Thinking about buying a Room ....

frankncali

frankncali

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Right now I am looking into buying a pool room. I have not owned a room before but have worked and managed a room before. One difference is that this one has liquor and I have only dealt with it on a small basis.

A few questions..

Other than the standard places to investigate is there anything that
you would recommend investigating that I might be missing?
Hidden costs, ways that they are making the $$$ look higher etc.

Its biggest drawback to me is that the tables are horrible and they are listing them in the FFE too high. We are negotiating several different things and this is one of them.
I offered what I thought the FFE is and of course the owner just scoffed.
He has POS tables and thinks they are worth $1000 a piece. I could maybe get $500 for each one but it would take forever. I would love for him to take all or half of them out. Replacement costs however make me want to leave them for a year or so. I think the headache of having to deal with them a year later and install new ones would not be worth it.
The table are home style with leather pockets and are 4x8. I would like
a mix of 9 footers and bar boxes. Perhaps 8 bar tables at least. However
I am not opposed to keeping some of the 8 footers there now just not many. Eventually they would get replaced.

I have read the posts here and there is good sound advice. I am open to listening to anyone and hearing there opinions/thoughts.

The room is large and has 25+ tables. Steady business and needs NO repairs of any kind. Its in really good shape with only minor wear and tear.

Is there any way to check past maintenance?

As an owner do you take a salary?
Is starting a LLC the way to go?

How many months reserve $$$ do you need?

Do you use a payroll software or an accountant?

I am sure I will be around while making this decision. Thanks for any help and hopefully it will all work out. I am well below what the asking price is but I just can not see his $$ amount.
 
frankncali said:
Right now I am looking into buying a pool room. I have not owned a room before but have worked and managed a room before. One difference is that this one has liquor and I have only dealt with it on a small basis.

A few questions..

Other than the standard places to investigate is there anything that
you would recommend investigating that I might be missing?
Hidden costs, ways that they are making the $$$ look higher etc.

Its biggest drawback to me is that the tables are horrible and they are listing them in the FFE too high. We are negotiating several different things and this is one of them.
I offered what I thought the FFE is and of course the owner just scoffed.
He has POS tables and thinks they are worth $1000 a piece. I could maybe get $500 for each one but it would take forever. I would love for him to take all or half of them out. Replacement costs however make me want to leave them for a year or so. I think the headache of having to deal with them a year later and install new ones would not be worth it.
The table are home style with leather pockets and are 4x8. I would like
a mix of 9 footers and bar boxes. Perhaps 8 bar tables at least. However
I am not opposed to keeping some of the 8 footers there now just not many. Eventually they would get replaced.

I have read the posts here and there is good sound advice. I am open to listening to anyone and hearing there opinions/thoughts.

The room is large and has 25+ tables. Steady business and needs NO repairs of any kind. Its in really good shape with only minor wear and tear.

Is there any way to check past maintenance?

As an owner do you take a salary?
Is starting a LLC the way to go?

How many months reserve $$$ do you need?

Do you use a payroll software or an accountant?

I am sure I will be around while making this decision. Thanks for any help and hopefully it will all work out. I am well below what the asking price is but I just can not see his $$ amount.
Click to expand...
As a past business owner I would strongly suggest creating the LLC. It's a minor cost for protecting you personally. I would also suggest talking to an accountant. Taxes can be a b**ch if you're not careful.
 
buzzsaw said:
As a past business owner I would strongly suggest creating the LLC. It's a minor cost for protecting you personally. I would also suggest talking to an accountant. Taxes can be a b**ch if you're not careful.
Click to expand...

Thanks
I plan on a detailed meeting with an accountant but was unsure about doing payroll through one. Anything you suggest I ask in particular?

I will be an owner operator not an absentee owner so I was thinking about doing it myself. There are 8-10 employees.
 
LLC's dont protect you as well as a living trust harder to get your assets in a living trust. Talk to a good laywer and and a person that rates a or judges busineeses they can tell you alot about a business in how it is really doing and where its going high risk or low risk.

Sba loans generaly have someone good at looking at books and rating the business.

Dont be gun shy to talk to some experts.

Craig Herman
 
payroll

i use payroll company they also handle my credit card machine get a discount on credit fees for doing both e-mail hours of employees they take care of rest
 
frankncali said:
Thanks
I plan on a detailed meeting with an accountant but was unsure about doing payroll through one. Anything you suggest I ask in particular?

I will be an owner operator not an absentee owner so I was thinking about doing it myself. There are 8-10 employees.
Click to expand...

Is this room in Burbank?
 
poolplayer2093 said:
open it in stockton ca man. the city's starved for entertainment
Click to expand...


My grandpa used to own a pool hall in Stockton back in the 60's and 70's. The place is still there, but is a total dump these days. I have a little more than 8 years left in the Coast Guard, if Stockton still doesn't have a decent room by then, I am going to be looking to open one up there.

I am heading out there in a couple weeks to check out houses. I know the secret is out and everyone knows Stockton is leading the nation in foreclosures.
 
Even though I am in California right now the room I am looking into is not.

California makes it tough on small businesses. Hard to believe some of these lease prices. AND they find businesses willing to pay them.
 
frankncali said:
Even though I am in California right now the room I am looking into is not.

California makes it tough on small businesses. Hard to believe some of these lease prices. AND they find businesses willing to pay them.
Click to expand...

Yeah California is INSANE when it comes to small biz.

There is a pool hall is Tracey that is in contract, I was just guessing that was the one you were getting. Also there is one for sale in the Lakewood area of south L.A.

I am looking for one in the NY area. (Long Island best). If anyone hears.......
 
P.S. Frankncali,

Who is that woman in your avatar? Is that Christine Aguilera?
All I have to say is : Holy crap.
 
frankncali said:
Right now I am looking into buying a pool room. I have not owned a room before but have worked and managed a room before. One difference is that this one has liquor and I have only dealt with it on a small basis.

A few questions..

Other than the standard places to investigate is there anything that
you would recommend investigating that I might be missing?
Hidden costs, ways that they are making the $$$ look higher etc.

Its biggest drawback to me is that the tables are horrible and they are listing them in the FFE too high. We are negotiating several different things and this is one of them.
I offered what I thought the FFE is and of course the owner just scoffed.
He has POS tables and thinks they are worth $1000 a piece. I could maybe get $500 for each one but it would take forever. I would love for him to take all or half of them out. Replacement costs however make me want to leave them for a year or so. I think the headache of having to deal with them a year later and install new ones would not be worth it.
The table are home style with leather pockets and are 4x8. I would like
a mix of 9 footers and bar boxes. Perhaps 8 bar tables at least. However
I am not opposed to keeping some of the 8 footers there now just not many. Eventually they would get replaced.

I have read the posts here and there is good sound advice. I am open to listening to anyone and hearing there opinions/thoughts.

The room is large and has 25+ tables. Steady business and needs NO repairs of any kind. Its in really good shape with only minor wear and tear.

Is there any way to check past maintenance?

As an owner do you take a salary?
Is starting a LLC the way to go?

How many months reserve $$$ do you need?

Do you use a payroll software or an accountant?

I am sure I will be around while making this decision. Thanks for any help and hopefully it will all work out. I am well below what the asking price is but I just can not see his $$ amount.
Click to expand...


Don't do it!!!!!! Quit while your ahead, unless you are trying to change your life forever!!!!!!!;)
 
manwon said:
Don't do it!!!!!! Quit while your ahead, unless you are trying to change your life forever!!!!!!!;)
Click to expand...


While I might regret it later I would always regret NOT doing it! :D

I intend to be smart about it and not jump off into the deal. If it seems good then I will go into it happily and excited!
 
frankncali said:
While I might regret it later I would always regret NOT doing it! :D

I intend to be smart about it and not jump off into the deal. If it seems good then I will go into it happily and excited!
Click to expand...

Well in that case good luck to you, and I hope it is all you want it to be. Most people have no clue what they are getting into when they open room.

Have you noticed how many rooms are closing Nation wide? IF you haven't check it out and think about it. Many have the same thing in common, the owners are either not able or incapable to change with the times. There have been many threads concerning smoking bans, poker, and many other problems. However, everything is directly do to one's ability to change with the times.

Today to compete with your competition, you must offer much more than in days past. Twenty Years ago a room owner could do OK by just renting tables and offering minimal food and refreshments with nothing else. Now you will go broke trying to attract customers with this alone. What has worked best for me is all of the above plus, retail sales (Pool Cues and accessories) and full cue repair / custom cue building all from the same location. Now what I outlined above will keep you busy even when table rentals are slow due to the season (Summer). But the first thing you must consider is how do you get people to come in and check you out in the first place. The easiest way to do this is by sponsoring pool leagues, now here where I am located there are Many APA and BCA players. These people will buy your merchandise, drink your beer, and keep you busy repairing their cues. In addition keep your room all ages and promote it to the next generation, this way you can make your future customer aware of the pleasure that can had playing pool if only on a recreational basis.

Last, lets talk about location, this should be the driving factor behind your decision. If you are not located in a highly populated area none of the above will work. Even if you are located in a populated area, stay out of the bad area of your location. To draw customers and League players, people must feel safe, not only in your establishment, but also when they park and enter and also when they leave. Stay as close to major roads or highways as possible to make your location easy to find.

I hope this helps, and never forget a single bad comment will go 100 time farther than all the good you do!!!!!
 
manwon said:
Well in that case good luck to you, and I hope it is all you want it to be. Most people have no clue what they are getting into when they open room.

Have you noticed how many rooms are closing Nation wide? IF you haven't check it out and think about it. Many have the same thing in common, the owners are either not able or incapable to change with the times. There have been many threads concerning smoking bans, poker, and many other problems. However, everything is directly do to one's ability to change with the times.

Today to compete with your competition, you must offer much more than in days past. Twenty Years ago a room owner could do OK by just renting tables and offering minimal food and refreshments with nothing else. Now you will go broke trying to attract customers with this alone. What has worked best for me is all of the above plus, retail sales (Pool Cues and accessories) and full cue repair / custom cue building all from the same location. Now what I outlined above will keep you busy even when table rentals are slow due to the season (Summer). But the first thing you must consider is how do you get people to come in and check you out in the first place. The easiest way to do this is by sponsoring pool leagues, now here where I am located there are Many APA and BCA players. These people will buy your merchandise, drink your beer, and keep you busy repairing their cues. In addition keep your room all ages and promote it to the next generation, this way you can make your future customer aware of the pleasure that can had playing pool if only on a recreational basis.

Last, lets talk about location, this should be the driving factor behind your decision. If you are not located in a highly populated area none of the above will work. Even if you are located in a populated area, stay out of the bad area of your location. To draw customers and League players, people must feel safe, not only in your establishment, but also when they park and enter and also when they leave. Stay as close to major roads or highways as possible to make your location easy to find.

I hope this helps, and never forget a single bad comment will go 100 time farther than all the good you do!!!!!
Click to expand...

So manwon does this mean your dream is for sale, or are you in the biz for good, or until the right offer comes along.

As far as California it is as stated very unsmall business unfriendly.
 
Do you have any accounting/business admin. background?

frankncali said:
Thanks
I plan on a detailed meeting with an accountant but was unsure about doing payroll through one. Anything you suggest I ask in particular?

I will be an owner operator not an absentee owner so I was thinking about doing it myself. There are 8-10 employees.
Click to expand...


.....if you don't have any accounting/business administration background then you'll need some type of an accountant. I would suggest finding a local accountant that does monthy write-up work for other small businesses in town to help you get started and, perhaps do your payroll.

We belong to the Washington Restaurant Association which has discounted prices on Credit Card processing and Payroll services too.

The first thing you should do is to ask to see the last 3 to 5 years of financial statements (preferably monthly or quarterly); the next thing would be to ask for their tax returns for the same periods. With a little due diligence you should be able to determine what their normal sales and expenses are from month-to-month and, year-to-year.

If you have no experience with accounting and/or running a business then you better find a local certified public accountant to help you review the financials of the buisness with you -- better to spend a litte time and money now vs not having any money later with lot's of time on your hands :)

Best of luck with your new adventure! ;)
 
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