What years was buddy in his prime?
The Rifleman Vs. SVB
- Thread starter Sw10balltour
- Start date
At the pro 10 ball tournament in Dallas a few months ago I was talking to Oscar Domingez and he told me he believed when Shane gets his break working nobody that has ever played can beat him. The break in rotation games is such a big deal I personally believe Buddy would have trouble fading the monster break of Shane.
This is what I truly believe as well. Buddy is an absolute monster but I think that the pace shane will begin to play at once he gets going would really mess with the methodical buddy hall.
Shane plays about medium pace most of the time, but once he's up and in flow he plays about as fast as anyone
Ditto to this. Buddy was one of the best 9 ball players of his time. But Shane is an innovator in 10 ball. Shane is a top level pro in any game but he is an elite 10 ball player much the way Buddy was an elite 9 ball player in his time. I think Buddy would have taken him in 78 in 9 ball. But would lose in 10 ball pretty much anytime they play.
QUOTE=JCIN;3178191]9 Ball Buddy wins.
10 Ball Shane wins.
Orcullo makes em both sweat.
Nothing wrong with a little bench racing.[/QUOTE]
QUOTE=JCIN;3178191]9 Ball Buddy wins.
10 Ball Shane wins.
Orcullo makes em both sweat.
Nothing wrong with a little bench racing.[/QUOTE]
I would take a prime Buddy Hall over anyone at 9 ball. From about 1974-1986 or so he simply played perfect 9 ball for the cash. He was a better gambler than tournament player. Reyes wanted no part of him back then. He would often play a 10 ahead set versus another top pro and that pro would play great and still lose and often in no time at all. Sigel stopped playing him saying that he was tired of playing his best and still losing. He made it look so simple....When SVB, Earl, Orcullo, Reyes etc play great it looks easy...for them. When Buddy played you felt that you too could do what he was doing, you thought "this game really is easy" LOL.
Saw quite a bit of Buddy at the Rack in Detroit in the late 70's.
I feel everybody in the world needed weight at that time.
..and I'm not going for the slow cloth and buckets for pockets story.
The cloth at the Rack was FASTER than 860 and the pockets on the
Brunswick Anniversaries were shimmed with rubber from a truck tire....
..the toughest one had pockets under 4.5....table 4, if anybody remembers.
Billy Johnson was the best breaker I had seen at that time.
I wouldn't put Buddy's break in the top 100.....but he broke good enough
to make a ball...and that was good enough to beat anybody.
"Confessions of a Pool Hustler"
I've seen Buddy play back in the day and no one could fade what he did on a 9 footer or a bar box with the small ball, gauranteed !
I've seen Buddy play back in the day and no one could fade what he did on a 9 footer or a bar box with the small ball, gauranteed !
please elaborate
I believe you, but I am just interested if you would elaborate on your comment. thanks.
I believe you, but I am just interested if you would elaborate on your comment. thanks.
Thx for asking....
Buddy is the greatest because he has simplifed all mechanical aspects of play. His swing speed is nearly the same for all shots, he works the middle (ALWAYS) of the cueball better than his peers and he's in closer on his next shot more consistently than any other player who plays at the top. Eveything seems to be in slow motion when he's grooved. In the long haul by minimizing all body movements to get his results, his percentages of make/shape and proper speed are much higher than anyone else because of simplification of play.
Sorry Shane
SVB is my favorite player to watch in 10 ball.
Francisco Bustamante is my personal friend, in his prime no one could beat him.
KEITH in his prime for the cash could not be beat except for that girl at the Senator Hotel in Sacramento.
When Luther Lassiter came for the Fathers Day Tournament in Sacramento, no one wanted to play him except for the 13 year old kid who gave Luther a lesson. He left in discust when Luther could not even hold the cue properly. Luther looked up and me and said Barney do you believe this kid and laughed.
EFREN, Saint Louie Louie, Mike Sigel, Harry the Horse Florence, Dennis Searcy, Gene the Machine, the Iceman(Larry hubbart) and this is not the 1950 players.
The Rifleman Buddy Hall gambled like no other, there was no fear.
if, I had to bet, I would go with the older players because in the old days gambling was what the game was all about. You had to hustle to make a living. There were no big paydays, like today. In the old day's you played till you were broke. Life was tougher and you had to have heart !!!!!
I like Buddy vs SVB for that reason. Not that he is a better player.
SVB is my favorite player to watch in 10 ball.
Francisco Bustamante is my personal friend, in his prime no one could beat him.
KEITH in his prime for the cash could not be beat except for that girl at the Senator Hotel in Sacramento.
When Luther Lassiter came for the Fathers Day Tournament in Sacramento, no one wanted to play him except for the 13 year old kid who gave Luther a lesson. He left in discust when Luther could not even hold the cue properly. Luther looked up and me and said Barney do you believe this kid and laughed.
EFREN, Saint Louie Louie, Mike Sigel, Harry the Horse Florence, Dennis Searcy, Gene the Machine, the Iceman(Larry hubbart) and this is not the 1950 players.
The Rifleman Buddy Hall gambled like no other, there was no fear.
if, I had to bet, I would go with the older players because in the old days gambling was what the game was all about. You had to hustle to make a living. There were no big paydays, like today. In the old day's you played till you were broke. Life was tougher and you had to have heart !!!!!
I like Buddy vs SVB for that reason. Not that he is a better player.
Im just curious if you have really made yourself believe that the old players gamble better than the new generation because they didnt have as many big payouts in tournaments?
Have you not seen some of the action matches on TAR? Those guys play nearly perfect for 3 days in a row. Take the match with SVB and Earl on a 9 foot. At the end of the match earl said the kid plays so good he may win the next 5 US opens in a row. Granted he didnt do that but there is also a video someone posted on here of Alex saying SVB is the greatest American player ever. Do you think you have the credentials to argue with someone that plays his caliber that has mixed it up with the best in the world for big money?
Im going to take Alex's word for it and go with Shane and his break and the way the new era players kick safe better. Not to mention Shane has almost perfected the jump shot.
Easy Mike
Mike, this is just my opinion, no offense taken.
From my Avatar you can guess who my favorite player is. I try to watch all of Shane’s matches and yes I watched the Strickland Shane match.
I forgot to mention that the game is roll out. That leaves out ducking and hiding because you didn’t play shape !!! There is no safety play in roll out?
Yes the guy’s are playing for big money today. But to me it’s the sponsors or steakhorses money. In the old day’s you played with your own money. 2nd rule you put up our own money and winner takes all.
That’s why, I think Buddy would win.
I’ve know Alex for a long time and I respect his opinion also, but do you honestly think that Alex is going to play Shane at TAR knowing that he can’t beat Shane.
Mike hope your right, Barney
Mike, this is just my opinion, no offense taken.
From my Avatar you can guess who my favorite player is. I try to watch all of Shane’s matches and yes I watched the Strickland Shane match.
I forgot to mention that the game is roll out. That leaves out ducking and hiding because you didn’t play shape !!! There is no safety play in roll out?
Yes the guy’s are playing for big money today. But to me it’s the sponsors or steakhorses money. In the old day’s you played with your own money. 2nd rule you put up our own money and winner takes all.
That’s why, I think Buddy would win.
I’ve know Alex for a long time and I respect his opinion also, but do you honestly think that Alex is going to play Shane at TAR knowing that he can’t beat Shane.
Mike hope your right, Barney
That's Alan Ladd?....The movie is Shane?
nice one
I believe he's referring to when Reyes first came to the states in 1985 and was beating everyone for the cash and then he came up against Buddy, in a 10 ahead set of 9 ball. Buddy won it in less than an hour and as far as I know Reyes never played him again.
calm and cool....
Remember the story in one of Eddie Robin's books about how Buddy Hall was doing an exhibition at a state fair and a big horsefly landed on his face but he stayed down on the shot anyway? Well, what struck me is that when I read the story is that I saw the same thing with Buddy. It might not have even been the same horsefly. I can't even remember if it was the state fair in Texas or OK, but I saw it. Someone mentioned that Shane's speed would bother Buddy. I think Buddy's methodical speed would bother Shane. I am not saying he is slow, but he is methodical. You get a bad feeling when, all other skills being equal, the other guy is experienced and more methodical. I saw this when Dennis Hatch was playing Buddy Hall in Olathe. Hatch got upset at the speed and it didn't get any better for him. I learned this from watching Buddy. As long as your opponent believes you are equal in skill, if you can get the idea into his head that you are more methodical, he may start to feel the pressure. I like Shane, too, but I cannot pick him over Buddy Hall. Coin flip at best.
Remember the story in one of Eddie Robin's books about how Buddy Hall was doing an exhibition at a state fair and a big horsefly landed on his face but he stayed down on the shot anyway? Well, what struck me is that when I read the story is that I saw the same thing with Buddy. It might not have even been the same horsefly. I can't even remember if it was the state fair in Texas or OK, but I saw it. Someone mentioned that Shane's speed would bother Buddy. I think Buddy's methodical speed would bother Shane. I am not saying he is slow, but he is methodical. You get a bad feeling when, all other skills being equal, the other guy is experienced and more methodical. I saw this when Dennis Hatch was playing Buddy Hall in Olathe. Hatch got upset at the speed and it didn't get any better for him. I learned this from watching Buddy. As long as your opponent believes you are equal in skill, if you can get the idea into his head that you are more methodical, he may start to feel the pressure. I like Shane, too, but I cannot pick him over Buddy Hall. Coin flip at best.
No offense taken. If I came off disrespectfull I appologize. One thing about the sponsors and the backers is there were many backers in the old days and there are many now, but the word when Shane played Alex race to 40 for 15k Shane bet his own. I have also heard Shane usually at least has some of his own bet any time he plays. I respect your opinion. I just have a different opinion. That is why people gamble though, because they believe different things. Have a nice day and hope I didnt offend anybody. I was just giving my opinion.
10-ball: Shane
9-ball: Buddy (but Shanes gaining on him)
Both matches would depend on the effectiveness of the breaks, SVB hands down in 10-ball, if Buddy's break was working in 9-ball I would choose Buddy in his prime, he was scary good... but SVB is gaining on Buddy's best.
Dave
9-ball: Buddy (but Shanes gaining on him)
Both matches would depend on the effectiveness of the breaks, SVB hands down in 10-ball, if Buddy's break was working in 9-ball I would choose Buddy in his prime, he was scary good... but SVB is gaining on Buddy's best.
Dave
As mentioned, Buddy took it to a prime Efren. Efren. That is all that needs to be said right there.
And gambling today is absolutely nothing compared to the old days. How can someone argue that with a straight face? There used to be multiple people out on the road making a living gambling, which can help you imagine how much back room gambling was going on at pool rooms back then. Today? Please.
And gambling today is absolutely nothing compared to the old days. How can someone argue that with a straight face? There used to be multiple people out on the road making a living gambling, which can help you imagine how much back room gambling was going on at pool rooms back then. Today? Please.
10 Ball
He did take it to Effren and made him play 10ball instead of 9 ball--so dont think Buddy couldnt play 10 ball. Bar table with the regular sized cueball was also a game that he excelled at.
Shane vs Buddy would be a good match--
He did take it to Effren and made him play 10ball instead of 9 ball--so dont think Buddy couldnt play 10 ball. Bar table with the regular sized cueball was also a game that he excelled at.
Shane vs Buddy would be a good match--