This is how it should be done

softshot

softshot

Simplify
Silver Member
I totally swiped this link from the straight pool forum. big thanks to TheWizard.

Willie Mosconi vs Fats
in the first portion they play 9 ball but Mosconi insists that it be call-shot and any balls dropped on the break are spotted. If 9-ball was still played that way the whole 10 ball discussion would disappear

I have been saying that 9 ball should be called shot for years and it makes me feel fantastic that the great Willie Mosconi agrees with me.


http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3109100860459966589

The quality is choppy at times but those of us who remember VCR's will remember when one scratch didn't destroy the whole DVD

Sometimes old school is better LOL
 
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the link is bad, probably something about the '...' in the middle. try again?

-s
 
I'm still watching this as I post, but there seems to be a great Analogy between the Mosconi, Fats rivalry, and the arguments I see on this forum all the time.

The Gamblers who are all about the money, if there was no pool they'd gamble on pretty much anything else. like dice.. is there more luck in any game than there is in a game played with dice?

and

The Purists who see the game as a sport of kings who expect it to be all about skill, and wish to remove as much luck as humanly possible.

Is it even possible to unify these two factions??
 
6 and a half minutes in, i can see i'm going to watch the whole 2 and a half hours, right now.

thanks for the link.

-s
 
I love the rule for slop shots that Willie called,

If you don't make the ball you call in the pocket you call. all balls dropped on that shot come up on the spot. Brilliant

What happened to these rules? at what point did someone in charge say "Hey the sloppier the better"

BTW, Willie's 1 ball masse shot at 36:00 is f***ing spectaculer.
 
should we have a separate set of "Mosconi Rules" hey maybe they will use them at the "Mosconi Cup" but I won't hold my breath LOL
 
Anyone notice Willie had a slip stroke?
thnx for the vid .
 
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WOW there is a ton of great footage on this lots of great players

TheWizard deserves all of the credit because I believe (I don't know) that he posted these gems out of his own collection. and if so deserves a great deal of respect for making these available and digitized so they wont be lost to the ravages of time.
 
Softshot, you deserve some type of award for posting this up. This is GOLD! I have been dying to see this "Grudge Match" between them two, but I figured whoever had it had probably forgotten about it. What a pleasant surprise to be able to see this on Google Video. Thanks again, this is great!!!!
 
+1 rep for I've looked for this and only found an expensive taped copy on ebay.. thanks a lot
 
I disagree. Texas express is just fine the way it is. If you want to change something, ban jump cues.
 
Robertduke said:
Great video.. Yeah gota watch it this morning..
Heres the way to play 9 ball..
http://www.gradymathews.com/9ball.html
Click to expand...

Questions:
1. With Grady's rule, it seems you cannot pocket a ball to play safe? Wouldn't it be more strategic to allow a player to pocket a ball to play safe?

2. I think the idea of "if you miss, your opponent can have you shoot again" helps in situation in which you miss and the cue ball ends up in ugly position for your opponent. Do you guys think it is a good idea to use this rule for games like 8 balls too?
 
NervousNovice said:
Questions:
1. With Grady's rule, it seems you cannot pocket a ball to play safe? Wouldn't it be more strategic to allow a player to pocket a ball to play safe?
Click to expand...

IMO, it takes more strategy and execution skills to play safe if you are not allowed to pocket the ball on the safe. If you can pocket the ball, it becomes too easy to play safe in 9-ball because it completely takes the object ball speed out of the equation. You'd only have to hide the cue ball from the next lowest ball which, generally, would be stationary.

In 8-ball, of course, you're allowed to pocket a ball on a safe, but since each player has their own group of balls, the same argument cannot be made as in 9-ball.

2. I think the idea of "if you miss, your opponent can have you shoot again" helps in situation in which you miss and the cue ball ends up in ugly position for your opponent. Do you guys think it is a good idea to use this rule for games like 8 balls too?
Click to expand...

Coincidentally, I tried to come up with some rules that remove some of the luck that people complain about out of 9-ball. I ended up with rules very similar to Grady's, not realizing that he had already been there, done that. The flaw that I had overlooked, was that, if a table can be passed back, it removes the 2-way shot out of the game.

In 9-ball, you may try a tough shot, intending to leave the cue ball where it will be safe on the current ball if you miss, but in a good spot for the next ball if you make it. So this element of strategy would be removed in the effort to reduce some of the luck. It's not worth the trade, IMO.

I don't actually recall using 2-way shots in 8-ball very often, but since each player has their own group in 8-ball, I suppose the pass-back option wouldn't have the same effect on 2-way shots as it does in 9-ball.
 
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