what size bleed hole?

poolshooter74

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
i am making a one piece phenolic ferrule and tip and was just wondering what size bleed hole you guys use?

what is the reason why you dont put a bleed hole on the side of the ferrule instead of through the top? (i think this is why my last one broke)

thanks for the input,
louis
 
i am making a one piece phenolic ferrule and tip and was just wondering what size bleed hole you guys use?

what is the reason why you dont put a bleed hole on the side of the ferrule instead of through the top? (i think this is why my last one broke)

thanks for the input,
louis

1/16" hole for me - as to why not not through the side? Umm . . . it would be visible. :shocked2:

HTH

Gary

P.S. You probably already know this, but that ferrule/tip combination is no longer legal in BCA - the other leagues are rumored to be considering the same ruling.
 
1/16" hole for me - as to why not not through the side? Umm . . . it would be visible. :shocked2:

HTH

Gary

P.S. You probably already know this, but that ferrule/tip combination is no longer legal in BCA - the other leagues are rumored to be considering the same ruling.

its a one peice ferrule/tip combo, uni-tip or what ever else it is called, there is no leather tip on it so even on the top it would be visible. do you fill in the hole after the ferrule is installed???:thumbup:

we play VNEA here, where phenolic is still legal.

thank you gary,
louis
 
If it is a one piece, I wouldn't put a hole in it. Just use the correct amount of glue.

Kelly
 
its a one peice ferrule/tip combo, uni-tip or what ever else it is called, there is no leather tip on it so even on the top it would be visible. do you fill in the hole after the ferrule is installed???:thumbup:

we play VNEA here, where phenolic is still legal.

thank you gary,
louis

When it is installed the epoxy will fill the hole and it will not be visible after chalk is applied.
 
You can use a small hole like a 1/16, and usually the epoxy will fill It in, but you don't have to as long as your epoxy gives you the time to slowly screw It on. You can feel the pressure building as You screw It on, just pause and give the pressure time to well down, screw on some more, do the same thing again, etc. until It's all the way on.

Greg
 
its a one peice ferrule/tip combo, uni-tip or what ever else it is called, there is no leather tip on it so even on the top it would be visible. . . . .
louis

Yep, there I go putting the fingers to the keyboard before engaging the brain . . . .

Sorry about that.

Gary
 
I can't even count how many of these I've put on in the last 4 years. Same guys will be back for the change I'm sure. I play ACS. It's not enforced in our league but it is @ Illinois state. I've always done the Ø1/16 through hole. I also leave about .3" of material above the tennon, otherwise it will split. I prefer G-10 to phenolic though. Holds chaulk better and really grips the cue ball.
 
For all break ferrules I prefer the 1/16" hole and leave it full of epoxy. I also cap the top 3/8" minimum on break ferrules. This eliminates the possibility of internal pressure build up being trapped, that has caused so many of these to explode over the years. I am not saying there are no other way to relieve the pressure, but this is the way I have chosen. I now install a tip on the surface, but that is for another thread.
 
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Question for those who dont drill a hole on the one piece phenolic ferrules... Do you use the same technique on standard capped ferrules with leather tips? If not, why not?
 
Question for those who dont drill a hole on the one piece phenolic ferrules... Do you use the same technique on standard capped ferrules with leather tips? If not, why not?

I view a glue relief hole in a threaded and capped ferrule as mostly a convenience. It lets you put way more glue in the ferrule than what is necessary and quickly screw/slip the ferrule on and wipe off the excess. For a threaded ferrule, if you thread it on slow enough, the threads themselves offer some glue relief. If too much glue is used and pressure builds, back it off and start over again. If it threads on and zero pressure builds, one can always back it off and add just a little bit more if one is worried about not filling the void. All that being said, already made threaded ferrules come with a glue relief, and for when I make my own I probably add a relief hole...but I may do it either way.

Drilling a hole in a capped ferrule is going to weaken it. For a traditional install that gets a leather tip, it probably doesn't matter. I have seen enough side blow outs on 1 piece phenolics that I just wouldn't drill a hole. Of course, if one uses epoxy, maybe the epoxy is stronger than the ferrule material? But, I tend to use wood glue for threaded ferrules, so a glue relief for a 1 piece threaded phenolic ferrule/tip just doesn't fit for me.

Also, I prefer the material contacting the cue ball to be all the same material, not a combination of different materials. This is just a feeling though, it may not matter.

Kelly
 
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I guess There's a first time for everything, but I have done them with & without a hole, and I must have been lucky, because I have never had a phenolic ferrule blow out, and I have installed many of them over the last 7 years or so. matter of fact I can't even remember having to replace one that I installed, although I have cut the radius off for customers in order to install a leather tip. About the only type of ferrules that I had crack or split happened after they had some playing time, they were titan and MP with the exception of 1 LBM ferule that cracked while tapping but I think that was due to me drilling the hole too small and the tap spreading it apart. For black one pieces I mostly used linen as opposed to canvas, but I would not think the weave type made a difference in that respect, as I used canvas in the tan color, and had no cracks with those either. With those types of one piece ferrules though I may use a 1/32 instead of a 1/16 when I were to drill for relief. I do use epoxy with those. Standard capped ferules with leather tips I have used both epoxy and Titebond, and It seems that any that had cracked were not the ones I used epoxy on, although one of them could have been, and I just don't remember now thinking back. Not saying that made it stronger because I really have no way of knowing that for sure other then speculation in thinking that epoxy may be stronger, and what I have seen with mine. That doesn't necessarily make It so though. That's a really high impact area, so there are several forces at work there as well as many variables.

I would not argue that just because something has not happened to me yet that It wouldn't or couldn't. Obviously that would not be true, and I know enough from seeing repair work over the years, that some things may be explainable, while others may not. keeping in Mind though... although I do not know why, I have not had many hard blowouts,The only One that I can remember being bad enough to actually see during or after an installation was on My 1st or 2nd cue, and that was during the pin installation. It was a snug fit, and I used 5 minute epoxy, so I guess I was afraid of It setting up too quickly, and went in with the pin too fast. I heard a crack, Thought to Myself wth was that, and was not sure what It was until I pulled the cue out of the lathe and saw a dark epoxy line where there was a crack on the side, located where the bottom of the pin was. I Only use slow set epoxy now for installing pins, not only for that reason, but several others too. It has not happened since.

Just a thought, but rpm's and/or type of tooling used could also play roll in problems relating to blowouts, not only the issue I mentioned about the tap, but getting some materials too hot may also weaken them and make them more brittle.

Greg
 
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Hi,

I do the 1/6" hydraulic relief hole thing with G5. I used to cut my tenons with a razor but drilling the hole just makes more sense in the long run.

Rick G
 
I use my cutter to cut a couple tiny grooves down the side of the tenon for glue relief. The 'right' amount of glue is enough to push all the air out of the junction, which requires glue to come out of whatever type of relief you use. If glue doesn't come out, there isn't enough there.
 
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