Techniques generating a more powerful break (greater than 22MPH) ...Anyone?

TrumanHW said:
I've been experimenting this week with trying to finally get a B player (vs. D player) break.

I have:
bent my front elbow
look at cue ball last
work on centering my gravity
put more weight on my bridge hand
working on bringing my cue back more slowly.
struggling with pausing in between my back and forward swing
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FYI, lots of useful break-shot advice (for both power and control) can be found in the following video:

NV D.14 - Pool Break Technique Advice - from Vol-III of the Billiard University instructional DVD series

and much more can be found on the break technique advice resource page.

I hope it helps. Good luck!
Dave
 
TrumanHW said:
The question is, how do I learn to practice accurate hits starting with my shoulder, or including it.
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Start slow and gradually build up speed as your technique improves. When stroking bring your tip all the way back to your bridge hand on each stroke. After you have set your aim start rising slowly before starting your contact stroke. As the contact stroke begins shift your focus to bringing up the tip to center ball just at tip contact. Lastly complete your extended follow through of the cue as you kick your near cue leg backwards. Do not try to do it all in one jerky motion as it is a sequence of events much like a pre shot routine.
 
years back a guy was selling a breaking secrets thing on ebay, it was under $20 so i said what the heck. I think i got it on my computer at home, message me if youre interested and ill send you the pdf of it. Depending on who im playing i occasionally still use it, it does let me break really hard, the downside is you give up some cueball control.
 
JLD said:
Start slow and gradually build up speed as your technique improves. When stroking bring your tip all the way back to your bridge hand on each stroke. After you have set your aim start rising slowly before starting your contact stroke. As the contact stroke begins shift your focus to bringing up the tip to center ball just at tip contact. Lastly complete your extended follow through of the cue as you kick your near cue leg backwards. Do not try to do it all in one jerky motion as it is a sequence of events much like a pre shot routine.
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I've also been trying to figure if my shoulders should be more 'baseball' style... where you turn your head left or if they should be squared... any insight on that?
 
If you square your shoulders to the shot you will lose the speed gained by rotating your shoulder forward which could amount up to 10% or more of total forward momentum.
 
JLD said:
If you square your shoulders to the shot you will lose the speed gained by rotating your shoulder forward which could amount up to 10% or more of total forward momentum.
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Am I not supposed to worry about the fact that the cue will be wildly off the stroke line while I wind up to engage shoulder/chest?
 
I break as hard as I can, without losing accuracy. If I start losing the cueball, I back er down a notch. Magic rack is a different story.
 
TrumanHW said:
Am I not supposed to worry about the fact that the cue will be wildly off the stroke line while I wind up to engage shoulder/chest?
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You rotate your shoulder forward in line with the shot. Don't keep rotating it past the line.
 
TrumanHW said:
Joey, I'm FROM Gretna. My whole family lives out there. Heard of Carlo Ditta Inc.?

Ahhh, New Orleans. $4 an hour pool, open all night..... You ever played at Honey's? lol

I am on the verge of buying a break rak. I've been eyeing it for a while... I want to split it with a few friends ideally... or maybe just leave it at hard times and rent it out for $20 per hour. :)
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Do it, buy a breakrak. You are already a great player and will quickly figure out how to break harder yourself once you can repeat the break a few hundred times in a row. When I bought mine, I went from 17-18 max to 24-25 in about a week of heavy practice (right now I am at about 20-21 because I haven't practiced my break in a loooong time).

I'm sure you know this already, but its more important to coordinate your movements smoothly than to try and put 120% power into the break. If you just try to wail on the cue ball, its very likely that you will come out with less speed than if you had just tried to hit the ball hard.

One thing that has helped me pick up speed and accuracy is picking a point on the cue ball to hit then line your cue up with it (with harder breaks, this point should be a bit lower than is intuitive or else the cue ball will just fly off the table). Once you've got your point on the cue ball, pick a point about a foot and a half or more directly behind that point. When you break, don't worry about the cue ball, just swing relatively hard and focus on getting your cue to the point behind the cue ball. This should help you a little if you are like me and your cue naturally tends to "wobble" after strinking the cue ball on a very hard shot,
 
Here is my findings

I purchased a break Rak and posted my findings and progress here...also, some great advice from others in the thread.
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=315712

I have found that the wrist provides just as much power as the arm, but is much more controllable. Control is so much more important than power. A squatted 21 mph break devastates a rack.
 
Thanks guys for the kind words about the BreakRAK.

I will say this again... there is no MAGIC in the BreakRAK. But ANY repetitious tool will bring out the MAGIC in you. Repetition will build your speed & your accuracy, through greater coordination. Humans learn from repetition, in every facet of life & industry, it's called Muscle Memory.

The BreakRAK Co. has always offered this guarantee to ALL... if your not satisfied with the BreakRAK & your ability to use this tool & raise your skill level in 2 weeks, we will gladly refund your monies.

I'm 71 years old & I've been marketing the BreakRAK for 11 years with great success, but not much financial success, because the BreakRAK cost too much to manufacture. Our success is in the Players & their success in raising their skill level. We strive for a great product & 100% customer satisfaction.

Everyone should try this Break shot TEST.

Break 10 racks & count your balls made. If you scratch or break dry, you get a ZERO for that Break.

next test.....

Break 10 Racks & count your balls made. if you scratch or break dry, you get a ZERO for that Break. BUT, after the Break, if you make a ball, you get Cue Ball in hand (middle of the table) to start your run.

Compare your scores.... this will give you an idea of what a controlled Break Shot will do for your game.

Good Luck....
 
TrumanHW said:
Joey, I'm FROM Gretna. My whole family lives out there. Heard of Carlo Ditta Inc.?

Ahhh, New Orleans. $4 an hour pool, open all night..... You ever played at Honey's? lol

I am on the verge of buying a break rak. I've been eyeing it for a while... I want to split it with a few friends ideally... or maybe just leave it at hard times and rent it out for $20 per hour. :)
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Sure, everyone has heard of Carlo Ditta, Inc. Played at Honey's many years ago a couple of times.

I've been planning on pulling the Break Rak out again. I bought the Deluxe one with the radar speed device on it. Actually a pal and I bought it together and we use it periodically.

Splitting the cost with a few friends is ideal.

I play at Buffalo's in Metairie if you want to try working on your break. We have a couple of fast breakers that hand out there but I'm not one of them. I'm probably a 19 mph kind of guy. Sometimes I can hit 20 or 21 but most of the time 19 is my average speed. The only problem with Buffalo's is they have old sets of balls and some of them are mismatched making tight racks very difficult.
 
Lots of great posts - and the youtube video from colin is what helped me get what I wanted - 21 to 22mph with accuracy.

Many of the PROs break at 21 to 24 mph in tournament play. So at the start of this thread when you said you break at 22mph my reaction was - your done - that is perfect. The average league player breaks at 15 to 18 mph. I have heard, but never seen myself, that at a break speed competition pros have gotten into low 30s but with no control / consistency.

I have only worked with one amateur who could consistently hit 28mph - consistent speed but not as good on accuracy and sometimes flying the cue ball. His technique was very shoulder driven with maybe a tad bit of torso twist to square his shoulders as he rotated into the break. Basically everything from the colin video plus shoulder rotation and lifting the butt of the cue way up at the top of the backswing. I don't think I can add anything more that wasn't already said or linked in a video.

Good luck,
Craig
 
TrumanHW said:
I generally hit the ball pretty squarely... but of course, no one does all the time.
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Over a 7 hour run (from 1:00 PM when I arrived to 8:04 when the last match was over;
Darren Appleton only failed to make perfect contact about 6 times (Sunday July 7 while winning 4 matches in a row to take the 10-ball challenge championship.)

70% of the time the CB stopped inside 1/2 diamond from center table before a rolling OB knocked the CB somewhere else. That is, CB makes contact with rack, CB pops up about 1.5 inches, lands about center table, comes to a complete stop; before some other OB makes contact with CB.
 
JoeyA said:
Sure, everyone has heard of Carlo Ditta, Inc. Played at Honey's many years ago a couple of times.

I've been planning on pulling the Break Rak out again. I bought the Deluxe one with the radar speed device on it. Actually a pal and I bought it together and we use it periodically.

Splitting the cost with a few friends is ideal.

I play at Buffalo's in Metairie if you want to try working on your break. We have a couple of fast breakers that hand out there but I'm not one of them. I'm probably a 19 mph kind of guy. Sometimes I can hit 20 or 21 but most of the time 19 is my average speed. The only problem with Buffalo's is they have old sets of balls and some of them are mismatched making tight racks very difficult.
Click to expand...

On Airline, right? Played there last time I was there with the guy who worked there I believe. Its a tough diamond we played on... Last time before that I was there, it was with Schmidt who stayed with me and snapped off that tournament. I believe he and Jaime discussed matching up but didnt. Jaime's seemed like a good guy also.

As far as typical speed, I of course want to have the ability to hit them hard when the table is tough, but want a generally solid 20-23 that's very controlled. I'm almost there now... but would love to have the option of getting over 25 -- and am very interested in what the process will be arriving there.

What really blows me away is that some people never have to do all this analysis... they just "get it".

I really wish there was a "like" button here as on FB ... it's a lot more practical to endorse peoples ideas than to reply to each and every one.

My grandmother is the owner of CD Inc - so there's a fair chance we may know people in common.

The work you did with JJ during the OP Of Efren v Shannon was wonderful, as was that with Billy. 3 of my absolute fav matches. Thanks for those.

TW
 
Have you guys seen De Lunas break? It's ridiculous. Do you think the hardest breakers worked at it? Or that most were naturals?

Thanks a ton to all of those of you whom I didn't mention. As I said, I'm going to compile a list of the best suggestions as well as those things I discover along the way and create a useful post of my own, I hope.

Thanks all.
 
TrumanHW said:
On Airline, right? Played there last time I was there with the guy who worked there I believe. Its a tough diamond we played on... Last time before that I was there, it was with Schmidt who stayed with me and snapped off that tournament. I believe he and Jaime discussed matching up but didnt. Jaime's seemed like a good guy also.

As far as typical speed, I of course want to have the ability to hit them hard when the table is tough, but want a generally solid 20-23 that's very controlled. I'm almost there now... but would love to have the option of getting over 25 -- and am very interested in what the process will be arriving there.

What really blows me away is that some people never have to do all this analysis... they just "get it".

I really wish there was a "like" button here as on FB ... it's a lot more practical to endorse peoples ideas than to reply to each and every one.

My grandmother is the owner of CD Inc - so there's a fair chance we may know people in common.

The work you did with JJ during the OP Of Efren v Shannon was wonderful, as was that with Billy. 3 of my absolute fav matches. Thanks for those.

TW
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For me, to get past 21-22, I had to incorporate wrist action. Once I practiced using my wrist, it gave me a few mph more, but its something I have to practice to maintain and I don't use it unless I have been practicing it. Even using the wrist snap, I generally get better results without my wrist because I don't have to change my normal stroke much to use it.
 
When i bring my stroke back and make the pause i like to flick my wrist on the forward motion and follow through hard not fast! Idk if this creates more speed but it helps pop the cue ball up SVB style!
 
Don't know if anyone has posted this or not as I have not read all of the replies. Charlie Bryant has a video on his website about how to break. He has been clocked at 35 mph which is just stupid. That may be a good idea and I am sure you could ask him additional questions after.

Have you asked Santos, Louis, or Johnny for any tips? They all crush the break from what I remember at Hard Times. Dave Hemmah may be able to help you as well. Good luck!
 
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