the basis of

8pack said:
What do you think the finding's would be?
Click to expand...
There are already pool robots on youtube and they are impressive and make all of the shots that they are programmed to make.

There is a robot that is mounted to an X and Y axis gantry above the table that allows the robot that holds the cue to move laterally and rotate anywhere on the table and then shoot perhaps with english.

The important nut to make all shots is the software that drives the microprocessor to move and energize the actuators in the gantry and robot's aim and stroke.

It the robot is programmed to start aiming the cue at the center of the CB to the edge of the OB (CTE) line and then move the tip one tip laterally to the side, say one tip, it can then pivot back to aim the tip of the cue at the center of the CB and shoot. The robot will do this to perfection with the accuracy to effect a specific cut angle time after time as programmed. What about the other cut angles of interest?

The robot can employ a vision system to calculate and find the contact point on the OB that sends it to the target/pocket and shift the tip only a fraction of the tip diameter to the side for a thick cut and more than one diameter for a thin cut. The tip offsets can be commited to the read only memory in the microprocessor in a look up table that the vision system will direct the robot to the correct offset and then pivot to the center of the CB and shoot.

The microprocessor will have been programmed with all of the solutions/algorithims for the almost infinite number of contact points on the OB to be contacted by the CB contact point to send the OB to the target/pocket within +/- .005".

The robot can be programmed after several trial shots to adjust for the speed of the cloth.

If the robot has a humidity sensor, it can be programmed to make adjustment for the effect that has on the path/trajectory of the CB.

If the robot only shoots centerball stun shots, it will adjust for CIT. It can be programmed to apply inside and outside english an still send the CB on a different line/trajectory to the target/pocket. Any other considerations can be programmed into the robot as well.

If we could steer the CB, We could add GPS guidance as well.

Many shooters here have difficulty seeing the contact point on the OB and use perhaps a secondary sight line that looks at discrete fractions on the OB to assist in altering the path/trajectory of the CB to effect a limited number of cut angles with a different one for each fraction on the OB.

If the robot were programmed to only accept these fractions on the OB, as above, then it will only shoot the prescribed cut angles perfectly shot after shot.

I hope this helps:smile::smile:
 
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LAMas said:
If the center of the CB is aimed at the edge of the OB it is geometrically fixed regardless of the location of the CB and OB on the table.

View attachment 256103
Click to expand...

This is why you guys don't get it. The cte line runs from center cue ball through the outermost edge of object ball in relation to the pocket. There is a different cte line for each pocket in your drawing.
 
cookie man said:
This is why you guys don't get it. The cte line runs from center cue ball through the outermost edge of object ball in relation to the pocket. There is a different cte line for each pocket in your drawing.
Click to expand...

I dont think you are right. That would mean you would sight a center to contact point line because the outer most edge in relation to the pocket is the contact point.

This would mean in order to hit the contact point every time, your secondary visual would have to be the same.

Besides, finding the contact point would mean you would have to find one of the "360 ticks" & Stan is against that.
 
LAMas said:
True that, but if you froze the shooter behind the center of the CB aiming at the edge of the OB together like a statue, you could move or rotate this statue with balls anywhere atop the table, but the relationship of the shooter to the center of the CB to the edge of the OB staue would not change.

Bottom line is this is just the start and the important part is the...."Rest of the story.":wink:
Click to expand...

That is correct - so IF you froze the shooter at the correct CTE alignment for any given pocket then you can move the table in any direction and the shot still lines up when the shooter executes the steps.

Move anything and it becomes a new shot with a new approach.
 
JB Cases said:
That is correct - so IF you froze the shooter at the correct CTE alignment for any given pocket then you can move the table in any direction and the shot still lines up when the shooter executes the steps.

Move anything and it becomes a new shot with a new approach.
Click to expand...

I/we have never had a problem with starting the CTE Aiming Systems behind the center of the CB aimed at the edge of the OB as described by Hal. Also nothing further is necessary if the cut angle to the target/pocket is ~ 30 degrees - CIT.

I agree that whenever the target/pocket is moved in relation to the CB and OB to another cut angle, one must move the cue to another path/trajectory to effect the contact point on the CB impacting the contact point on the OB. This is accomplished by various methods/steps...some better than others.

Thanks and have a Happy New Year to you and yours.:thumbup:
 
LAMas said:
I/we have never had a problem with starting the CTE Aiming Systems behind the center of the CB aimed at the edge of the OB as described by Hal. Also nothing further is necessary if the cut angle to the target/pocket is ~ 30 degrees - CIT.

I agree that whenever the target/pocket is moved in relation to the CB and OB to another cut angle, one must move the cue to another path/trajectory to effect the contact point on the CB impacting the contact point on the OB. This is accomplished by various methods/steps...some better than others.

Thanks and have a Happy New Year to you and yours.:thumbup:
Click to expand...

On DVD2 I will have my most significant lesson ever concerning a 30 degree angle. In a million years I would never shoot a 30 degree shot without a pivot or visual sweep. For sure, and you could bet the farm, in real CTE you are offset to the CTE line.

Hal told me this as clearly as could be in one of our discussions. Hal put a CB right between his eyes and said if you look at the CTE line from this perspective you are in trouble. CTE can't exist as Hal prescribed from behind the center of a CB.

Stan Shuffett
 
LAMas said:
There are already pool robots on youtube and they are impressive and make all of the shots that they are programmed to make.

There is a robot that is mounted to an X and Y axis gantry above the table that allows the robot that holds the cue to move laterally and rotate anywhere on the table and then shoot perhaps with english.

The important nut to make all shots is the software that drives the microprocessor to move and energize the actuators in the gantry and robot's aim and stroke.

It the robot is programmed to start aiming the cue at the center of the CB to the edge of the OB (CTE) line and then move the tip one tip laterally to the side, say one tip, it can then pivot back to aim the tip of the cue at the center of the CB and shoot. The robot will do this to perfection with the accuracy to effect a specific cut angle time after time as programmed. What about the other cut angles of interest?

The robot can employ a vision system to calculate and find the contact point on the OB that sends it to the target/pocket and shift the tip only a fraction of the tip diameter to the side for a thick cut and more than one diameter for a thin cut. The tip offsets can be commited to the read only memory in the microprocessor in a look up table that the vision system will direct the robot to the correct offset and then pivot to the center of the CB and shoot.

The microprocessor will have been programmed with all of the solutions/algorithims for the almost infinite number of contact points on the OB to be contacted by the CB contact point to send the OB to the target/pocket within +/- .005".

The robot can be programmed after several trial shots to adjust for the speed of the cloth.

If the robot has a humidity sensor, it can be programmed to make adjustment for the effect that has on the path/trajectory of the CB.

If the robot only shoots centerball stun shots, it will adjust for CIT. It can be programmed to apply inside and outside english an still send the CB on a different line/trajectory to the target/pocket. Any other considerations can be programmed into the robot as well.

If we could steer the CB, We could add GPS guidance as well.

Many shooters here have difficulty seeing the contact point on the OB and use perhaps a secondary sight line that looks at discrete fractions on the OB to assist in altering the path/trajectory of the CB to effect a limited number of cut angles with a different one for each fraction on the OB.

If the robot were programmed to only accept these fractions on the OB, as above, then it will only shoot the prescribed cut angles perfectly shot after shot.

I hope this helps:smile::smile:
Click to expand...

That helps and thanks for that.It would be awesome for a robot to shoot cte as its taught.
 
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What I read here and elsewhere...never met Hal.

stan shuffett said:
On DVD2 I will have my most significant lesson ever concerning a 30 degree angle. In a million years I would never shoot a 30 degree shot without a pivot or visual sweep. For sure, and you could bet the farm, in real CTE you are offset to the CTE line.

Hal told me this as clearly as could be in one of our discussions. Hal put a CB right between his eyes and said if you look at the CTE line from this perspective you are in trouble. CTE can't exist as Hal prescribed from behind the center of a CB.

Stan Shuffett
Click to expand...

From Dr Dave's blog/
http://billiards.colostate.edu/threads/aiming.html#CTE
......
Here is a description of a version of the CTE, based on a video demonstration posted (and later removed) by eezbank, that he claimed was the version of CTE originally taught to him by Hal Houle:

For a “thick hit” (a small cut angle, less than about 15 degrees) to the left:

Align the cue 1 tip to the right of the CB center through the right edge of the OB.
Place the bridge hand down with the cue along this line.
Pivot the cue until the cue is pointed directly through the center of the CB.
Stroke perfectly straight along this line.

For a “half-ball hit” (close to 30 degrees) to the left:

Align the cue through the center of the CB and through the right edge of the OB.
Place the bridge hand down with the cue along this line.
Stroke perfectly straight along this center-to-edge (CTE) line. ....
 
LAMas said:
From Dr Dave's blog/
http://billiards.colostate.edu/threads/aiming.html#CTE
......
Here is a description of a version of the CTE, based on a video demonstration posted (and later removed) by eezbank, that he claimed was the version of CTE originally taught to him by Hal Houle:

For a “thick hit” (a small cut angle, less than about 15 degrees) to the left:

Align the cue 1 tip to the right of the CB center through the right edge of the OB.
Place the bridge hand down with the cue along this line.
Pivot the cue until the cue is pointed directly through the center of the CB.
Stroke perfectly straight along this line.

For a “half-ball hit” (close to 30 degrees) to the left:

Align the cue through the center of the CB and through the right edge of the OB.
Place the bridge hand down with the cue along this line.
Stroke perfectly straight along this center-to-edge (CTE) line. ....
Click to expand...

You pivot on every shot in real CTE including a 30 degree shot.

I tried various methods years ago using CTE lines in as many ways as I could but those ways were not real CTE. I knew they were not the real deal. I could make balls and such but I was aware of gaps.

Anyway, Hal told me what he told me and he was correct with what he said about the fact that you can not align directly behind the 30 degree line.
That idea is long gone!!

Stan Shuffett
 
Stan,
I want to make sure I understand.

When my visuals are set for a shot, before the pivot, am I suppose to be in line with cte & the secondary line at the same time?

Or are you saying I wi be offset of the cte?
 
(((Satori))) said:
Stan Shuffett- "in real CTE you are offset to the CTE line."


Oh man! The plot thickens.
Click to expand...

Hang in there.
I don't use CTE but have studied some elements as described by those that share that info.

If you start your stance behind the center of the CB with your vision center or dominant eye aimed at the right edge of the OB, then you are to laterally shift, say 1/2 tip to the side (either) pre-pivot. This small movement will not affect your stance for you only need to move your bridge and butt a bit to the side of the center of the CB. You will still be on the CTE line, but off to the side a bit.

When you pivot at your bridge (stationary) by moving the butt to the side until your tip is now aimed at the center of the CB, you cue will no longer be aimed along original CTE line.

If for the example above, your non dominant eye sees the left edge of the CB aimed/aligned at the center of the OB as could happen if the CB and OB are close together, after you pivot, you will notice that the left edge of the CB is no longer aimed/aligned at the center...this could be a secondary aim line, that can be used for other cut angles by moving your stance until the left edge (in this case) at other fractions of the OB.

If you do this, you will no longer be on the CTE line that you started with.

As I see it as a non CTE user.
 
So, before you drop into the shot, you are lined up to where you see cte & secondary edge to aim line?

Thanks for your explanation ut it was not what I was asking. My question is simple. I want to know if you are suppose be in line to view both visuals at the same time before you drop down.

Can you please answer this for me Stan?
 
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LAMas said:
Hang in there.
I don't use CTE but have studied some elements as described by those that share that info.

If you start your stance behind the center of the CB with your vision center or dominant eye aimed at the right edge of the OB, then you are to laterally shift, say 1/2 tip to the side (either) pre-pivot. This small movement will not affect your stance for you only need to move your bridge and butt a bit to the side of the center of the CB. You will still be on the CTE line, but off to the side a bit.

When you pivot at your bridge (stationary) by moving the butt to the side until your tip is now aimed at the center of the CB, you cue will no longer be aimed along original CTE line.

If for the example above, your non dominant eye sees the left edge of the CB aimed/aligned at the center of the OB as could happen if the CB and OB are close together, after you pivot, you will notice that the left edge of the CB is no longer aimed/aligned at the center...this could be a secondary aim line, that can be used for other cut angles by moving your stance until the left edge (in this case) at other fractions of the OB.

If you do this, you will no longer be on the CTE line that you started with.

As I see it as a non CTE user.
Click to expand...

Actually, you do not ever have to be directly behind the CTE.

Stan Shuffett
 
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(((Satori))) said:
So, before you drop into the shot, you are lined up to where you see cte & secondary edge to aim line?

Thanks for your explanation ut it was not what I was asking. My question is simple. I want to know if you are suppose be in line to view both visuals at the same time before you drop down.

Can you please answer this for me Stan?
Click to expand...

My best lesson EVER concerning this entire concept will be presented on DVD2.

In CTE your eyes are never directly behind the CTEL.

Stan Shuffett
 
LAMas said:
Hang in there.
I don't use CTE but have studied some elements as described by those that share that info.

If you start your stance behind the center of the CB with your vision center or dominant eye aimed at the right edge of the OB, then you are to laterally shift, say 1/2 tip to the side (either) pre-pivot. This small movement will not affect your stance for you only need to move your bridge and butt a bit to the side of the center of the CB. You will still be on the CTE line, but off to the side a bit.

When you pivot at your bridge (stationary) by moving the butt to the side until your tip is now aimed at the center of the CB, you cue will no longer be aimed along original CTE line.

If for the example above, your non dominant eye sees the left edge of the CB aimed/aligned at the center of the OB as could happen if the CB and OB are close together, after you pivot, you will notice that the left edge of the CB is no longer aimed/aligned at the center...this could be a secondary aim line, that can be used for other cut angles by moving your stance until the left edge (in this case) at other fractions of the OB.

If you do this, you will no longer be on the CTE line that you started with.

As I see it as a non CTE user.
Click to expand...

Not sure if your talking about me but I a sure you i can pivot just as good as any of you and at a quick pace.
I wasnt any way being dishonest about my post.Ive talked with Ron and Hal and from what they've try to teach me there are gaps.(figured this out on my own)
I have know beef with anyone and I think Stans a great person and has done a great job at presenting his work but the fact is there's to many people who are having trouble.Why?

I intend to buy Stans new dvd ,im very interested in his work and should be .:smile:
 
8pack said:
Not sure if your talking about me but I a sure you i can pivot just as good as any of you and at a quick pace.
I wasnt any way being dishonest about my post.Ive talked with Ron and Hal and from what they've try to teach me there are gaps.(figured this out on my own)
I have know beef with anyone and I think Stans a great person and has done a great job at presenting his work but the fact is there's to many people who are having trouble.Why?

I intend to buy Stans new dvd ,im very interested in his work and should be .:smile:
Click to expand...

I am thrilled with how my editing work is progressing. DVD#2 is coming together quite nicely.

No gaps.

I will be teaching and demoing this NO GAPS aspect of CTE for the next many, many years. Well, that's my plan. Knock on wood. Lol

Thanks, 8Pack.

Stan Shuffett
 
stan shuffett said:
I am thrilled with how my editing work is progressing. DVD#2 is coming together quite nicely.

No gaps.

I will be teaching and demoing this NO GAPS aspect of CTE for the next many, many years. Well, that's my plan. Knock on wood. Lol

Thanks, 8Pack.

Stan Shuffett
Click to expand...

Not sure how to take your post.People probable think im trying to discredit what your doing and Im not. I hope the best for your new dvd .
Sorry if I come off negitive .

Anthony
 
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