What age did the pros start playing?

C

Crispy Fish

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
The thread about the 9 year old who qualified in Reno, and knowing a bit about the childhoods of, for instance, Mosconi and Reyes, makes me wonder how many of the top pool players started shooting at a young age.

Or, looking at it another way, is it possible to get to the top of the game starting in your mid-twenties, or even later? It seems like the kind of game where that would be possible, but probably a much greater challenge...
 
Evan Broxmeyer who has been in the top 32 of the UPA rankings for a year and a half started playing pool in the year 2000. Now he is 27 and a professional pool player. I am sure many of you also read this in Inside Pool as I did.
 
My dad started playing at somewhere around 7 or 10 (i cant remember which). The first time he played, he ran 10 balls while his father and uncle watched. After that, they got him a pool table in the basement. The basement was too small for the table, which is why he has that poke-stroke. By age 12, he could run 100 balls. His dad used to take him to the corner pub and play any challengers, i think like 10/20 a game or so (this was the early-mid 60's) At 14, he would match up and play straight pool with some of the best local money players in Elizabeth, NJ at the time and play for money... There's alot more, but I don't remember all the stories :) And, some of the stories get mixed up in my head, so I don't want to tell them wrong, but this is one answer your question...
 
A_junior said:
My dad started playing at somewhere around 7 or 10 (i cant remember which). The first time he played, he ran 10 balls while his father and uncle watched. After that, they got him a pool table in the basement. The basement was too small for the table, which is why he has that poke-stroke. By age 12, he could run 100 balls. His dad used to take him to the corner pub and play any challengers, i think like 10/20 a game or so (this was the early-mid 60's) At 14, he would match up and play straight pool with some of the best local money players in Elizabeth, NJ at the time and play for money... There's alot more, but I don't remember all the stories :) And, some of the stories get mixed up in my head, so I don't want to tell them wrong, but this is one answer your question...
Click to expand...

Is Allen Hopkins your Dad? He told me the same story at a 14.1 tournament in Pennsylvania.....Gerry
 
I don't remember not knowing how to play pool. We had a table before I was born. I never had any formal training, just tons of blissful hours in our basement on a GCI. Later on in life I re-discovered the game at about 22 years old. I believe if someone would have showed me the ropes when I was a kid, I would have been light years ahead of where I was when I started back playing.

I believe with the right training/instructors, good genetics, hand/eye coordination, a player can be at a pro level in 4/5 years......Gerry
 
Crispy Fish said:
The thread about the 9 year old who qualified in Reno, and knowing a bit about the childhoods of, for instance, Mosconi and Reyes, makes me wonder how many of the top pool players started shooting at a young age.

Or, looking at it another way, is it possible to get to the top of the game starting in your mid-twenties, or even later? It seems like the kind of game where that would be possible, but probably a much greater challenge...
Click to expand...

It's been my understanding that a majority of the top players started playing at a young age. I believe Dennis Hatch first started playing when he was 7 years of age if I remember correctly. Other well-known great players that started at young ages would be Tommy Kennedy, Johnny Archer, David Howard, Allen Hopkins, Keith McCready... there are many others too numerous to mention.

In my opinion, it's possible for a person in the late teen to twenty-something age group to become a top player. I don't see it happen very often, but it does happen.
 
A_junior said:
My dad started playing at somewhere around 7 or 10 (i cant remember which). The first time he played, he ran 10 balls while his father and uncle watched. After that, they got him a pool table in the basement. The basement was too small for the table, which is why he has that poke-stroke. By age 12, he could run 100 balls. His dad used to take him to the corner pub and play any challengers, i think like 10/20 a game or so (this was the early-mid 60's) At 14, he would match up and play straight pool with some of the best local money players in Elizabeth, NJ at the time and play for money... There's alot more, but I don't remember all the stories :) And, some of the stories get mixed up in my head, so I don't want to tell them wrong, but this is one answer your question...
Click to expand...

So who were those best local money players Colivito, Margo that era??
Which corner pub? If remember correct I think the kid hosed me.:(
 
Crispy Fish said:
The thread about the 9 year old who qualified in Reno, and knowing a bit about the childhoods of, for instance, Mosconi and Reyes, makes me wonder how many of the top pool players started shooting at a young age.

Or, looking at it another way, is it possible to get to the top of the game starting in your mid-twenties, or even later? It seems like the kind of game where that would be possible, but probably a much greater challenge...
Click to expand...
From what I hear about some of the top pros and local pros, they all started playing at around the age of 10 and started playing pro events in their young 20's. Thats if they didnt get on drugs real bad. So usually playing competively for about 10 years before they became pro. Now I have heard of players taking more than 15 years before they became pro and sometimes players take about 5 years to go pro. That is very rare though. One thing is true though that young players lets say around the age of 10 will take longer to develop than someone who just picked up a cue at about the of 20. They get a faster start and will be better at a young age, but they also will have to mature. That takes a while.
 
Gerry said:
I never had any formal training, just tons of blissful hours in our basement on a GCI. Later on in life I re-discovered the game at about 22 years old. I believe if someone would have showed me the ropes when I was a kid, I would have been light years ahead of where I was when I started back playing.
Click to expand...
That's pretty much my story. We got a table when I was about seven. My father showed me ghost ball, and I was soon a better shot maker than he was. But that was the extent of my father's knowledge of pool, so I didn't have guidance for things like stroke or position. It would've been immensely helpful to have those things ingrained in me when I started.
 
My dad (Ernesto) started at age 8. One thing I have noticed for many pros, is that they also gambled at a very early age. For people like my dad, Efren, Parica, Morro, and many others, gambling was a way of supporting themselves. If they lost they didnt eat. That kind of pressure trained them to play at a higher level. But in the end, most of the pros started very young. I was born with a cue in my hand until age 6. Played basketball for 10yrs, then played pool again for the last 4 yrs. Damn, I wish I never quit!!!:rolleyes:
 
LC3 said:
That's pretty much my story. We got a table when I was about seven. My father showed me ghost ball, and I was soon a better shot maker than he was. But that was the extent of my father's knowledge of pool, so I didn't have guidance for things like stroke or position. It would've been immensely helpful to have those things ingrained in me when I started.
Click to expand...

LC3, I used to live in West Chester, and play at the Billiard club in the strip mall there. What was the owners name?....Denny?....anyway, last time I was there, my picture was still on the wall from a tournamnet I won like 5 years prior. They had the nicest Gold Crowns there!....Gerry
 
LEt's take a look see at this.

If you start at age seven just banging around then it's a disadvantage to start that early. Even if you have someone extremely knowledgable, a lot of the concepts of advanced pool are too complex for a young mind to grasp.

If a young person has a very good teacher and that teacher can work on a lot of the fundamentals from the start and determine at what stages they can understand different aspects of the game, then and only then is it an advantage.

An older person has a better visual acuity and ability to relate visual/ spatially and has a better grasp of advanced concepts like strategy and has had more time and experience with things like chess that can be related.

There has always been and always will be prosigies or exceptions but for the average person that can make it to the pro level it's better to start at an advanced stage. The less they have played the less bad habits they need to overcome.

An example. A friend of mine who is several years younger than me hadn't played much at all before 2003.

I took him to see PHJ and asked him if he wanted to learn to play really good. HE said yes, so I took him to the pool hall and started him on the fundamentals and set him up with some drills.

Over the next few months I started showing him more advanced skills and got him thinking about position play and cueball control.

He is now a Strong A player bordering on A+ he plays leagues and is rated a 9 in APA nineball and a 7 in APA eightball. In only two years with no prior experience with proper instruction he has gotten to that level.

I really don't think that someone who starts at age 7 can be at that level by age 9. Besides, most seven or even up to 14 year olds haven't got the self discipline necesary to take the game to that level. Maybe starting young allows a player to get the confidence and the experience to get their mental game in the right place so that once the skill catches up to the experience, they can get to the right level of mental preparedness, but I can guarantee that starting that young isn't necesary to play the game at a top level.

I personally started very young, at about 8-10 years old, and my dad was an excellent pool player, but I remember him trying to explain concepts to me and I didn't want any part of it, and it took me seven years of serious playing to get to the level that my friend got to in two.

It irks my friend that he still can't beat me and he keeps thinking that he will be able to , which I guess is possible, (but not likely); however, You shouldn't have to play for fifteen or twenty years to get to that level.
 
oops...

Sorry, I forget to mention in my post who my dad was... Gerry is right, my dad is Allen Hopkins..

In my opinion, my dad was destined to be a pool player, he was a natural. To be that good at such a young age is extremely unusual... I'm sure evryone agrees. I'm sure alot of the top pros who started so early had similar stories. I think alot of people may start early, but a lot of them aren't destined to be greats. Its just in their genes. I started early too, but I'm nowhere near a level like my dad, and I never was... It just wasn't my thing... I could learn the game, and I could spend hours practicing and could be a pretty good player, but the game will never come so naturally to me as it did him. I don't think as a 7 year old that the strategies and concepts were so important to him, he could just pocket balls with freakish accuracy for such a young person, and that led him to play more and more.. My uncle has told me that he used to wake up at 3 or 4 in the morning (when he was 6-8 years old) and he would hear the balls clicking in the basement, my dad was probably 12-14 years old and would play all night... I dont know too many kids that disciplined and that "into" anything. Most kids get bored with a game after that long...

Anyway, just my opinion, my dad as well as several other top players are just naturals. Just like Jordan, Woods, etc, some people are just gifted, and with a lot of practice will excel more than others.... I could spend 12 hours a day practicing for the next 10 years, but I still won't have that same "grasp" of the game that my dad and the others do. And a lot of top players are very talented, and can spend hours practicing and will be able to compete, but they are still missing that "edge" that will prevent them from being a top, top player... they will excel and perform at a top level, but they will never become a legend... IMO

Ever see the movie "A Beautiful Mind".. I often imagine my dad and the others as having that ability to see the patterns on the table the same way, they can take one look and know where every ball has to go in an instant... kinda cool :)
 
A_junior said:
Sorry, I forget to mention in my post who my dad was... Gerry is right, my dad is Allen Hopkins..

In my opinion, my dad was destined to be a pool player, he was a natural. To be that good at such a young age is extremely unusual... I'm sure evryone agrees. I'm ,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Ever see the movie "A Beautiful Mind".. I often imagine my dad and the others as having that ability to see the patterns on the table the same way, they can take one look and know where every ball has to go in an instant... kinda cool :)
Click to expand...

"destiny" is the only way to put it, junior.
academia try to analyze it. some people try to rationalize it to give themselves some encouragement. but there's no explanation when people from the same background go in different directions. things in life happen, and people fall by the wayside. for some people, it's like breathing,,,,,they simply must do it. others can love it, but never feel that sense of fulfillment
 
junior, Did'nt you have RUNOUT Sports wear? I used to have a bunch of those t-shirts!................Gerry
 
Jaden said:
If you start at age seven just banging around then it's a disadvantage to start that early. Even if you have someone extremely knowledgable, a lot of the concepts of advanced pool are too complex for a young mind to grasp.

If a young person has a very good teacher and that teacher can work on a lot of the fundamentals from the start and determine at what stages they can understand different aspects of the game, then and only then is it an advantage.

An older person has a better visual acuity and ability to relate visual/ spatially and has a better grasp of advanced concepts like strategy and has had more time and experience with things like chess that can be related.

There has always been and always will be prosigies or exceptions but for the average person that can make it to the pro level it's better to start at an advanced stage. The less they have played the less bad habits they need to overcome.

An example. A friend of mine who is several years younger than me hadn't played much at all before 2003.

I took him to see PHJ and asked him if he wanted to learn to play really good. HE said yes, so I took him to the pool hall and started him on the fundamentals and set him up with some drills.

Over the next few months I started showing him more advanced skills and got him thinking about position play and cueball control.

He is now a Strong A player bordering on A+ he plays leagues and is rated a 9 in APA nineball and a 7 in APA eightball. In only two years with no prior experience with proper instruction he has gotten to that level.

I really don't think that someone who starts at age 7 can be at that level by age 9. Besides, most seven or even up to 14 year olds haven't got the self discipline necesary to take the game to that level. Maybe starting young allows a player to get the confidence and the experience to get their mental game in the right place so that once the skill catches up to the experience, they can get to the right level of mental preparedness, but I can guarantee that starting that young isn't necesary to play the game at a top level.

I personally started very young, at about 8-10 years old, and my dad was an excellent pool player, but I remember him trying to explain concepts to me and I didn't want any part of it, and it took me seven years of serious playing to get to the level that my friend got to in two.

It irks my friend that he still can't beat me and he keeps thinking that he will be able to , which I guess is possible, (but not likely); however, You shouldn't have to play for fifteen or twenty years to get to that level.
Click to expand...

I had the pleasure of meeting and practicing with Austin Murphy at the IPT tourney. Austin is 12 and has a 16 year old brother that plays who is in a wheelchair due to Cerebral Palsy. Austin has a great stroke and dead eye. He needs a little work on patterns and discipline on the table, but if he stays interested, he has the makings of a champion. During the finals with Reyes and Sigel, he watched the first set, but was MIA for the 2nd set. When we asked his dad where Austin was, the answer he gave us? Austin was out in the halls by the escalator playing tag! It is good that he can still be a kid.
 
A_junior said:
Sorry, I forget to mention in my post who my dad was... Gerry is right, my dad is Allen Hopkins..

In my opinion, my dad was destined to be a pool player, he was a natural. To be that good at such a young age is extremely unusual... I'm sure evryone agrees. I'm sure alot of the top pros who started so early had similar stories.

I could spend 12 hours a day practicing for the next 10 years, but I still won't have that same "grasp" of the game that my dad and the others do. And a lot of top players are very talented, and can spend hours practicing and will be able to compete, but they are still missing that "edge" that will prevent them from being a top, top player... they will excel and perform at a top level, but they will never become a legend... IMO

Ever see the movie "A Beautiful Mind".. I often imagine my dad and the others as having that ability to see the patterns on the table the same way, they can take one look and know where every ball has to go in an instant... kinda cool :)
Click to expand...

Ask your dad if he had "natural talent" when he was a kid or was it a "natural desire" to be the best player. I'd almost be willing to bet your dad banged a lot of balls around before he started picking up on skills like ball control and pattern play. You could be a great player one day, you've got two great teachers right at hand. ;)
Now for the grownup thing..... Pay attention in school and do your homework young man....What you wanna be a pool bum or sumthin'!:eek: :p :D :rolleyes:

Terry

PS- is this Beau?
 
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