Stroke slip
- Thread starter medallio
- Start date
Yeah, by your explanation that isn't what a slip stroke is. On long straight shots I'll let go with my grip hand very lightly on my last forward stroke through the CB so the cue is merely being cradled in the first joint of my fingers with nothing else touching it. For me, this is the single thing that has most increased accuracy on long straight shots.
A slip stroke is also useful on some shots and it's more of your grip hand slipping on the final backstroke, moving more than the cue stick backwards as the cue stick stays closer to the CB.
A slip stroke is also useful on some shots and it's more of your grip hand slipping on the final backstroke, moving more than the cue stick backwards as the cue stick stays closer to the CB.
He said "stroke slip", not "slip stroke", and yes, what he is describing would be termed a stroke slip by some (not me).
" I think I miss some shots due to it. Anybody else do this on purpose or not? "
medallion
If you miss, it's not advisable.
I, often, intentionally open my grip on the cue before contact so that my wrist doesn't divert the cue's intended path.
Be well
From the thread below i.e., AtLarge:
About the throwing Gene got that from the the filipino`s most of them throw the cue...It is the purist way to hit a ball by not gripping the cue...The cue can`t help but to go straight...Gene`s high run was in the four hundred`s throwing the cue...He exaggerated the throw by letting go of the cue...He even broke the balls that way and so does Nick M....
I`m not saying that it works for everybody but it does work...I throw the stick also but I don`t teach it or try to change anyone`s game...You have to give up everything you have learned about basics to try it and most people find that very hard to do...
I hope that i have explained it so that you guys understand it a little better...
Ron V
Folks:
A late-comer to this thread, and I did my best to read as much of it as I could, but I wanted to lend a little mechanical engineering view to point something out that detractors to this "throwing the cue" technique *might* be overlooking. (And "might" is the key operative word here; I don't mean to use it authoritatively, but rather more as a "have you considered it from this perspective?" viewpoint.) When watching Dave's video, I noticed his wrist position when gripping the cue. It is a *prone* wrist position -- meaning, his wrist is bent outwards (away from the body) slightly, enough so that the palm of his hand is "hovering over" the top surface of the gripping area of the cue, with his fingers and thumb directed down perfectly perpendicular to the floor along the "sides" of the gripping surface of the cue, gently wrapping under it. (I don't know if this is Dave's "normal" wrist position before-discovering/not-using the "throwing the cue" technique, and I use the term "prone" to mean just like it does in competitive rifle shooting -- lying flat on one's belly. The analogy here is "palm = belly.") Keith McCready is an example of a player that uses a prone wrist position, albeit his is an extreme example. This is as opposed to a retrograde wrist position, a la Efren Reyes, where the wrist is bent inwards towards the body with the major knuckles of the fingers (e.g. 2nd joint) pointed towards the floor, the cue "rolling over" the knuckle of the index finger as its fulcrum point during stroke.
What does this have to do with the thread? Mechanics-wise, methinks this "throwing the cue" technique is *much* easier and more natural for a player that uses a prone wrist position, because his/her grip fingers are naturally angled down perpendicular to the floor, along the "sides" of the cue. A pure mechanical analogy might be the "gripper claw" you see attached to a crane in a garbage dump; the gripper claw opens, grabs material, and when finally positioned over the destination deposit area, opens and releases, letting the material fall straight down without any sideways influence from the gripper claw itself. (BTW, I did mean that to be a pure mechanical analogy; no "garbage dump" innuendos to this thread was intended.
)
Players that use a straight or retrograde wrist position will have a much tougher time with the "throwing the cue" technique without imparting some kind of "spin" or "roll" to the cue as they try to get their fingers out from under the cue. So it would be safe to say that the "throwing the cue" technique might not be a "natural" or beneficial technique for players that use standard or retrograde wrist position, unless they adopt a very extreme "snap open" motion of the hand, which would be quite unnatural and may even impart some "yaw" to the cue if the cue happens to cling a bit to either the thumb or one of the fingers.
I have seen players like Keith McCready use the "throwing the cue" technique (albeit Keith's sidearm style is extremely unorthodox). And even then, he used it as more as a money-/game-ball "coupe de grace" show-off shot.
Thoughts? What say ye all?
-Sean
medallion
If you miss, it's not advisable.
I, often, intentionally open my grip on the cue before contact so that my wrist doesn't divert the cue's intended path.
Be well
From the thread below i.e., AtLarge:
About the throwing Gene got that from the the filipino`s most of them throw the cue...It is the purist way to hit a ball by not gripping the cue...The cue can`t help but to go straight...Gene`s high run was in the four hundred`s throwing the cue...He exaggerated the throw by letting go of the cue...He even broke the balls that way and so does Nick M....
I`m not saying that it works for everybody but it does work...I throw the stick also but I don`t teach it or try to change anyone`s game...You have to give up everything you have learned about basics to try it and most people find that very hard to do...
I hope that i have explained it so that you guys understand it a little better...
Ron V
Folks:
A late-comer to this thread, and I did my best to read as much of it as I could, but I wanted to lend a little mechanical engineering view to point something out that detractors to this "throwing the cue" technique *might* be overlooking. (And "might" is the key operative word here; I don't mean to use it authoritatively, but rather more as a "have you considered it from this perspective?" viewpoint.) When watching Dave's video, I noticed his wrist position when gripping the cue. It is a *prone* wrist position -- meaning, his wrist is bent outwards (away from the body) slightly, enough so that the palm of his hand is "hovering over" the top surface of the gripping area of the cue, with his fingers and thumb directed down perfectly perpendicular to the floor along the "sides" of the gripping surface of the cue, gently wrapping under it. (I don't know if this is Dave's "normal" wrist position before-discovering/not-using the "throwing the cue" technique, and I use the term "prone" to mean just like it does in competitive rifle shooting -- lying flat on one's belly. The analogy here is "palm = belly.") Keith McCready is an example of a player that uses a prone wrist position, albeit his is an extreme example. This is as opposed to a retrograde wrist position, a la Efren Reyes, where the wrist is bent inwards towards the body with the major knuckles of the fingers (e.g. 2nd joint) pointed towards the floor, the cue "rolling over" the knuckle of the index finger as its fulcrum point during stroke.
What does this have to do with the thread? Mechanics-wise, methinks this "throwing the cue" technique is *much* easier and more natural for a player that uses a prone wrist position, because his/her grip fingers are naturally angled down perpendicular to the floor, along the "sides" of the cue. A pure mechanical analogy might be the "gripper claw" you see attached to a crane in a garbage dump; the gripper claw opens, grabs material, and when finally positioned over the destination deposit area, opens and releases, letting the material fall straight down without any sideways influence from the gripper claw itself. (BTW, I did mean that to be a pure mechanical analogy; no "garbage dump" innuendos to this thread was intended.
) Players that use a straight or retrograde wrist position will have a much tougher time with the "throwing the cue" technique without imparting some kind of "spin" or "roll" to the cue as they try to get their fingers out from under the cue. So it would be safe to say that the "throwing the cue" technique might not be a "natural" or beneficial technique for players that use standard or retrograde wrist position, unless they adopt a very extreme "snap open" motion of the hand, which would be quite unnatural and may even impart some "yaw" to the cue if the cue happens to cling a bit to either the thumb or one of the fingers.
I have seen players like Keith McCready use the "throwing the cue" technique (albeit Keith's sidearm style is extremely unorthodox). And even then, he used it as more as a money-/game-ball "coupe de grace" show-off shot.
Thoughts? What say ye all?
-Sean
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We had an interesting thread on "throwing" the cue (a "stroke slip" as opposed to a "slip stroke") in 2008: http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=109237
AtLarge,
Thanks for that old thread.
I appreciate the description of Efren's grasp at delivery.
Be well