(Un)Luck of the Draw at Valley Forge!!

Bayawak

Bayawak

Tirador
Silver Member
As an avid pool aficionado, I have been to countless pro tournaments here and abroad. The majority of these tournaments are held and presented with integrity and honesty by the promoters of the events.

The best players usually, and I say "usually", will win the event. But, if the players are railroaded in their draws, the outcome becomes totally different!!

The Gabriels Open at Valley Forge comes to mind. At the opening round, two Filipino players were pitted against each other. I really believe that this is so transparent that they try to eliminate these two fine players at the onset of the competition.

John Schmidt played against two weak players whom he can spot a lot of weight. Several other champions were matched against a lot of other weaker players who virtually had no chance of beating them. We understand that they want to put up a good show but not to the expense of these players who they consider as "cannon-fodders".

Please keep in mind that these are the players who support and always play in these tournaments. Without the attendance and support of these players, these tournaments will not stay afloat.

Let us keep these tournaments fair and let the dice lay where they fall!!

Bayawak aka Tirador!!
 
Don't forget your tinfoil hat.

tinfoilhat.jpg
 
Was this tournament supposed to be seeded? if not then how do you know the dice didn't fall where they fell?
 
I don't understand what you are saying exactly. Are you saying that the draws at the VF tourney are fixed? I highly doubt that.

BVal
 
??

I thought Immonen was European.



Seriously, what would you think about the situation if you knew for a fact that the organizers had looked at the draw and decided to split up Gabica and Kiamco because to not do so would look, um... peculiar?

The law of averages says that at some point, if they keep entering the same tournaments, they're going to meet in an early round. Might as well be at Valley Forge.
 
In a million years I don't think the Valley Forge organizers would ever allow this to happen on purpose. They have way too much to lose. I once drove to Indy with 2 friends for a tournament. A little over 100 players. I draw 1 buddy first and if my other friend had won, I would have played him next. Funny thing is, I watched the draw. Sometimes things like this just happen.
 
Slider said:
I thought Immonen was European.



Seriously, what would you think about the situation if you knew for a fact that the organizers had looked at the draw and decided to split up Gabica and Kiamco because to not do so would look, um... peculiar?

The law of averages says that at some point, if they keep entering the same tournaments, they're going to meet in an early round. Might as well be at Valley Forge.
Click to expand...


I think he is referring to this match Warren Kiamco vs Antonio Gabica in the first round .

Bayawak aka Tirador just got a taste of sour grapes
 
My wife and I have played in well over a hundred tournaments together and out of all those times we have ended up playing each other 6 times. Out of those 6 times, 2 of them were the first match. She is currently leading the series 4-2. I have never seen a tournament rigged in all my years of playing pool and I don't figure I will. Bayawak, sounds like you are just a whiner.

BVal
 
This is really insulting. MOD, please delete this offensive thread.

Sounds like a paranoid conspiracy flake on steriods, who had part of the action, went 2 & out and had to watch his investment go down the drain. That's pool. Get over it.

But please don't post your absurd theories about a conspiracy against Fillipino players. It's an insult to the TD and the entire Industry.

-von
 
BVal said:
My wife and I have played in well over a hundred tournaments together and out of all those times we have ended up playing each other 6 times. Out of those 6 times, 2 of them were the first match. She is currently leading the series 4-2. I have never seen a tournament rigged in all my years of playing pool and I don't figure I will. Bayawak, sounds like you are just a whiner.

BVal
Click to expand...

BVal,

That's why the title is (un)luck of the draw. And yes, you are right, these things happen, and yeah, I could just be whining for now, and yet you could not help but wonder.... And that is what we are, just wondering...
 
Bayawak said:
BVal,

That's why the title is (un)luck of the draw. And yes, you are right, these things happen, and yeah, I could just be whining for now, and yet you could not help but wonder.... And that is what we are, just wondering...
Click to expand...
Bayawak... it may seem like a subtle difference... but, imo, you are inferring that the draw was rigged/fixed in your original post... not just wondering... fwiw.
 
VonRhett said:
This is really insulting. MOD, please delete this offensive thread.

Sounds like a paranoid conspiracy flake on steriods, who had part of the action, went 2 & out and had to watch his investment go down the drain. That's pool. Get over it.

But please don't post your absurd theories about a conspiracy against Fillipino players. It's an insult to the TD and the entire Industry.

-von
Click to expand...

While I think that Bayawak is mistaken, I believe he should have the right to post what he thinks. As a bay area resident you are, or should be aware of the USPPA having just such problems, in your area. There's another recent thread on the incidents. Telling people to be quiet or delete a thread, because they are thinking something you don't like is much more offensive, at least to me, that what someone might honestly think.

Again, I believe that he is mistaken. I, too, have been matched with my best friend on several occasions. Its not intentional, just the way things fall sometimes, as they fell well for Warren in Reno.
 
I drew the only pro in a tournament in Tampa three weeks in a row. I was right there during the draws. So yes it can happen. Johnnyt
 
Johnnyt said:
I drew the only pro in a tournament in Tampa three weeks in a row. I was right there during the draws. So yes it can happen. Johnnyt
Click to expand...

In the last 2 big one-pocket tournaments here in L.A., that Efren was in, I was his opponent in his first match. I knew those Filipinos were rigging the draws. LOL
 
Bayawak said:
BVal,

That's why the title is (un)luck of the draw. And yes, you are right, these things happen, and yeah, I could just be whining for now, and yet you could not help but wonder.... And that is what we are, just wondering...
Click to expand...
What is there to wonder about? It is what it is. Your title says (un)luck of the draw, but everything in your post inferred to the draw being rigged or fixed against certain players. That is the part I have a problem with. It is not just saying how unlucky it is or was that two people matched up in the first round, it is saying that it is so clear that they are trying to knock them out of the tourney early. Also, I agree with the other person that said he should be able to post anything he wants. He has every right to. Just like I have every right to respond.

BVal
 
Bayawak said:
As an avid pool aficionado, I have been to countless pro tournaments here and abroad. The majority of these tournaments are held and presented with integrity and honesty by the promoters of the events.

The best players usually, and I say "usually", will win the event. But, if the players are railroaded in their draws, the outcome becomes totally different!!

The Gabriels Open at Valley Forge comes to mind. At the opening round, two Filipino players were pitted against each other. I really believe that this is so transparent that they try to eliminate these two fine players at the onset of the competition.

John Schmidt played against two weak players whom he can spot a lot of weight. Several other champions were matched against a lot of other weaker players who virtually had no chance of beating them. We understand that they want to put up a good show but not to the expense of these players who they consider as "cannon-fodders".

Please keep in mind that these are the players who support and always play in these tournaments. Without the attendance and support of these players, these tournaments will not stay afloat.

Let us keep these tournaments fair and let the dice lay where they fall!!

Bayawak aka Tirador!!
Click to expand...

Yes, you are right, and look what they did to poor Santos (another Filipino) who got shafted and went 2 and out and he had to play Shin Park on the loser side (I'm sure they rigged that too, why couldn't he have gotten an American). I am sure they rigged the tables too, and the balls, and the starting times to work against the Filipinos. Yes you are right they are always getting shafted, no wonder they never win any tournaments.
 
You're wondering why Gabica and Kiamco was matched too early.. Why not wonder about the many times that they weren't matched that early?
 
You misunderstood me. It was not insulting to me on a personal level because I have no connection or affiliation to the situation --- other than being a fellow pool enthusiast. It's an insult to the sport.

And had he just "moaned & groaned", hey, no problems!

But to paraphrase, he stated that the TD fixed the draw, and that has no place in this forum or any other.

"two Filipino players were pitted against each other. I really believe that this is so transparent that they try to eliminate these two fine players at the onset of the competition."

I don't know of a similar occurance in the USPPA, at least not around here. Tony has never "fixed a draw", and I would strongly defend him if someone accused him of fixing the draw so 2 players from a specific country were "pitted against each other".

There were problems in Reno, and Bob/Memo has been barred from the USPPA for fixing score sheets (which occured before Reno) But that was at weekly tourny in Campbell, not a National event like VF.

The OP didn't "infer" anything. He wrote that these 2 Filipino players were "railroaded" for the purpose of eliminating them as strong competition. At Valley Forge?

If you don't dind that insulting, as a pool player, then I respectably suggest you evaluate your values and those of this sport.

-von



Deadon said:
While I think that Bayawak is mistaken, I believe he should have the right to post what he thinks. As a bay area resident you are, or should be aware of the USPPA having just such problems, in your area. There's another recent thread on the incidents. Telling people to be quiet or delete a thread, because they are thinking something you don't like is much more offensive, at least to me, that what someone might honestly think.

Again, I believe that he is mistaken. I, too, have been matched with my best friend on several occasions. Its not intentional, just the way things fall sometimes, as they fell well for Warren in Reno.
Click to expand...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top