Shoulder injuries

uwate

daydreaming about pool
Silver Member
I have been experiencing pain in my shoulder so I went to an ortho doc and they did an MRI. Turns out I have a tendon in my shoulder (supraspinatus tendon) that is nearly torn in half. Doc said 70%+ is torn. They are sending me to another doc who does shoulder surgeries next week to render an opinion, although the first doc said he is just about positive I will need surgery or I will continue to experience pain and eventually develop severe arthritis in my shoulder.

Has anyone had shoulder surgery? How long is the recovery time? How did it affect your pool game?
 
I broke my collarbone last Jan. and had surgery to fix it. Was about 4 mos. before my game was back to normal. I couldn't lift my arm above my head for about 2 mos. My game is fine now but I was definitely sore in my traps and neck area those first several weeks back at the table.
 
I had shoulder surgery in 1996. My arm kept popping out of the socket, so I had capsular reconstruction surgery. Not to bum you out, but the healing process SUCKED!!!! I wasn't that into pool at that point in my life, so couldn't tell you how it would have affected my game. I did have really limited range of movement, and it took a lot of (very painful) physical therapy to get back to normal.

But I could have had a totally different type of surgery than you.
 
I had rotator cuff surgery about 9 years ago. Fortunately, it was my left shoulder. Reaching out with my left hand to place my bridge was quite painful for about 2 months. At first, I would put my hand down near the rail, and then "walk" my hand across the table with my fingers.
The best suggestion is to DO THE PT, regardless of how much you want to skip it. It will get you back to normal in the shortest period of time.
Good Luck.
Steve
 
uwate said:
I have been experiencing pain in my shoulder so I went to an ortho doc and they did an MRI. Turns out I have a tendon in my shoulder (supraspinatus tendon) that is nearly torn in half. Doc said 70%+ is torn. They are sending me to another doc who does shoulder surgeries next week to render an opinion, although the first doc said he is just about positive I will need surgery or I will continue to experience pain and eventually develop severe arthritis in my shoulder.

Has anyone had shoulder surgery? How long is the recovery time? How did it affect your pool game?

How did you tear it Dave?

Outer shoulder muscle aches when I play too long but goes away most of the time.
JoeyA
 
I broke my right collarbone last summer (right before the APA NTC for Masters). Although it was a clean break, it hasn't healed properly and my doctor now recommends surgery. At the same time I broke the collarbone, I tore my left rotator cuff. It isn't that bad a tear, but it hurts like hell when I play more than two hours at a time (Steve, I know and feel your pain about the walking bridge fingers). The doctor also recommends surgery for the rotator cuff, but I just haven't been able to schedule it yet (I'm doing the rotator cuff first). It took about 4 months to be able to play decent after the collarbone broke (although I was hitting balls VERY softly after around 3 weeks).

-djb
 
uwate said:
I have been experiencing pain in my shoulder so I went to an ortho doc and they did an MRI. Turns out I have a tendon in my shoulder (supraspinatus tendon) that is nearly torn in half. Doc said 70%+ is torn. They are sending me to another doc who does shoulder surgeries next week to render an opinion, although the first doc said he is just about positive I will need surgery or I will continue to experience pain and eventually develop severe arthritis in my shoulder.

Has anyone had shoulder surgery? How long is the recovery time? How did it affect your pool game?


Dave,
I had a full tear in my left rotator cuff and waited 15 days before I saw a Dr. He did surgery the next day and my left shoulder is probably the strongest part of my body. It never hurts and I hit my heavybag almost every day and have never had any problem.
Pool wise, I could not bridge with my left arm, so I played left handed for about 6 weeks until my left arm got out of the sling. I never missed a day on the table and now look at it as a blessing because I'm so comfortable shooting southpaw.

If it needs fixed, get it fixed and over with. It probably won't heal on its own. Doc said mine looked shredded, like the bottom of frayed blue jean pants legs. But now, it's perfect. Never hurts at all.

Best of luck to you David.
 
David,
That's just wrong! Right collarbone and left rotator cuff at the same time! I thought I had it bad this summer...was in a truck that took a trip off the highway, down an embankment and into a tree. Broke two ribs, but didn't know they were broken until I went to the pool room a couple of weeks later. Won the lag, broke, screamed, put my cue away and forfeited! I'm still not at 100%, but I'm learning to use a soft controlled break quite well!
Steve
 
Dave,
If it is something that you need go ahead and do it. You will have some recovery time but they have come so far with the way they do things in just the last ten years. My father had hernia surgery years ago and they kept him in the hospital for 2-3 weeks, last year I had mine and I went home that day and a week and a half later I was back at the table, soft breaking of course but still I was playing. for what its worth.

good luck
 
JoeyA said:
How did you tear it Dave?

Outer shoulder muscle aches when I play too long but goes away most of the time.
JoeyA

I'm not sure actually. One morning I woke up and I was really hurting in my shoulder. It healed up in about 4 weeks but I noticed my range of motion wasnt as good since it hurt to bring my arm above my shoulder. I have noticed though that I cannot break the balls at the same velocity at what I use to break them 10 years ago.
 
I had a three hour rotator cuff/tendon repair surgery of my right shoulder in April 2006 (I shoot right handed). I was back playing one pocket in June of that year, but I am just now able to really jack up on a ball and hit it with power. I would say I was 90% as early as August of last year but I still have issues with hitting some balls jacked up in the stack, it is really a matter of being able to get my shoulder up high enough and still having the power to effectively compelete the stroke. I would say I am now at 99%, I only run into a shot every couple of weeks that is really difficult to execute due to my stiff shoulder. I am still doing my therapy and my shoulder no longer has any pain but it is still relatively stiff and I have to work it out a bit before playing. Sorry for the long message, good luck with your shoulder.

-don
 
uwate said:
I have been experiencing pain in my shoulder so I went to an ortho doc and they did an MRI. Turns out I have a tendon in my shoulder (supraspinatus tendon) that is nearly torn in half. Doc said 70%+ is torn. They are sending me to another doc who does shoulder surgeries next week to render an opinion, although the first doc said he is just about positive I will need surgery or I will continue to experience pain and eventually develop severe arthritis in my shoulder.

Has anyone had shoulder surgery? How long is the recovery time? How did it affect your pool game?

What the heck?
I just had an MRI done last month on my shoulder. My supraspinatus is torn too. I'm going in for Surgery on the 7th of November :|
 
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uwate said:
I'm not sure actually. One morning I woke up and I was really hurting in my shoulder. It healed up in about 4 weeks but I noticed my range of motion wasnt as good since it hurt to bring my arm above my shoulder. I have noticed though that I cannot break the balls at the same velocity at what I use to break them 10 years ago.


Several years ago, I too woke up with my left shoulder hurting when I tried to lift my hand above my shoulder height. My range of motion was limited and got worse each day. I thought I had strained a muscle or something and since it did not hurt unless I lifted it above my shoulder I simply quit lifting it above my shoulder.

After several days of this, I was doing practically everything with my right hand. As long as I didn't lift my hand above my shoulder - no pain so I stayed with that for about two weeks or so and finally the light bulb went on; I wasn't getting any better. If I tried to touch my face with my left hand I had pain in my shoulder. I decided to visit a Chiropractor and he took xrays and decided that I had fibrotic muscles in my shoulder. He offered two treatments: 1. Send me to the hospital where they would give me some local anesthesia and break the muscles apart without pain but with the anesthesia (he wouldn't do that job :-) . 2. I could visit him on twice a week and he would provide therapy and break the fibrotic muscles apart without anesthesia. He must have known I had an aversion toward anesthesia and known that I was a pool player (masochistic) so I chose his method and for multiple visits, the very short periods of time where he gradually broke the muscles apart by hand, I had some of the most excruciating pain, ever. No more recurring fibrotic muscles, no more pain, except a little aching when I shoot more than 40 hours a week. :p

Best of luck with the shoulder. (I told my long story, because your symptons were similar to mine) :eek:
JoeyA
 
uwate said:
I have been experiencing pain in my shoulder so I went to an ortho doc and they did an MRI. Turns out I have a tendon in my shoulder (supraspinatus tendon) that is nearly torn in half. Doc said 70%+ is torn. They are sending me to another doc who does shoulder surgeries next week to render an opinion, although the first doc said he is just about positive I will need surgery or I will continue to experience pain and eventually develop severe arthritis in my shoulder.

Has anyone had shoulder surgery? How long is the recovery time? How did it affect your pool game?
Prolotherapy is an alternative to surgery. Look it up on the net. You might try doing the physical therapy before the surgery instead of afterward. Tendons don't imo get worn through unless there is too much tension in that spot which would always be caused by bones (back, neck, collarbone, arm bone, shoulder blade, hip) being out of place and unable to realign properly.

The surgeon I saw said an operation would fix my shoulder at least by the third time he operated. He couldn't guarantee fixing it the first time because some peoples tendons "stretch". That's kinda like saying new guitar strings stretch out of tune - they don't. The stretching is just cause it's pulling tighter somewhere else, i.e. around the tuning peg, or your neck and back.

A poster last year said we all needed to work out more to fix our shoulder problems. He was right imo. There are too many shoulder excersizes I do for me to remember them and list them all right now. I do as many of them as I can and do it religiously.

There are joints in your body most people are not aware of like the sterno clavicular ( and every bone in your back and neck )that can cause all kinds of problems. Just because you feel the problem in your shoulder doesn't mean it is caused by the shoulder. You are falling apart and that's where the tension is. Playing pool will try and pull everything out of line. To fix it it has to be put back. Chiropractors can be great short term help. Working out is the long term answer imo.

unknownpro
 
I am an orthopedic physical therapist, and work with a number of shoulder specialists. I have seen hundreds of RTC repairs. The supraspinatus tendon accounts for 90% of all RTC tears due to its location under the acromion (a bone coming off of the shoulder blade). When the biomechanics of the shoulder become suspect, which can occur for a number of reasons, the humeral head (the ball that goes into the shoulder socket) tends to rise up into the acromion, impinging the supraspinatus between the two bones when you try to raise your arm overhead. This is like rubbing a rock over a rope over and over again. Eventually it will fray and tear. It can of course also happen traumatically, but you said you just woke up with the pain.

Research suggests that tears of less than 50% thickness have a chance of improving with conservative treatment such as physical therapy. If you can gain enough strength from the other 3 RTC muscles, then they may be able to control the humeral head without the full strength of the supraspinatus. These chances diminish the larger the tear is, and the more overhead type activity you do. MRI's are certainly not completely accurate, so it can be difficult to fully tell how large of a tear you have. An MRI arthrogram is actually a more accurate test. If you actually are torn at 70%, you will probably require surgical intervention to regain pain free use of the arm. If it is a full thickness tear (torn all the way through the tendon), you will definately need surgery. Some docs will elect to try PT first if they think there is a chance that it will work, or if they want you to have improved range of motion or strength before the surgery, others will skip that and just do surgery if the tear size is at all significant.

Prognosis can vary with size of tear. Smaller tears can be pushed in rehab much faster than large ones. Assuming a medium to large tear, your prognosis would be as follows:
-6 weeks in a sling (Fairly standard, although some docs differ)
-Passive movement only of the shoulder for the most part during those first 6 wks.
-Around 8 wks you can begin to use the arm for regular daily activities that do not include any weight over 3 or so pounds.
-12 wks until you can raise your arm overhead without weight using normal shoulder biomechanics (this can vary either way by a few weeks depending on the case)
-16-20 wks before fairly strong recovery or physical use of the arm for job type activities.
-Discharge from PT between 12-20 wks depending on job activity, size of tear and a few other factors.
-The repair heals into the bone solidly at 6-8 wks. It is like concrete though, in that it will continue to heal by about 7% a month throughout the next year, with strength gains continuing throughout that time.
-Regarding pool. I would generally advise against any pool until at least 8-12 wks, and then sparingly. If it is your bridge arm, it may take longer as that position tends to impinge the shoulder. You really can not bare any weight on the arm until 9-10 wks also. When you start, it should be slowly.
-The worst thing I see people do that coming alon quickly is over do it. You will irritate the secondary stabilizers of the shoulder such as the bicep, so listen to what your PT tells you about activity modification.
-Normal concerns: Almost everyone has some biceps tendonitis with the surgery because it helps the RTC stabilize the shoulder. Until the RTC becomes strong enough, the biceps will shoulder the whole load. It is normal to have some, but important to keep in check. Most people feel pretty good after 2-3 wks. Be aware that after 6 wks when you start to use the arm actively again, it will get sore. Do not be woried, it is normal.

The best shoulder surgeon in the country is not tooo far away from you. A guy named Dr. James Andrews works out of (founded) The American Sports Medicine Institute in Birmingham, Al. I referenced some ex's for the shoulder from their web site (www. asmi.org) in a thread a while ago. There is a group of ex's called the "throwers ten". They are really for a healthy shoulder though, although some of the primary one you should do are on there (never over head ex in your current condition). If you would like to know swhich ones specifically, I can let youknow. I would advise though, that if you have a 70% tear, any ex should be monitored by an experienced professional at first, as doing them wrong can make it worse.

As stated by the above poster, neck problems can cause shoulder symptoms. However, if you have a positive MRI for a tear, it is most likely coming fro myour shoulder, especially if youdo not have a history of neck problems.

If you have any other questions or concerns that I did not address, feel free to PM me, or ask me here. Sorry sooo long.
 
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uwate said:
I have been experiencing pain in my shoulder so I went to an ortho doc and they did an MRI. Turns out I have a tendon in my shoulder (supraspinatus tendon) that is nearly torn in half. Doc said 70%+ is torn. They are sending me to another doc who does shoulder surgeries next week to render an opinion, although the first doc said he is just about positive I will need surgery or I will continue to experience pain and eventually develop severe arthritis in my shoulder.

Has anyone had shoulder surgery? How long is the recovery time? How did it affect your pool game?


I have had both shoulders operated on. On both they did what is called an Acromioplasty with a distal clavacle resectioning. it has been very successful for me. The only problem i still have is that i have 2 nerves in the left side of my neck that are pinched and cause pain from the neck to the elbow at times. They want me to go see a neurosurgeon to correct this problem...no way... at least not right now.. If i remember correctly i went to physical therapy 3 times a week for about 5-6 weeks......mike
 
An acromioplasty is not as involved as a RTC repair. They just shave down the acromion and clavicle a little bit. Requires ROM and strengthening after, but nothing actually has to heal like it does with a RTC repair. An acromioplasty requires somewhere around half the rehab of a RTC repair.

I would not wait too long on the neck. Of the things that can cause those symptoms, some can get worse if ignored leading to surgeries such as a cervical fusion. Also, you really don't want pressure on those nerves anymore than absolutely necessary. Often times P.T. or epidural shots can really help.
 
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I've been having some relatively serious discomfort/pain in my left (bridge arm) shoulder for a couple of months, and recently in my right (stroke arm) shoulder. I figured it was possibly arthritis setting in (I'm 65), and was taking Advil for the pain. I started to worry about taking the ibuprofen for too long, so I went to the doctor. He gave me a shot of cortisone in my left shoulder, and the pain subsided after a few days, but it has not gone away completely.

I joined this thread because I'd like to keep informed about this condition.

Thanks,

Mikie
 
rotor cuff

uwate said:
I have been experiencing pain in my shoulder so I went to an ortho doc and they did an MRI. Turns out I have a tendon in my shoulder (supraspinatus tendon) that is nearly torn in half. Doc said 70%+ is torn. They are sending me to another doc who does shoulder surgeries next week to render an opinion, although the first doc said he is just about positive I will need surgery or I will continue to experience pain and eventually develop severe arthritis in my shoulder.

Has anyone had shoulder surgery? How long is the recovery time? How did it affect your pool game?

Check out a book entitled The 10 Minute Rotor Cuff Solution. It includes exercises for prevention as well as therapy. A deltoid routine using dumbells could also strengthen the shoulders. Many books strongly advise against behind the neck presses & upright rows. Don't overlook stretching routines.

Pool definitely stresses the shoulders.
 
Behind the neck presses are a cardinal sin for RTC issues. I would also avoid upright rows, so I think that is good advice.

Deltoid exercises will improve shoulder strength, but can be contraindicated when RTC impingement is involved. The most common ex for the deltoids is lateral raises (raising the arm straight to the side until it reaches shoulder height). There is a bump on the lateral (outside) portion of the humeral head (the ball that goes into the shoulder socket) called the greater tuberosity where 3 of the 4 RTC muscles insert. When the arm is raised to the side, this bump will come into contact with the acromion (part of the shoulder blade that goes over the supraspinatus tendon) between 60 and 90 degrees impinging the RTC. We generally avoid this movement with RTC injuries. When raising your arm straight forward, thebump stays to the side of the acromion, and is generally less painful. All over head ex should be avoided!!!

RTC and shoulder blade ex's performed correctly are really the answer though (assuming the RTC is not torn too much. If it is, you could actually make it worse).
 
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