Weird BIH / Cue Ball Fouls Only situation....

dirtypool40

I love this freakin' game
Silver Member
Came up today, first time I've ever seen it.

$10 local tourney. Cue ball fouls only, only the 9 spots.

I'm hooked.

I kick at and make a legal hit on the ball.

While I am watching it roll another ball hits my stick, and goes in the pocket.

I DID NOT FOUL THE CUE BALL.

But, honestly, I didn't feel I should get to keep shooting (I had shape), but wasn't sure of the call.

Is this BIH for my opponent?

Do I shoot from where they came to rest?

Does he shoot from where they came to rest?

I went to ask the TD, and he had no idea, but ended up saying FOUL!!! and gave my opponent BIH.

What say you?
 
I wouldn't of called BIH. The player would play the CB where it sits and the pocketed ball would stay pocketed as per the rules of 9ball only being pocketed.

On a side note I would also rule that if anything similar were to happen (same thing your you just hit another ball with your stick) you would be disqualified and if you had beat that guy he would take your place.
 
gunzby said:
I wouldn't of called BIH. The player would play the CB where it sits and the pocketed ball would stay pocketed as per the rules of 9ball only being pocketed.

On a side note I would also rule that if anything similar were to happen (same thing your you just hit another ball with your stick) you would be disqualified and if you had beat that guy he would take your place.

Which player?


And WHY would I be Dq'd? Nothing un-sportsman-like happened.

There was no cue ball foul.

Ever stand up off a shot and as the balls are rolling touch an objet ball? I have, quite a few times. Not as a habit, and that's not the point of this thread, but it has happened.

It just never made a difference, no ball ever fell before.

I can see it being my opponent's turn, as I did not legally pocket a ball, but I disagree with the TD's BIH call.

interesting case though, huh?
 
The other player would be at the table without BIH
The warning would be for you. Consider me being a ref I wouldn't know whether or not it was without a doubt intentional so I would put a DQ clause into it just in case.
 
The TD got it wrong considering that it was CB fouls only. By this reason you knocked in a ball with your stick and not the CB or OB so you didn't foul. You also didn't legally make a ball either. This is why I say the opponent comes to the table without BIH.

The reason why I say there would be a DQ clause is because I am putting myself in a ref's shoes. Even if I did know you I also know that money makes people twitch just as much as winning so unless I could climb inside your head and prove it without a doubt I would put that there just in case.
 
Um...unless I am not understanding

If you interfere with a ball in motion.....it is a foul and possibly a forfeit of the rack.

If you move a ball on accident during a stroke and the ball does not contact any ball in motion nor would it have contacted a ball in motion had it not been moved, then there is no foul. The non-shooting player has the option of leaving the balls as they lay, or returning the balls to their original layout. This would include accidentally pocketed balls.

If you move a ball accidentally and the ball interferes with another ball in motion or it would have interfered had it not been moved, it is a foul.
 
I agree with Drew.

Cue ball fouls only does not mean that is the ONLY way to foul. It only means that if you accidentally touch other balls (with your hair, shirt, etc...) before you shoot it's not a foul.

I would also give your opponent BIH for interfering with a moving ball.
 
dolphins1972 said:
The rule is on cue ball foul only if you hit another ball your opponent has the option to put ball where he believed it was or leave it where it is.

Unless you hit it while it was in motion.
 
IF you?re playing by current BCA Pool League rules and working with the information given, the rules are clear:

1.33 Disturbed Balls (Cue Ball Fouls Only) (AR)
1. It is not a foul to accidentally touch or disturb a single object ball, with any part of your body, clothing or equipment, unless the accidental movement has an effect on the outcome of the shot. 31
2. "Effect on the outcome of the shot" means that either the disturbed ball makes contact with any ball set in motion as a result of the shot, or that the base of any ball set in motion as a result of the shot passes through the area originally occupied by the disturbed ball. That area is defined as a circle approximately seven inches in diameter centered on the position originally occupied by the disturbed ball (see Diagram 7).
3. If there is no effect on the outcome of the shot, your opponent has the option to leave the disturbed ball in position or restore it to its original location on the table. If the disturbed ball is to be restored, a referee may restore it, your opponent may restore it, or you may restore it with your opponent?s permission. If you touch or restore the disturbed ball without your opponent's permission it is a foul.
4. It is a foul if there is an effect on the outcome of the shot. Your opponent is awarded penalties in accordance with the General Rules and specific game rules and has no restoration option.
5. If you accidentally move a single object ball, and in the same shot commit a foul that is not related to the disturbed ball, your opponent is awarded the penalty for the foul and also has the restoration option for the disturbed ball that was not involved in the foul.
6. If a disturbed ball falls into a pocket with no effect on the outcome of the shot, your opponent has the restoration option. However, if the disturbed ball is designated by specific game rules as the game winning ball, it must be restored.
7. It is a foul if you disturb more than one object ball.
8. It is a foul if a disturbed ball contacts any other ball.

GENERAL RULES
Also:

General Discussion: ?Outcome of the shot? is considered to only mean the action of the balls on the table as a result of the immediate shot, and has no relation to the ending position of the table or any effect the ending position may have on the desires, strategy or intentions of the offended player.
The effect of the above statement is that, while extremely rare, it is possible that a foul may be committed under Rule 1.33.4 that results in the offended player being left in an undesirable position. While considering the effects of the rule, the BCAPL decided that the possibility of such an event was outweighed by the offended player (in most games) having ball in hand and the strategic advantages that are inherent with it.
If it can be determined that an offending player deliberately created a situation that was detrimental to the offended player by abusing the provisions of Rule 1.33.4, it may be considered to be unsportsmanlike conduct and the offended player may be awarded a remedy to counteract the offense.
1. Situation: Player A accidentally moves an object ball while establishing their bridge. Then, while standing up off the shot to resolve the situation, Player A again accidentally touches or moves the same object ball.
Ruling: (a) The second or subsequent accidental touches are considered to be a single act. Player B may elect options in accordance with Rule 1.33.3.
2. Situation: Player A accidentally disturbs an object ball and, while the disturbed ball is still in motion, touches it or picks it up to replace it.
Ruling: Foul. In addition, it is a violation of Rule 1.40(c). Penalties in accordance with Rule 1.33.3, 1.40 and specific game rules. The disturbed ball must be restored.
 
Did I miss it? Where is the answer to the OP's question? He disturbed a ball that was already in motion.
 
He didnt disturb a moving ball

easy-e said:
Did I miss it? Where is the answer to the OP's question? He disturbed a ball that was already in motion.


This is an easy call. Your oppenent can either replace the ball you knocked in with your cue or leave it down and shoot. Just because you pocketed it when you moved it doesn't change the rule. I'm sure if I was your opponent I would look at the table and see if it made sense for me to leave it down or bring it back up.
 
Read the OP (original post) in bold.

Does that not mean that the ball was rolling and hit his stick?

Steve

dirtypool40 said:
Came up today, first time I've ever seen it.

$10 local tourney. Cue ball fouls only, only the 9 spots.

I'm hooked.

I kick at and make a legal hit on the ball.

While I am watching it roll another ball hits my stick, and goes in the pocket.

I DID NOT FOUL THE CUE BALL.

But, honestly, I didn't feel I should get to keep shooting (I had shape), but wasn't sure of the call.

Is this BIH for my opponent?

Do I shoot from where they came to rest?

Does he shoot from where they came to rest?

I went to ask the TD, and he had no idea, but ended up saying FOUL!!! and gave my opponent BIH.

What say you?
 
The statement "While I am watching it roll another ball hits my stick, and goes in the pocket." suggest that the disturbed ball was in motion. My main questions would be did the accidental movement have an effect on the outcome of the shot and was the movement accidental or on purpose? One must have this information to make an accurate call.
 
Wow

bookersman said:
The statement "While I am watching it roll another ball hits my stick, and goes in the pocket." suggest that the disturbed ball was in motion. My main questions would be did the accidental movement have an effect on the outcome of the shot and was the movement accidental or on purpose? One must have this information to make an accurate call.


That isnt what I got out of the post. I thought he meant he hit a ball with his cue when he was admiring his good hit. If the ball was in motion it is a foul period. If the ball wasn't in motion my pervious post is accurate.
 
bookersman said:
The statement "While I am watching it roll another ball hits my stick, and goes in the pocket." suggest that the disturbed ball was in motion. My main questions would be did the accidental movement have an effect on the outcome of the shot and was the movement accidental or on purpose? One must have this information to make an accurate call.

Perhaps the OP will come back on and make this more clear.

But it the meantime it appears that a ball was set in motion as the result of a legal shot and the the direction of that ball was changed, by the players stick, resulting in that ball going into a pocket.

Is there a section in the rules regarding interference of balls in motion?

Steve
 
"...another ball hits my stick" In order for the ball to hit his/her cue, it would have to be in motion. The ball being in motion does not make it an automatic foul if your playing by BCA Pool League rules.
 
???

bookersman said:
"...another ball hits my stick" In order for the ball to hit his/her cue, it would have to be in motion. The ball being in motion does not make it an automatic foul if your playing by BCA Pool League rules.


If you touch a ball in motion it has to be a foul. How can it be anything else?
Please explain. Thanks
 
This Was BCA 9 Ball?

The ball that dropped in a pocket stays down since it wasn't the 9 ball and it's BIH to the non fouling player since the ball was in motion when it hit the stick.
 
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