Just wonder what everyone considers a reasonable take for green fees, TD etc. Say at a Joss or Viking type event. When a tournament results are listed, I think many people start adding the money to check. What is good 10,20,30% cut?
Tournament and prize $$
- Thread starter Jason Robichaud
- Start date
Why don't you PM Mike Janis and ask him about the Viking Event, as that is his baby.
I posted in another thread about the Texas State Championship on this topic.
A regional tour in my area pulls out a third of all monies to keep the tour up and running, and they do an outstanding job. It is a great tour, and all of its members love it, love it, love it and keep coming back.
The sponsors of a tour will sometimes donate products for the tour to give to the host pool room, which does help offset some of the losses that host pool room will incur from loss of table time during the event.
Viking and Joss are long-running tours, and in my experience of being at both of them as a spectator, I don't know how the TDs (Mike Janis and Mike Zuglan respectively) do it, weekend after weekend.
There's hotel costs, mailings/postage, long-distance telephone charges, travel expenses, charts, time invested, and end-of-the-year tax preparations of 1099 mailings, dealing with the IRS bullcrap, et cetera. Yep, their time is worth money. Nobody can or should do it for free.
I think the Joss Northeast 9-Ball Tour is exceptional for a couple reasons, one being the payouts.
I like the fact that Mike Zuglan pays out 25 percent of the field. It gives more money to the players who do win. Believe me, traveling to an event and playing for two days, incurring expenses for two or three days, and then to receive $75, as an example, for coming in 15th and/or 16th, as I have seen in some other events, doesn't cut the mustard. I'd rather see that $75 go to the top payouts, and that is how Mike Zuglan does it.
I like seeing 25 percent of the field get paid, as opposed to 3/8ths of the field getting paid, as one example. Others may disagree and like to get that 75 bucks back in their pocket, but some folks like to see HIGHER payouts at the top. Now that there are amateur-only tour events, I agree with this payout structure even more.
So, in sum, I personally think 25 percent is a good number, 25 percent held back to keep the tour running and 25 percent of the field gets a tournament payout. Of course, if I had a staff of more than one running the operation, I might think one-third would be a better number to hold back.
Running these tournaments ain't cheap. Who needs to go to an event and have their match times changed willy nilly because of an incompetent tournament director. This is why they deserve every penny they are paid, to keep the tournaments running smoothly for the competitors. JMHO, FWIW!
JAM
A regional tour in my area pulls out a third of all monies to keep the tour up and running, and they do an outstanding job. It is a great tour, and all of its members love it, love it, love it and keep coming back.
The sponsors of a tour will sometimes donate products for the tour to give to the host pool room, which does help offset some of the losses that host pool room will incur from loss of table time during the event.
Viking and Joss are long-running tours, and in my experience of being at both of them as a spectator, I don't know how the TDs (Mike Janis and Mike Zuglan respectively) do it, weekend after weekend.
There's hotel costs, mailings/postage, long-distance telephone charges, travel expenses, charts, time invested, and end-of-the-year tax preparations of 1099 mailings, dealing with the IRS bullcrap, et cetera. Yep, their time is worth money. Nobody can or should do it for free.
I think the Joss Northeast 9-Ball Tour is exceptional for a couple reasons, one being the payouts.
I like the fact that Mike Zuglan pays out 25 percent of the field. It gives more money to the players who do win. Believe me, traveling to an event and playing for two days, incurring expenses for two or three days, and then to receive $75, as an example, for coming in 15th and/or 16th, as I have seen in some other events, doesn't cut the mustard. I'd rather see that $75 go to the top payouts, and that is how Mike Zuglan does it.
I like seeing 25 percent of the field get paid, as opposed to 3/8ths of the field getting paid, as one example. Others may disagree and like to get that 75 bucks back in their pocket, but some folks like to see HIGHER payouts at the top. Now that there are amateur-only tour events, I agree with this payout structure even more.
So, in sum, I personally think 25 percent is a good number, 25 percent held back to keep the tour running and 25 percent of the field gets a tournament payout. Of course, if I had a staff of more than one running the operation, I might think one-third would be a better number to hold back.
Running these tournaments ain't cheap. Who needs to go to an event and have their match times changed willy nilly because of an incompetent tournament director. This is why they deserve every penny they are paid, to keep the tournaments running smoothly for the competitors. JMHO, FWIW!
JAM
After reading the Texas event thread, I wanted to know what was considered a good cut. The Joss and Viking tours area a total different animal. I had the pleasure of playing 3 Joss events and to say I enjoyed them would be an understatement. I would like to play a Viking event someday. From the posts on AZ Mike looks to be expanding and promoting pool more than anyone at the moment.
I was looking more for these yearly events that get questioned. Would they be better off charging $100 instead of $125 with losing player to pay table time? If the hourly rate is $10, then $25 per person is 2.5 hours for every player. Taking the 128 player field x 2.5 hours thats 320 hours of pool over two days. I have been in some rooms that wouldn't have 320 hours of table time is a week, but they still want $25 green fees. They make more in 2 days than what they normally do in a week.
I personally don't mind paying entry and then table time instead of green fees. I am in a tournament to compete and maybe win money. If I practice and pay table time, I don't mind playing a tournament and doing the same.
By charging table time halls won't lose this revenue, now for the TD. Maybe another option, they should stand behind there skills/name/experience and only take a cut on increased sales. If some of these guys are so good, then take a risk like the players. Take 20% of the sales increase instead. This way they would promote, call, go door to door, or what ever it takes to get players at the event. This way if they make $5000, $10,000 or event $20,000 I would say they earned it.
I was looking more for these yearly events that get questioned. Would they be better off charging $100 instead of $125 with losing player to pay table time? If the hourly rate is $10, then $25 per person is 2.5 hours for every player. Taking the 128 player field x 2.5 hours thats 320 hours of pool over two days. I have been in some rooms that wouldn't have 320 hours of table time is a week, but they still want $25 green fees. They make more in 2 days than what they normally do in a week.
I personally don't mind paying entry and then table time instead of green fees. I am in a tournament to compete and maybe win money. If I practice and pay table time, I don't mind playing a tournament and doing the same.
By charging table time halls won't lose this revenue, now for the TD. Maybe another option, they should stand behind there skills/name/experience and only take a cut on increased sales. If some of these guys are so good, then take a risk like the players. Take 20% of the sales increase instead. This way they would promote, call, go door to door, or what ever it takes to get players at the event. This way if they make $5000, $10,000 or event $20,000 I would say they earned it.
$7 to $10 per player & per day.Jason Robichaud said:
The Arizona Desert Classic Tour does not keep any money. Our TD does it for free and we all donate our time on the weekends for a great tour. All of the money is paid out to the top 25% of the field. However, i can certainly see why about 25% should be held back to keep the tour up and running. Live and learn i guess.
Dennis
www.desertclassictour.com
Dennis
www.desertclassictour.com
Jason Robichaud said:
Glad you enjoyed playing on the Joss Tour. Those of us in the Northeast have supported Mike for many years. Things aren't quite the same. Lots of rooms closing. Lots of "amateur" tours springing up.
Mike runs a fair and impartial tour. No ranking, no seeding players. The year end tour championship tournament at the Turning Stone is in name only. No money is withheld from the prize fund at each stop and added to the final event. Mike offers tour memberships each year. You may join and play in one event for $10. Slightly higher for the whole schedule. He pays 25% of the field at every event. If a player auction is held, he shares a small fee with the room owner. The cost of securing a date on the schedule is offset to the room owner with the support from the sponsors of the tour in free goods. No one does it better for the player!
Lyn
We just ran a local tourney, $50 entry 100 percent payout ran a fifty fifty for TD, room owners were happy for the extra business.
THe New Green Room Dundalk MD.
THe New Green Room Dundalk MD.
We appreciate your membership. You still have a couple of events to get in to qualify for the championship.BVal said:
Dennis
www.desertclassictour.com