stiff?

T

tom haney

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Help me out here guys. I honestly have trouble telling
the difference between stiff hit & soft hit. I've
always heard Schon was stiff & Meucci was soft.
What other cues are considered stiff or soft?
Name names, please.
Also, I've heard one pocket players prefer soft hit
and 9 ball players like a stiff hit. Is this true & why?
I love one hole & HATE 9 ball. Other than Schon,
some sticks I can't seem to play one pocket with
are Clint Putnam & Dominiak. Are they considered
stiff hit?
I've heard that Hercek & Searing are stiff hit. True?
What about Gilbert, Skip Weston, Kenny Murell?
I really like Bender, Kikel, Olney, Josey. What are
they considered?
This is a serious post, guys. I really am that ignorant.
 
stiff

Kenneth murrel are not stiff at all, you have to go around and try cues of if it hits to your personal preferences until you find one you like.
 
juniorchamp_ktm said:
Kenneth murrel are not stiff at all, you have to go around and try cues of if it hits to your personal preferences until you find one you like.
Click to expand...

Believe me, I have not only played with several cues,
I own several cues. My point was I'm not sure what's
considered stiff & I was looking for some patterns I
can recognize. i can shoot with cues til I'm blue in
the face but unless I get some feedback on this
post I'll remain clueless about stiff vs. soft.
 
probably will stay confused

Everybody has different ideas of stiff and soft. A stiff stick with a soft tip and ferule will put a lot of action on a cue ball and some folks will call it soft or whippy. Likewise a very limber stick with a soft joint will still only put middling action at best on a cue ball with a very hard ferule and some tips.

When talking about players, a finesse player and a power player will have totally different ideas about stiff. My mid-eighties Mueci was stiffer than my stick it replaced and I considered it a bit stiff and lifeless. A power player would have probably felt like they were playing with a noodle!

Hu



hondo said:
Believe me, I have not only played with several cues,
I own several cues. My point was I'm not sure what's
considered stiff & I was looking for some patterns I
can recognize. i can shoot with cues til I'm blue in
the face but unless I get some feedback on this
post I'll remain clueless about stiff vs. soft.
Click to expand...
 
stiff/soft

no doubt about it if you want to feel the difference between stiff and soft try a Blackboar (stiff) and a Huebler (soft). Meucci's are not soft, they're whippy.
 
hondo said:
Help me out here guys. I honestly have trouble telling
the difference between stiff hit & soft hit. I've
always heard Schon was stiff & Meucci was soft.
What other cues are considered stiff or soft?
Name names, please.
Also, I've heard one pocket players prefer soft hit
and 9 ball players like a stiff hit. Is this true & why?
I love one hole & HATE 9 ball. Other than Schon,
some sticks I can't seem to play one pocket with
are Clint Putnam & Dominiak. Are they considered
stiff hit?
I've heard that Hercek & Searing are stiff hit. True?
What about Gilbert, Skip Weston, Kenny Murell?
I really like Bender, Kikel, Olney, Josey. What are
they considered?
This is a serious post, guys. I really am that ignorant.
Click to expand...

Call me crazy, but this is pretty much all anecdotal. The only real way to say this is stiff and that is like a wet noodle is to measure them using standard methods. Any cue makers out there measure their shafts flexibility ?

I would also think there is a flaw in the question. Asking about the comparisons between different cue makers assumes that a specific makers cues are all the same stiffness. I suspect they make different shafts as per design and/or customer specifications, and if they do it is unfair to generalize.

Then there is marketing ... in the golf world some manufacturers will label a shaft as "Stiff" when it is really a "Regular" flex. This is because the average macho golfer doesn't want some wimpy regular club, they need stiff because their ego says they do. So you give them the regular flex they truely need, but tell them it's stiff so they buy it. I have no idea if any cuemakers promote their cues as having specific charactoristics, and I'm definately not saying that any cuemakers are misleading their customers, but it is something to be aware of, and another reason why standardized tesing is best. Yes, I am very cynical, I used to be in high-tech sales and marketing, a tough row for an honest engineer to hoe.

I will someday modify the clamps of a golf shaft frequency meter I built years ago. It really wouldn't take much to make up a new clamp (or two or three) for the joint-end of a (few) 'standard' shaft(s). If I ever get this done I will ask you all to send me your Hercek or Searing or Gilbert or Shon or Meucci or Balabushka to test as I only have a Falcon, a McDermott and a Dufferin, much too small a sample.

Dave
 
As mentioned above the hit of a cue is a subjective experience. For example, how much wrist you use will change the feel of a cue. No wrist give a "stiffer" feel and lots of wrist whip gives a "softer" feel. So, what feels stiff to one person can feel entirely different to another. A good way to get a feel for the cue is to hit shots lots of spin, a table length draw is good. On a dead centerball hit many cues will feel the same.
 
pawnmon said:
no doubt about it if you want to feel the difference between stiff and soft try a Blackboar (stiff) and a Huebler (soft). Meucci's are not soft, they're whippy.
Click to expand...

I am with Pawnmon on this. But I have had two hueblers in my past, one with a plastic and the second with the SS flat face joint. I found when I added a ivory ferrule to my SS heubler, it became a more on the stiffy side. ;)

The best way to answer your question is to get out and play with several cues. I find the schon/joss are more like auto pilot with more action on the ball. It will travel harder and farther with just a little more than center ball hit. The huebler/meucci with the plastic composite join will play softer. But you get some of the schon/joss feel with an Ivory ferrule, but I find the SS collar around the flat face joint more to my liking than the composite. I have found that a Meucci with the SS collar can also be better over the standard model.

The other way is to test this is with a draw shot. The more solid the cue the easier the ball travels to the other end of the 9ft table. You can do the same with the huebler of softer joint cues, but it will require a lower hit on the cue ball and more follow through. Some may disagree with me? :o But it is a matter of style and practice. I used to play 8 hours a day 7 days a week in my youth. Now that I am older and only play once every other month, I need all the special juice I can get. I like stiffy easier work over the wimpy cue (insert joint over the flat face). But maybe it is just me?
If you find your way to tournaments at the local halls make friends, in time they may let you play with their toys? I made friend with lots of players in my local haunts and backed them and in time they let me play with their cues.

If you play several different kind of games? You may find in time you will have a larger case with stiff and soft cues for different kinds of hit. It can be like golf with different clubs. Depending on your style of play you may need different tools for different kind of games? You may also find yourself with a 12mm shaft and a 13mm or larger depending on your game play also?

Bugs.
 
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I would also think there is a flaw in the question. Asking about the comparisons between different cue makers assumes that a specific makers cues are all the same stiffness. I suspect they make different shafts as per design and/or customer specifications, and if they do it is unfair to generalize.
........................................................................
Is this true? It was one of the questions I had. Are there for example
stiff hitting Scruggs & soft hitting Scruggs? If I ordered
a Hercek could I say hey Joel ,put a soft hitting
shaft on that 7 years from now old buddy ?
 
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If you play several different kind of games? You may find in time you will have a larger case with stiff and soft cues for different kinds of hit. It can be like golf with different clubs. Depending on your style of play you may need different tools for different kind of games? You may also find yourself with a 12mm shaft and a 13mm or larger depending on your game play also?

.....................................................................................
That was one of my questions. I have 2 sticks, a Pechauer & a
Joss that are great for 8 ball & poor for one pocket. Do I assume
they are stiff hitting sticks? So I do carry different sticks for the
different games I play.
 
Alot depends on the taper and the joint. I think any cuemaker can make a cue feel less stiff just by changing those two factors around a bit. For me, the stiffest good hitting cue I ever played with was a Southwest. The softest good hitting cue I ever played with was this fairly plain Mottey. The Mottey had a really lively hit to it, I seemed to be able to really whip the cueball around the table on drawshots easily. Meuccis seem to always have a very soft hit too, and I know there are alot of folks on this board that do not like Meucci, but I have always liked their hit too.

I play with a cue with a medium hit, definitely softer than a Southwest but alot stiffer than a Meucci.

Its really all about just playing with a cue until you find the right one. No one will be able to name the perfect hitting cue for you, its all about personal preference. Just experiment until you find the cue that allows you to play your favorite game: "Hondo Wins". :-)
 
Maybe my question WAS a little murky. How about this?
What is your favorite cue for one pocket & do you consider
it a stiff hit or soft?
Favorite cue for 8 & 9 ball? Do you consider it stiff or soft?
Then let me interpret your answers however I will.
 
I do not switch cues depending on the game. I would think switching cues would screw with your stroke; you would have to change the feel of your stroke to get the same amount of movement on the ball depending upon the cue, and that is preventing you from getting in your game and staying there. Not to mention that slight aiming adjustments may be needed as well.
 
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