i have with my side pockets spitting out balls, and the crease in the middle of the facing.

DCP
Click to expand...

Sorry, my mistake. I thought when you said Orner Billiards in Indy you were referring to the mechanic's company, but I must have misunderstood. (Moot point anyway since you already told them.)

You could do the shimming you were talking about, although shimming gives that un-natural bounce sometimes when you hit the facing in the pocket or on a bank at the end of the cushion. If that doesn't bother you, you could have them shimmed. Although I'm not sure how they change the cut angle with a shim. There must be a wedge-shaped shim instead of a regular facing pad?

You also might want to consider tightening the pockets & changing the cut angle by recushioning. They cut the cushion longer instead of adding shims. That may be more than you'd like to do if you didn't need new cushions in the first place. Although, not as bad as replacing the entire table.
 
Last edited:
DrCue'sProtege said:
so, if the facing angle is the problem, and since it is somewhat open now and causing balls to pop out, would it be reasonable to assume some type of shim could be installed on the side pockets? thereby closing up the facing angles and making the side pockets more parallel and thus direct balls into the pockets instead of spitting them back out?

or is that a really stupid idea?

DCP
Click to expand...


Absolutly...(If it is done right) As a matter of fact, the same can apply on corner pockets that are 5" buckets that have a wide facing angle...The pockets are huge but effectivly they are the same size because if you hit the facing the ball pops out due to the angle of the cut....where as 4.5 inch pockets that are cut to where the facing feeds the ball into the pocket play like 5" pockets.....

4.5 inch pockects that are cut right just look scary.....However....4.5 inch pockets that are cut wrong....are a joke to play on...

Example of Good Table

4.5" pockets in the back room at Shooters in Riverside.....Those tables were done right and although they "look" scary really play exactly the way a table should...

4.5" Diamond Smart table believe it or not actually "seems" to play on the loose side to me...(balls seem to suck in to the pockets)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top