Steve Davis' future in nine ball

[Colin Colenso]

Boro ? Any comments ???

Dave

I forget the exact ruling on snooker jumpshots.

I know you cannot jump directly over the ball snookering, but I believe you can jump over edges of red balls to get an angle on other red balls.

Or hit down on the cue ball so that it kicks the OB into the air and over the edge of another ball.

Also the CB can jump from the OB over another ball.

Not sure though on the exact wording of the rule..and too tired to google right now.

 

[thecardman]

There are NO jump shots in snooker. You cannot even jump the object ball over the edge of another ball. If the cueball contacts the object ball and the cueball then goes airbourne, then that's a different matter. If you are hooked - sorry, snookered - then you need to go off the rails or swerve the cueball to contact the object ball. And, no you cannot play a jump shot off the rail and over the ball that is in the way.

The BREAK shot...

The reason Davis doesn't have a big break is because he feels it could damage his regular playing stroke (I spoke with him a few months ago about this). We all know that the stroke and body movement involved in the break goes against everything that is taught to us when playing shots in the course of a rack - especially those of us in the UK who are taught the basics by snooker players. Davis has been playing snooker too long for him to try and learn how to break without it damaging the stroke for his main source of income - snooker. Sure, so we can sit here and discuss Davis' play in 9-Ball, but we have to remember that he is, has and always shall be, first and foremost, a snooker player. That's where his main income comes from. Having said that, NOBODY in the UK should ever forget the amount of work Davis has put into publicising 9-Ball over here and, for that, he should forever be thanked.

Tony Drago won the World Pool Masters and was a semi-finalist in the WPC and anyone who watches him can see has has little idea about how to play 9-ball.

I, too, have to completely disagree with this. It was well documented that Drago practiced long and hard with the likes of Imran Majid and Steve Knight, 2 of the UK's best out-and-out 9-ball players, for several weeks between the end of the snooker season and the World 9-Ball Championships in preparation for the tournament at the Riley's club in Victoria, London. Drago knows his way around an American Pool table very well as his results a couple of years ago showed. You don't get that far in the Worlds or win the World Masters by luck alone.

Just my thoughts on the topic.

 

[LastTwo]

Since you know next to nothing about actually playing this game, and have been proven wrong on virtually every one of your asinine opinions and posts, why do you bother? Maybe for once, you should simply STFU and let the experience players actually post. And "experience" means that we've actually been there and done that, away from their little pond. Swim away, little fish.

Fred

LOL I thought I was the only person who thought this way of WW.

 

[LastTwo]

Apart from the break I would say the deep screw (draw) shot and breaking into the reds off the blue, or more off the black require much more power than any other shot I can think of in 9 ball? For one thing the tables are bigger and 9 ball napless clothes are probably quicker under tournmanet conditions, maybe. As for snooker players rarely using side, not sure where that came from? Isn't it called "English" in America?

I saw some shots that he made in the WPC that where still fabulous technique and many of the top pool players would have struggled to make or played differently. Still he seems to make the simple look hard and the hard look difficult. This probably means he's thinking too much and just doesn't have the knowledge that some of the pool players have.

BTW
Considering Earl is supposed to be one of the greatest shot makers in pool it was sad to see him miss so many easy balls on the tight pockets.

Snooker players don't use much side, as in when they do, it's like 1/2 a tip and they rarely use it on power shots. Craig from what I've seen you are a very strong 9-ball player, did you mainly play snooker before? If so please elaborate on any adaptations or changes you had to make in your game. Also about Earl, when he is on, yes he is one of the best shotmakers, when his game is off he struggles just as bad as anyone. When he was gambling he would probably give you the 5 ball...have a little more respect for the dude. As for Steve Davis, he doesn't have a power stroke, plain and simple. He strikes the CB very solid but his game is not suited for 9-ball.

 

[jjinfla]

Since you know next to nothing about actually playing this game, and have been proven wrong on virtually every one of your asinine opinions and posts, why do you bother? Maybe for once, you should simply STFU and let the experience players actually post. And "experience" means that we've actually been there and done that, away from their little pond. Swim away, little fish.

Fred

Is this really the mild mannered Fred we all know?

Must be an imposter.

Surely not the Fred that writes in BD.

Sounds like you are having a bad day.

I suppose only you and Colin know anything.

STFU? Really Fred. To Whitewolf? Really Fred? Now go sit in a corner and take your medicine.

Fred will forever be known as the boy who was sharked by a SL2 and lost his cool. LOL

And Davis doesn't have to worry about his 9-ball game because last heard he is buying slow cloth for his table and switching to 8-ball.

Jake

 

[Boro Nut]

... Jumping is illegal in snooker ....Boro ? Any comments ???

It's allowed before or after, but not during the shot. Jumping in conjunction with saying 'Woo-Woo' is frowned upon, but not technically illegal, unlike saying 'Awsome', which you are not allowed to say under any circumstances because it's not true and therefore classifies as ungentlemanly conduct. Nobody knows what Woo-woo means, so it can't technically be untrue.

Boro Nut

 

[Fred Agnir]

I suppose only you and Colin know anything.

Why do people have to say crap like this? Do you really mean to misrepresent my position? I'm talking about one fool who over and over shows he's just know-nothing who stalks my posts. Did I say anything about anyone else? I didn't think so.

Do YOU think that Whitewolf has ever shown that he knows anything about this game? Do YOU think that Whitewolf has shown a propensity to be an absolute empty noggin head on many topics?

STFU? Really Fred. To Whitewolf? Really Fred? Now go sit in a corner and take your medicine.

You don't think that idiot who has lied about me over and over deserves it? "Take your medicine"??? Another 3rd grade reply.

Fred will forever be known as the boy who was sharked by a SL2 and lost his cool. LOL

First, you obviously don't know jack shit about me. I will absolutely never take anyone's lies and mistruths about me lightly. And WW has been doing it for years. He's a fool. Are you his fan?

And second, are you saying WW is an SL-2? It would make sense, but I'm sure he said he was a better player than that.

Fred

 

[LastTwo]

Is this really the mild mannered Fred we all know?

Must be an imposter.

Surely not the Fred that writes in BD.

Sounds like you are having a bad day.

I suppose only you and Colin know anything.

STFU? Really Fred. To Whitewolf? Really Fred? Now go sit in a corner and take your medicine.

Fred will forever be known as the boy who was sharked by a SL2 and lost his cool. LOL

And Davis doesn't have to worry about his 9-ball game because last heard he is buying slow cloth for his table and switching to 8-ball.

Jake

I heard WW is an oompa loompa. That's enough to shark anyone.

 

[TheOne]

Snooker players don't use much side, as in when they do, it's like 1/2 a tip and they rarely use it on power shots. Craig from what I've seen you are a very strong 9-ball player, did you mainly play snooker before? If so please elaborate on any adaptations or changes you had to make in your game. Also about Earl, when he is on, yes he is one of the best shotmakers, when his game is off he struggles just as bad as anyone. When he was gambling he would probably give you the 5 ball...have a little more respect for the dude. As for Steve Davis, he doesn't have a power stroke, plain and simple. He strikes the CB very solid but his game is not suited for 9-ball.

I didn't reach a high level in snooker because I gave it up to go to university but I was the first kid in the UK to do a government sponsored training scheme and play snooker full time. I would say though that I played 8 ball pool just as much and probably played pool better than snooker. I played with side most shots in snooker, all shots. For example if a red was near the side rail and you had no shot other than a deep screw you would use side to help pull the cb back to baulk if it was off straight and you had to use the rail. A more powerful stroke needed than anything in 9 ball (except the break of course).

As for Earl, his record speaks for itself and I respect what's he's done for sure, prob second only to Efren in recent times. I don't care much for how he behaves but that wasn't why I said what I said. I said it because that's what I saw, I have watched a number of games of his live and up close recently and I was dissapointed. It doesn't mean he wasn't a great player before! As for him giving me the 5, I would take that from anyone in the world today so I would have loved it from Earl, alt break of course But then I could prob have given him a 50 start at Snooker but so what?

This snooker v pool topic comes up frequently on here and the pure pool players with no history in snooker become very defensive. Totally understandable as it sounds like snooker players are being elitist. I just think its almost impossible to compare the two sports unless you have played them both and seen the best players at both. Players like Tony Crosby, Johl Younger and
Mark Grey who has taken the UK tour by storm are probably good people to ask. There was a snooker player in Thailand (English guy) who was one of the best potters I have ever seen and he went over to the US with a stake horse and I think he beat every player for cash in the Washington DC area and he had only been playing 9 ball for a very short time (Although I don't think he played any pro's).

To me its not rocket science. If I was shooting at a barn door all day and another guy was shooting at targets a mile away then he's probably going to be a better shot than me. So what, so snooker players pot better, it doesn't make them better 9 ball players. Interestingly I played a game of snooker the other day for the first time this year, I couldn't pot a ball hardly and I was shocked at just how tight the pockets are. Playing 9 ball has certainly affected my potting accuracy without question. But I love pool and think there are so many aspects to it that snooker players simply can't adapt too. Personally though I consider myself just as much an ex pool player as an ex snooker player so hopefully I can adapt?

 

[BRKNRUN]

Nobody knows what Woo-woo means, so it can't technically be untrue.

Boro Nut

Woo is statement that comes from the Woobird.... A Woobird is a relative of the Weebird.

A woobird is a bird that repeatedly sticks it's head up it's ass and says "Woo, its dark up here"

If you really want to know I can tell you what a Weebird is....

 

[LastTwo]

I didn't reach a high level in snooker because I gave it up to go to university but I was the first kid in the UK to do a government sponsored training scheme and play snooker full time. I would say though that I played 8 ball pool just as much and probably played pool better than snooker. I played with side most shots in snooker, all shots. For example if a red was near the side rail and you had no shot other than a deep screw you would use side to help pull the cb back to baulk if it was off straight and you had to use the rail. A more powerful stroke needed than anything in 9 ball (except the break of course).

As for Earl, his record speaks for itself and I respect what's he's done for sure, prob second only to Efren in recent times. I don't care much for how he behaves but that wasn't why I said what I said. I said it because that's what I saw, I have watched a number of games of his live and up close recently and I was dissapointed. It doesn't mean he wasn't a great player before! As for him giving me the 5, I would take that from anyone in the world today so I would have loved it from Earl, alt break of course But then I could prob have given him a 50 start at Snooker but so what?

This snooker v pool topic comes up frequently on here and the pure pool players with no history in snooker become very defensive. Totally understandable as it sounds like snooker players are being elitist. I just think its almost impossible to compare the two sports unless you have played them both and seen the best players at both. Players like Tony Crosby, Johl Younger and
Mark Grey who has taken the UK tour by storm are probably good people to ask. There was a snooker player in Thailand (English guy) who was one of the best potters I have ever seen and he went over to the US with a stake horse and I think he beat every player for cash in the Washington DC area and he had only been playing 9 ball for a very short time (Although I don't think he played any pro's).

To me its not rocket science. If I was shooting at a barn door all day and another guy was shooting at targets a mile away then he's probably going to be a better shot than me. So what, so snooker players pot better, it doesn't make them better 9 ball players. Interestingly I played a game of snooker the other day for the first time this year, I couldn't pot a ball hardly and I was shocked at just how tight the pockets are. Playing 9 ball has certainly affected my potting accuracy without question. But I love pool and think there are so many aspects to it that snooker players simply can't adapt too. Personally though I consider myself just as much an ex pool player as an ex snooker player so hopefully I can adapt?

Craig the 5-ball statement was an exaggeration because I think that at your level nobody can really give you that, not even Efren. I was just making a jab because I thought you were insulting Americans potting ability. As for snooker players successfully making a transition to pool, I think it's safe to say that all of them do not have the classical snooker stances and strokes. The classical snooker stance and stroke is incredibly delicate and lacks rythm (with the exception of a few, like O'Sullivan who has a fantastic stroke). 9-ball is supposedly a rythm game and a power game and snooker is more of a touch game with delicacy and obviously some power but not as much as 9-ball, most would say.

 

[Nick B]

Snooker Players Can Play

I profess to play a bit of both. Mainly pool with a little snooker rolled in for nostalgia. It's true that most snooker purest teach the virtues of no "side" (English)... but the reality is that most can and do use a lot of spin on quite a few shots. It's not just about the up and down plane.

Watch AF shoot a ball that's almost straight (More than 3/4 Ball Full). 8 out of 10 times she "spins it in". KC almost never does. I also agree with Mr. One. Don't play snooker for about two months and the table looks real big and the pockets awfully small.

For what it's worth I have never seen Fred or WW shoot. Fred can play. WW is clueless. The Q&A says it all. IMHO.

Go watch Ronnie 'O Sullivan run 147 in 5 minutes. Anyone who still thinks the man couldn't compete at the highest level of pool needs his medication adjusted.


Snooker players don't play alot of 3 rail power inside shoots. The accuracy required is huge ... the colors are a problem ... the distance involved is huge
30+ feet of travel. For that matter due to the construction of the rails check (inside) doesn't work nearly as well on snooker rails.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/olmedia/1605000/video/_1605368_osullivan147_vi.ram

 

[X Breaker]

I think it is very difficult to draw a ball back 7 feet on a snooker table. I find it easier to do so on the 9 foot. Is it just my stroke?
With regard to spin/english, the ball is bigger in 9 ball and it reacts differently from the snooker balls when spin/english is applied. I am sure snooker players will have problem adjusting to the reaction of the object ball, and the height of the table, and the condition of the cloth...etc when switching to 9 ball.
I watched Steve Davis practised for about half an hour when I saw him in the WPC. I think he is a world class player. He was doing a lot of things with his cue which totally amazed me.
Perhaps he pays a lot of attention to his stroke and cueing action and that is why he looks a bit uncomfortable. But I think he is very confident at the table and he is capable of making a power shot if he wants to. I was also told that he has a Gold Crown 4 at home which he spends a lot of time on practising.

 

[Colin Colenso]

It's allowed before or after, but not during the shot. Jumping in conjunction with saying 'Woo-Woo' is frowned upon, but not technically illegal, unlike saying 'Awsome', which you are not allowed to say under any circumstances because it's not true and therefore classifies as ungentlemanly conduct. Nobody knows what Woo-woo means, so it can't technically be untrue.

Boro Nut

The exactl rule for snooker jump shots is:

9. Jump shots are illegal in International Snooker. It is a foul if the striker intentionally causes the cue ball to jump (rise from the bed of the table) by any means, if the jump is an effort to clear an obstructing ball.
It is a shame this rule does not clarify if this obstructing ball can be obstructing the OB and not the CB, but it seems to infer it. I know I used to play this shot type of jump shot occassionally to get past a slightly blocking edge of a secondary ball. Probably illegal but the referees I had didn't seem to know what I was doing or what the proper ruling should be.

At the higher levels, I suspect they clamp down on this.

Anyway, I never played snooker competitions very seriously, a few seasons of league and a few tournaments. I grew up with a snooker table and played a lot of english billiards on it in my youth with some occassional snooker and pool. Later I got serious about english 8-ball but I used snooker drills a lot to hone my skills.

 

[Colin Colenso]

I, too, have to completely disagree with this. It was well documented that Drago practiced long and hard with the likes of Imran Majid and Steve Knight, 2 of the UK's best out-and-out 9-ball players, for several weeks between the end of the snooker season and the World 9-Ball Championships in preparation for the tournament at the Riley's club in Victoria, London. Drago knows his way around an American Pool table very well as his results a couple of years ago showed. You don't get that far in the Worlds or win the World Masters by luck alone.

Just my thoughts on the topic.

I was refering more to his selections on patterns, kicks, choice of shot. You can see he has put time into running a lot of racks, but there are clearly aspects of his 9-ball game that are underdeveloped.

Experienced 9-ballers probably recognize and could explain these better than I.

Just my observation.

 

[DaveK]

I forget the exact ruling on snooker jumpshots.

I know you cannot jump directly over the ball snookering, but I believe you can jump over edges of red balls to get an angle on other red balls.

Or hit down on the cue ball so that it kicks the OB into the air and over the edge of another ball.

Also the CB can jump from the OB over another ball.

Not sure though on the exact wording of the rule..and too tired to google right now.

It is against the rules of snooker to jump (ontentionally cause the cue ball to leave the playing surface). It is illegal to kill your neighbours wife, or something like that ... the town fool, er, boro nut corrected me on this once, I was just checking to see if he was awake still ...

Dave

 

[Colin Colenso]

I didn't reach a high level in snooker because I gave it up to go to university but I was the first kid in the UK to do a government sponsored training scheme and play snooker full time. I would say though that I played 8 ball pool just as much and probably played pool better than snooker. I played with side most shots in snooker, all shots. For example if a red was near the side rail and you had no shot other than a deep screw you would use side to help pull the cb back to baulk if it was off straight and you had to use the rail. A more powerful stroke needed than anything in 9 ball (except the break of course).

As for Earl, his record speaks for itself and I respect what's he's done for sure, prob second only to Efren in recent times. I don't care much for how he behaves but that wasn't why I said what I said. I said it because that's what I saw, I have watched a number of games of his live and up close recently and I was dissapointed. It doesn't mean he wasn't a great player before! As for him giving me the 5, I would take that from anyone in the world today so I would have loved it from Earl, alt break of course But then I could prob have given him a 50 start at Snooker but so what?

This snooker v pool topic comes up frequently on here and the pure pool players with no history in snooker become very defensive. Totally understandable as it sounds like snooker players are being elitist. I just think its almost impossible to compare the two sports unless you have played them both and seen the best players at both. Players like Tony Crosby, Johl Younger and
Mark Grey who has taken the UK tour by storm are probably good people to ask. There was a snooker player in Thailand (English guy) who was one of the best potters I have ever seen and he went over to the US with a stake horse and I think he beat every player for cash in the Washington DC area and he had only been playing 9 ball for a very short time (Although I don't think he played any pro's).

To me its not rocket science. If I was shooting at a barn door all day and another guy was shooting at targets a mile away then he's probably going to be a better shot than me. So what, so snooker players pot better, it doesn't make them better 9 ball players. Interestingly I played a game of snooker the other day for the first time this year, I couldn't pot a ball hardly and I was shocked at just how tight the pockets are. Playing 9 ball has certainly affected my potting accuracy without question. But I love pool and think there are so many aspects to it that snooker players simply can't adapt too. Personally though I consider myself just as much an ex pool player as an ex snooker player so hopefully I can adapt?

You said it better than I Craig!

It's not about us v them or snooker v pool. There are a different set of skills, but it would help people's pool games to have higher potting accuracy.

 

[Colin Colenso]

It is against the rules of snooker to jump (ontentionally cause the cue ball to leave the playing surface). It is illegal to kill your neighbours wife, or something like that ... the town fool, er, boro nut corrected me on this once, I was just checking to see if he was awake still ...

Dave

Actually, according to the rule, you can jump the cue ball around any way you like, UNLESS you are doing so to clear an Obstructing Ball.

But I haven't seen a clear definition of what constitues as Obstructing ball. Obstructing the CB's path to the OB or to Position or the OB's path to the pocket.

Snooker has some stupid rules. Be gone I say with the foul rules and make it ball in hand Speed things up a bit.