What if we put an accelerometer inside the balls?

iusedtoberich

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
With new cellphone technologies, a 3 axis accelerometer is less than the size of a dime. And we have bluetooth for wireless data transmission, and we have wireless charging. All of these technologies could potentially allow sensors, battery, and data transmission to be permanently placed inside of the cast of a CB and/or OB during manufacturing.

IF this were technically feasible, what sort of data could we get from the instruments? Would we see the full paths of the balls? How/if they curve (such as the curved banked ball challenge)? Could we see the spin of each ball? Could we measure the difference between a Diamond and GC cushion rebound? Could we see how much the balls are airborne upon impact? Could we accurately measure the cut angles between OB and CB, and how spin and or throw affects it? etc, etc

What type of data could we get, and what could we do with that data, IF it were technically feasible?

Do other sports already have this tecnhology? I'd imagine golf would be the first with all the money in that game.

Thoughts?
 
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iusedtoberich said:
With new cellphone technologies, a 3 axis accelerometer is less than the size of a dime. And we have bluetooth for wireless data transmission, and we have wireless charging. All of these technologies could potentially allow sensors, battery, and data transmission to be permanently placed inside of the cast of a CB and/or OB during manufacturing.

IF this were technically feasible, what sort of data could we get from the instruments? Would we see the full paths of the balls? How/if they curve (such as the curved banked ball challenge)? Could we see the spin of each ball? Could we measure the difference between a Diamond and GC cushion rebound? Could we see how much the balls are airborne upon impact? Could we accurately measure the cut angles between OB and CB, and how spin and or throw affects it? etc, etc

What type of data could we get, and what could we do with that data, IF it were technically feasible?

Do other sports already have this tecnhology? I'd imagine golf would be the first with all the money in that game.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...

Yes. Might be hard to keep the device spherically weighted..
 
iusedtoberich said:
With new cellphone technologies, a 3 axis accelerometer is less than the size of a dime. And we have bluetooth for wireless data transmission, and we have wireless charging. All of these technologies could potentially allow sensors, battery, and data transmission to be permanently placed inside of the cast of a CB and/or OB during manufacturing.

IF this were technically feasible, what sort of data could we get from the instruments? Would we see the full paths of the balls? How/if they curve (such as the curved banked ball challenge)? Could we see the spin of each ball? Could we measure the difference between a Diamond and GC cushion rebound? Could we see how much the balls are airborne upon impact? Could we accurately measure the cut angles between OB and CB, and how spin and or throw affects it? etc, etc

What type of data could we get, and what could we do with that data, IF it were technically feasible?

Do other sports already have this tecnhology? I'd imagine golf would be the first with all the money in that game.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...
You REALLY wanna see just how bad you hit it?? Not me. ;) Not big on information overload. Its made a lot of golfers robotic in their search for perfect mechanics. Some players may want/need all that data but i'm not one of them. To each his own. Hell, i'm still usin' a flip-fone.
 
Will it be able to detect a double hit foul and beep when your opponent fails to call the foul on himself?
Perhaps a one ping mode when a push-out has been made. Maybe the air raid siren sound when break speed goes over 25MPH? Then a low moaning sound when it has caused a skid. The rooster crowing sound when a run-out has been made. A scream sound when a jump shot is attempted. The recorded voice for a scratch in the pocket should be "loser."
 
Buckzapper said:
Will it be able to detect a double hit foul and beep when your opponent fails to call the foul on himself?
Perhaps a one ping mode when a push-out has been made. Maybe the air raid siren sound when break speed goes over 25MPH? Then a low moaning sound when it has caused a skid. The rooster crowing sound when a run-out has been made. A scream sound when a jump shot is attempted. The recorded voice for a scratch in the pocket should be "loser."
Click to expand...

Ha ha, we could call it the "crybaby pool player" :)
 
Soccer"s World Cup ball has had a chip in it for for the last two World Cups I believe.
 
Did someone say vodka?
 

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iusedtoberich said:
With new cellphone technologies, a 3 axis accelerometer is less than the size of a dime. And we have bluetooth for wireless data transmission, and we have wireless charging. All of these technologies could potentially allow sensors, battery, and data transmission to be permanently placed inside of the cast of a CB and/or OB during manufacturing.

IF this were technically feasible, what sort of data could we get from the instruments? Would we see the full paths of the balls? How/if they curve (such as the curved banked ball challenge)? Could we see the spin of each ball? Could we measure the difference between a Diamond and GC cushion rebound? Could we see how much the balls are airborne upon impact? Could we accurately measure the cut angles between OB and CB, and how spin and or throw affects it? etc, etc

What type of data could we get, and what could we do with that data, IF it were technically feasible?

Do other sports already have this tecnhology? I'd imagine golf would be the first with all the money in that game.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...
Someone is already working on something like this but it is primarily with multiple video feeds. In addition, microphones and accelerometers in the cushions can pinpoint the exact time of collisions. It even takes into consideration the time it takes for sound to get from the balls to the microphone. It is integrated into a computer simulation that can replay the shot so you can tell exactly what spin and speed the cue ball started with. Or at least that's the plan. I'm not sure how far it has gotten.

As long as you can follow the location and rotation of each ball, you don't get much additional info from having something in the ball.
 
I would think the math to correct for spin would be interesting. Many devices that employ accelerometers expect only lateral movement. Accounting for the bias of changing spin (one example is a drag shot that goes from backspin to roll) would add a new dimension (:grin:) to the problem of measuring lateral motion.

Dave
 
Bob Jewett said:
Someone is already working on something like this but it is primarily with multiple video feeds. In addition, microphones and accelerometers in the cushions can pinpoint the exact time of collisions. It even takes into consideration the time it takes for sound to get from the balls to the microphone. It is integrated into a computer simulation that can replay the shot so you can tell exactly what spin and speed the cue ball started with. Or at least that's the plan. I'm not sure how far it has gotten.

As long as you can follow the location and rotation of each ball, you don't get much additional info from having something in the ball.
Click to expand...

Interesting. I was thinking about the use of video and tried with my slo-motion setting on my iPhone a few days ago. I'm sure it would work, but at least with the way I was envisioning it, a human would have to draw lines on the video, take measurements, etc. What you are describing seems much more automated.

It seems we definitely have the technology to see what the balls are doing with many different methods. It will come down to who can integrate them into a usable package best. And then, what do you do with the data, ha ha.

I fooled around with the two pool stroke trainer accelerometers on the market today, and while they are fun to use, I found they didn't offer any usable benefit, and were more a short term novelty. IMO of course:)
 
iusedtoberich said:
With new cellphone technologies, a 3 axis accelerometer is less than the size of a dime. And we have bluetooth for wireless data transmission, and we have wireless charging. All of these technologies could potentially allow sensors, battery, and data transmission to be permanently placed inside of the cast of a CB and/or OB during manufacturing.

IF this were technically feasible, what sort of data could we get from the instruments? Would we see the full paths of the balls? How/if they curve (such as the curved banked ball challenge)? Could we see the spin of each ball? Could we measure the difference between a Diamond and GC cushion rebound? Could we see how much the balls are airborne upon impact? Could we accurately measure the cut angles between OB and CB, and how spin and or throw affects it? etc, etc

What type of data could we get, and what could we do with that data, IF it were technically feasible?

Do other sports already have this tecnhology? I'd imagine golf would be the first with all the money in that game.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...

You'd also need 3-axis gyroscopes if you're concerned with spin. Tiny MEMS sensor packages containing both accelerometers and gyros are quite a bit smaller than a dime - about 5mm x 5mm. It could be a bit iffy to get Bluetooth to transmit through the cue ball material.
 
Hell, why stop there. Why not have the cueball send data to a receiver in your fancy carbon shaft then onward to a bluetooth-enabled chip imbedded in your head. I think that's pretty much what happens now naturally but i guess some just can't deal with the fact that we as humans are pretty well equipped to play a game and do it pretty well. Less "tech" and more technique. I think its called "PRACTICE". ;)
 
I'm an Apple fan boy, and was watching their iPhone Xs live introduction even a couple of days ago. They had a new technology, and demoed it with a basketball game developer. You open the app in the phone, set it down, and shoot baskets. It uses the virtual reality stuff combined with the video camera, to draw line on how the ball reached or did not reach the basket. And it calculates 5 or six things important to basketball players, such as the angle the ball left the player's hands, how quickly the player released the ball, etc. They said all that is required is the phone. No sensors in the ball or on the court. It seems something like this could have applications in pool/carom/snooker world. I suppose it would just take a dedicated team to decide it was worth spending the resources on billiard sports.

Here is the direct link to the demo. 59:26 if the link does not work. The segment is about 3min long:

https://youtu.be/wFTmQ27S7OQ?t=3566
 
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To do it really right, in addition to an accelerometer , you'll need a series of three gyroscopes, a clock, and a navigational computer to really do it right.

I don't think it will happen. I think your stroke and talent, in the end, will rule.

All the best,
WW
 
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